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Y Cyfarfod Llawn

Plenary

06/11/2019

Cynnwys

Contents

1. Cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth 1. Questions to the Minister for Economy and Transport
2. Cwestiynau i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol a’r Gweinidog Brexit (yn rhinwedd ei gyfrifoldebau fel Gweinidog Brexit) 2. Questions to the Counsel General and Brexit Minister (in respect of his Brexit Minister responsibilities)
3. Dadl o dan Reol Sefydlog 25.15 ar Orchymyn Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006 (Diwygio) 2019—Gorchymyn Adran 109 yn ymwneud â Swyddogion Cofrestru Etholiadol 3. Debate under Standing Order 25.15 on The Government of Wales Act 2006 (Amendment) Order 2019—Section 109 Order relating to Electoral Registration Officers
5. Cwestiynau Amserol 5. Topical Questions
6. Datganiadau 90 Eiliad 6. 90-second Statements
7. Cynnig i amrywio trefn ystyried gwelliannau Cyfnod 3 y Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru) 7. Motion to vary the order of consideration for amendments at Stage 3 of the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill
8. Dadl ar Adroddiad y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon: Hepatitis C: Cynnydd tuag at ei ddileu yng Nghymru 8. Debate on the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee Report: Hepatitis C: Progress towards achieving elimination in Wales
9. Dadl ar Ddeiseb P-05-854—Gwneud hyfforddiant Anabledd Dysgu yn orfodol ar gyfer staff ysbytai 9. Debate on Petition P-05-854—Make Learning Disability training mandatory for hospital staff
10. Dadl Plaid Cymru: Mynediad at Wasanaethau Iechyd 10. Plaid Cymru Debate: Access to Health Services
11. Dadl Plaid Cymru: Rotas Newydd Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Betsi Cadwaladr 11. Plaid Cymru Debate: Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board's New Rotas
12. Cyfnod Pleidleisio 12. Voting Time
13. Dadl Fer: Cofio a pharchu: Pam y dylem ddiogelu cofebion rhyfel yng Nghymru 13. Short Debate: Remembrance and respect: Why we should protect war memorials in Wales

Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 13:30 gyda’r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair. 

The Assembly met at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.

1. Cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth
1. Questions to the Minister for Economy and Transport

Yr eitem gyntaf ar ein hagenda ni y prynhawn yma yw'r cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth, ac rwyf wedi derbyn hysbysiad o dan Reol Sefydlog 12.58 y bydd Dirprwy Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth, Lee Waters, yn ateb y cwestiynau ar ran y Gweinidog y prynhawn yma. Felly, mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf gan David Rees. 

The first item on our agenda this afternoon is questions to the Minister for Economy and Transport, and I have received notification under Standing Order 12.58 that the Deputy Minister for Economy and Transport, Lee Waters, will answer questions on behalf of the Minister this afternoon. Therefore, the first question is from David Rees. 

Gweithwyr Dur Cymru
Welsh Steelworkers

1. Pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i ddiogelu swyddi gweithwyr dur Cymru? OAQ54632

1. What action is the Welsh Government taking to protect the jobs of Welsh steelworkers? OAQ54632

Thank you. The Welsh Government continues to take a cross-Government approach to support the steel industry and protect the jobs of Welsh steelworkers. We have, over the last three years, provided significant investment to support the industry in key areas, including skills development, environmental improvements, and research and development.

Diolch. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i ddefnyddio dull trawslywodraethol i gefnogi'r diwydiant dur a diogelu swyddi gweithwyr dur Cymru. Dros y tair blynedd diwethaf, rydym wedi darparu buddsoddiad sylweddol i gefnogi'r diwydiant mewn meysydd allweddol, gan gynnwys datblygu sgiliau, gwelliannau amgylcheddol, ac ymchwil a datblygu.

Thank you for that answer, Deputy Minister. Unlike the UK Government, which has failed to do anything on behalf of steel, and, I understand, even cancelled the latest steel council meeting, which was crucial because there's not one been held for 18 months, and they still haven't got one going—. They've also failed to actually produce an industrial strategy for the steel sector, and they've not even looked at tackling the issues of the equal playing field, particularly in energy costs, that we will need to have when we face a competitive global market in the steel sector.

I know that the Welsh Government, as you quite rightly pointed out, has been very active in supporting this industry and has been at the forefront, particularly for Welsh steelmakers, to ensure that steel stays at the heart of the Welsh industrial strategy. Can you answer as to whether the conditionality that the Welsh Government has put on some of that financial support to the works at Port Talbot, particularly in relation to the £30 million that was allocated to the Port Talbot works for the power plants, has been met, because the release of that money will allow the next stage of the power plant to progress, including, therefore, better use of waste gas, improvements in environmental standards, and more efficient and effective production, and lower cost because they're producing their own electricity rather than having to buy it off the grid at high costs that the UK Government are not addressing?

Diolch am eich ateb, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Yn wahanol i Lywodraeth y DU, sydd wedi methu gwneud unrhyw beth ar ran dur, ac wedi canslo cyfarfod diweddaraf y cyngor dur yn ôl yr hyn a ddeallaf, a oedd yn hollbwysig gan nad oes un wedi'i gynnal ers 18 mis, ac nid oes ganddynt un o hyd—. Maent hefyd wedi methu cynhyrchu strategaeth ddiwydiannol ar gyfer y sector dur, ac nid ydynt hyd yn oed wedi edrych ar fynd i'r afael â phroblemau mewn perthynas â chyfartalwch, yn enwedig o ran costau ynni, a bydd angen hynny arnom pan fyddwn yn wynebu marchnad fyd-eang gystadleuol yn y sector dur.

Gwn fod Llywodraeth Cymru, fel y nodoch yn hollol gywir, wedi bod yn weithgar iawn wrth gefnogi’r diwydiant hwn ac wedi bod ar flaen y gad, yn enwedig ar ran gwneuthurwyr dur o Gymru, i sicrhau bod dur yn parhau i fod wrth wraidd strategaeth ddiwydiannol Cymru. A allwch ateb p’un a yw'r amodoldeb y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i roi ar rywfaint o'r cymorth ariannol hwnnw i'r gwaith ym Mhort Talbot, yn enwedig mewn perthynas â'r £30 miliwn a ddyrannwyd i waith Port Talbot ar gyfer y gorsafoedd ynni, wedi'i fodloni, gan y bydd darparu’r arian hwnnw'n caniatáu i gam nesaf yr orsaf ynni fynd rhagddo, gan gynnwys, felly, gwell defnydd o nwy gwastraff, gwelliannau o ran safonau amgylcheddol, a chynhyrchiant mwy effeithlon ac effeithiol, a chostau is gan eu bod yn cynhyrchu eu trydan eu hunain yn hytrach na gorfod ei brynu oddi ar y grid am gostau uchel nad yw Llywodraeth y DU yn mynd i’r afael â hwy?

Thank you. I think David Rees has very well summarised there the state of play with the UK Government's absence of leadership on steel and the cancellation of the steel council meeting. We continue to be in close contact with Tata, as we have done for many years. As you noted, in the 2016 steel crisis, we provided £10 million skills funding towards an offer of £12 million towards the development of the workforce of Tata Steel. We've also offered some £666,000 for research and development into new product development. 

In terms of the power plant, we have offered £8 million investment to date, but with the exception of the skills funding, Tata is unable to draw down the funding against these offers until we've agreed the conditions of funding. And, following the announcement in May that the proposed joint venture with Thyssenkrupp would not be going ahead, Tata Steel is now working on a new transformation plan for the company. And in light of these changes, we continue our engagement with the company, including discussions on potential support for the power plant. 

Diolch. Credaf fod David Rees wedi crynhoi’r sefyllfa’n dda iawn o ran diffyg arweinyddiaeth Llywodraeth y DU ar ddur a chanslo cyfarfod y cyngor dur. Rydym yn parhau i fod mewn cysylltiad agos â Tata, fel rydym wedi bod ers blynyddoedd lawer. Fel y nodoch, yn argyfwng dur 2016, darparwyd cyllid sgiliau o £10 miliwn gennym tuag at gynnig o £12 miliwn tuag at ddatblygu gweithlu Tata Steel. Rydym hefyd wedi cynnig tua £666,000 ar gyfer gwaith ymchwil a datblygu ar ddatblygu cynnyrch newydd.

O ran yr orsaf ynni, rydym wedi cynnig buddsoddiad o £8 miliwn hyd yn hyn, ond ac eithrio'r cyllid sgiliau, ni ellir rhoi’r cyllid i Tata yn erbyn y cynigion hyn hyd nes ein bod wedi cytuno ar yr amodau cyllido. Ac yn dilyn y cyhoeddiad ym mis Mai na fyddai'r fenter arfaethedig ar y cyd â Thyssenkrupp yn mynd rhagddi, mae Tata Steel bellach yn gweithio ar gynllun trawsnewid newydd ar gyfer y cwmni. Ac yng ngoleuni'r newidiadau hyn, rydym yn parhau i ymgysylltu â'r cwmni, gan gynnwys trafod cymorth posibl i'r orsaf ynni.

As you are aware, Tata Steel in Shotton is a dynamic business and major exporter, but dependent upon the supply chain for sustainable British steel, and on feedstock from the heavy end in south Wales. On Monday, I received an e-mail, as did other Members representing the area, from Heathrow Airport, announcing that they're one of the 18 shortlisted Heathrow logistic hub sites, inviting them to formally enter the tender process for the Heathrow expansion. In response, your colleague the Minister for the Economy and Transport said he looked forward to continuing Welsh Government's work with the site promoters and the Heathrow team in this selection process. What will the Welsh Government therefore be doing in that context to support Tata, as well as the port in Cardiff—the other shortlisted Welsh bidder—to maximise the opportunities presented by this?

Fel y gwyddoch, mae Tata Steel yn Shotton yn fusnes deinamig ac yn allforiwr pwysig, ond mae'n dibynnu ar y gadwyn gyflenwi am ddur cynaliadwy Prydeinig, ac ar ddefnydd crai o'r pen trwm yn ne Cymru. Ddydd Llun, cefais e-bost, fel y gwnaeth Aelodau eraill sy'n cynrychioli'r ardal, gan Faes Awyr Heathrow, yn cyhoeddi eu bod yn un o'r 18 safle ar y rhestr fer i fod yn hwb logisteg i Heathrow, gan eu gwahodd i wneud cais ffurfiol i’r broses dendro ar gyfer gwaith ehangu Heathrow. Mewn ymateb, dywedodd eich cyd-Aelod, Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth, ei fod yn edrych ymlaen at barhau â gwaith Llywodraeth Cymru gyda hyrwyddwyr y safle a thîm Heathrow yn y broses ddethol hon. Beth fydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud felly yn y cyd-destun hwnnw i gefnogi Tata, yn ogystal â'r porthladd yng Nghaerdydd—y cynigydd arall o Gymru ar y rhestr fer—i wneud y mwyaf o'r cyfleoedd y mae hyn yn eu cynnig?

Well, it's excellent news that they've got through to the next round, and we've supported them all along the way, so we'll continue to offer that support to them. This is an investment that we welcome. If there is going to be this large infrastructure scheme in London, it's only fair that the benefits spread across the UK.

Wel, credaf fod y ffaith eu bod wedi cyrraedd y rownd nesaf yn newyddion gwych, ac rydym wedi eu cefnogi bob cam o’r ffordd, felly byddwn yn parhau i gynnig y gefnogaeth honno iddynt. Mae hwn yn fuddsoddiad rydym yn ei groesawu. Os yw’r cynllun seilwaith mawr hwn am gael ei roi ar waith yn Llundain, nid yw ond yn deg fod y buddion yn cael eu lledaenu ledled y DU.

Minister, the Orb steelworks in Newport should continue in operation, and, with the right level of support from Tata Steel, UK Government and Welsh Government, it would be enabled to produce electrical steels for electric car production in the future. There's a very strong local campaign to keep the Orb works in production, and, indeed, it's been a feature of economic life in Newport since the end of the nineteenth century. Could you reiterate the Welsh Government's support for that, and would you welcome a campaign launched today by the South Wales Argus, which has launched a petition in support of retaining that Orb steelworks plant?

Weinidog, dylai gwaith dur Orb yng Nghasnewydd barhau i weithredu, a chyda'r lefel gywir o gefnogaeth gan Tata Steel, Llywodraeth y DU a Llywodraeth Cymru, byddai'n cael ei alluogi i gynhyrchu duroedd trydanol ar gyfer cynhyrchiant ceir trydan yn y dyfodol. Mae ymgyrch leol gref iawn ar waith i sicrhau bod gwaith Orb yn parhau i weithredu, ac yn wir, mae wedi bod yn un o nodweddion bywyd economaidd yng Nghasnewydd ers diwedd y bedwaredd ganrif ar bymtheg. A allwch ailddatgan cefnogaeth Llywodraeth Cymru i hynny, ac a fyddech yn croesawu ymgyrch a lansiwyd heddiw gan y South Wales Argus, sydd wedi lansio deiseb o blaid cadw gwaith dur Orb?

13:35

Well, I can be very clear to John Griffiths that the Welsh Government does not want the Orb steelworks to close. We've been in discussion with Tata and with Community Union to see what can be done. Tata has continued to state the case that the plant is making substantial losses and there is oversupply in the world market, and they don't feel that there is a viable future. Now, Community Union have commissioned consultants themselves—Sindex—to explore alternatives to closure for Orb, and have created an outline proposal, which indicates that, with Welsh Government funding and a range of other changes by the company, a viable future is possible. We've received a summary of that proposal, and we'll need to understand the detail of it and Tata Steel's response to the recommendations. The First Minister will be meeting Community Union to discuss the proposal, and we'll be making sure that we properly understand what role we can play to give this a viable future.

Wel, gallaf ddweud yn glir iawn wrth John Griffiths nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru am weld gwaith dur Orb yn cau. Rydym wedi bod yn trafod gyda Tata ac Undeb Community i weld beth y gellir ei wneud. Mae Tata wedi parhau i ddadlau bod y gwaith yn gwneud colledion sylweddol a bod gorgyflenwad ym marchnad y byd, ac nad ydynt yn teimlo bod ganddo ddyfodol hyfyw. Nawr, mae Undeb Community wedi comisiynu ymgynghorwyr—Sindex—i archwilio opsiynau eraill yn lle cau Orb, ac wedi creu cynnig amlinellol, sy'n nodi, gyda chyllid Llywodraeth Cymru, ac ystod o newidiadau eraill gan y cwmni, fod dyfodol hyfyw yn bosibl. Rydym wedi derbyn crynodeb o'r cynnig hwnnw, a bydd angen i ni ddeall ei fanylion ac ymateb Tata Steel i'r argymhellion. Bydd y Prif Weinidog yn cyfarfod ag Undeb Community i drafod y cynnig, a byddwn yn sicrhau ein bod yn deall yn iawn pa rôl y gallwn ei chwarae, er mwyn rhoi dyfodol hyfyw i hyn.

Cefnffordd yr A4042 yn Llanelen
The A4042 Trunk Road at Llanellen

2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am fesurau i wella cefnffordd yr A4042 yn Llanelen? OAQ54622

2. Will the Minister provide an update on measures to improve the A4042 trunk road at Llanellen? OAQ54622

Well, there are no immediate plans to improve the A4042 trunk road at Llanellen. The Welsh Government, however, does routinely monitor the performance of the trunk road network.

Wel, nid oes unrhyw gynlluniau uniongyrchol i wella cefnffordd yr A4042 yn Llanelen. Fodd bynnag, mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn monitro perfformiad y rhwydwaith cefnffyrdd yn rheolaidd.

Thank you for that answer, Minister. You will no doubt be aware—or certainly your colleague Ken Skates is aware—of ongoing issues with flooding on the A4042 at Llanellen, particularly at this time of year. The road was closed again during the recent bad weather, causing traffic chaos for commuters. I'm particularly concerned that this route is going to be even more critical when accident and emergency, and other services, transfer from Nevill Hall to the new Grange University Hospital in Cwmbran, when also people from Brecon and Radnorshire and the south of Powys will be dependent on the new hospital as well, as this really could become a matter of life and death with increased journey times. I wonder if you could update us, or set in chain circumstances to update us, on improvements to this stretch of road, whether that be improved drainage, raising the road, or possibly, and probably best in the medium term, or longer term at least, a bypass for the village of Llanellen.

Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog. Mae'n siŵr eich bod yn ymwybodol—neu yn sicr, mae eich cyd-Aelod, Ken Skates, yn ymwybodol—o’r problemau parhaus gyda llifogydd ar yr A4042 yn Llanelen, yn enwedig ar yr adeg hon o'r flwyddyn. Caewyd y ffordd eto yn ystod y tywydd gwael yn ddiweddar, gan achosi anhrefn i gymudwyr o ran traffig. Rwy'n arbennig o bryderus y bydd y llwybr hwn hyd yn oed yn fwy hanfodol pan fydd gwasanaethau damweiniau ac achosion brys, a gwasanaethau eraill, yn symud o Nevill Hall i Ysbyty Athrofaol y Grange yng Nghwmbrân, pan fydd pobl o Frycheiniog a Maesyfed a de Powys hefyd yn ddibynnol ar yr ysbyty newydd, gan y gallai hyn ddod yn fater o fywyd a marwolaeth gyda chynnydd mewn amseroedd teithio. Tybed a allech roi diweddariad i ni, neu sicrhau’r amgylchiadau cywir i roi diweddariad i ni, ar welliannau i'r darn hwn o ffordd, boed hynny'n golygu gwell draenio, codi'r ffordd, neu o bosibl, ac yn ôl pob tebyg yr opsiwn gorau yn y tymor canolig, neu’r tymor hwy o leiaf, ffordd osgoi ar gyfer pentref Llanelen.

Well, as Nick Ramsay knows, this has been a problem for some 20 years or so and there is no simple solution to it. We are acutely aware of the problem and have spent some time investigating potential solutions. He will know that the existing bridge is a grade II listed structure, that it is next to a flood plain, and there is no simple engineering solution that would respect its existing characteristics or do the job within the existing footprint. We are doing what we can, working with local landowners, to maintain the land, to drain the ditches, and the delays when the road is closed are now becoming significantly lessened. There have been occasions when the road has been closed for a week, and I believe the most recent closure was for an hour. So, we are doing a lot to try and mitigate; we can't simply solve it. We are, of course, investing in rail, and the Chepstow service, which currently only gets two trains an hour, will increase capacity from mid December to four trains an hour. So, that's another intervention we're making to help with the situation. But if there's an easy and simple solution the Member has in mind we haven't considered, we'd certainly be willing to look at it.

Wel, fel y gŵyr Nick Ramsay, mae hon wedi bod yn broblem ers tua 20 mlynedd, ac nid oes ateb syml iddi. Rydym yn ymwybodol iawn o'r broblem ac wedi treulio peth amser yn ymchwilio i atebion posibl. Bydd yn ymwybodol fod y bont bresennol yn strwythur rhestredig gradd II, ei bod yn ymyl gorlifdir, ac nad oes ateb peirianyddol syml a fyddai'n parchu ei nodweddion presennol neu'n datrys y broblem o fewn yr ôl troed presennol. Rydym yn gwneud yr hyn a allwn, gan weithio gyda pherchnogion tir lleol, i gynnal a chadw'r tir, i ddraenio'r ffosydd, ac mae'r oedi pan fydd y ffordd ar gau yn mynd yn llai o lawer bellach. Bu achlysuron pan fu'r ffordd ar gau am wythnos, a chredaf mai am awr y bu ar gau y tro diwethaf. Felly rydym yn gwneud llawer i geisio lliniaru’r sefyllfa; nid oes ffordd hawdd o’i datrys. Wrth gwrs, rydym yn buddsoddi mewn rheilffyrdd, a bydd gwasanaeth Cas-gwent, sydd ond yn cael dau drên yr awr ar hyn o bryd, yn cynyddu o ran capasiti o ganol mis Rhagfyr ymlaen, i bedwar trên yr awr. Felly, mae honno’n enghraifft arall o ymyrraeth gennym i helpu gyda'r sefyllfa. Ond os oes gan yr Aelod ateb hawdd a syml mewn golwg nad ydym wedi'i ystyried, byddem yn sicr yn barod i edrych arno.

Cwestiynau Heb Rybudd gan Lefarwyr y Pleidiau
Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

Cwestiynau nawr gan lefarwyr y pleidiau. Llefarydd Plaid Cymru, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Questions now from the party spokespeople. The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Llywydd. One of the last things that Alun Cairns did as Secretary of State for Wales—or the Secretary of State for the west of England, as he had become to be known by many—was to establish the western gateway. Where is the western gateway a gateway to, and for whom?

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Lywydd. Un o'r pethau olaf a wnaeth Alun Cairns fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru—neu Ysgrifennydd Gwladol gorllewin Lloegr, fel roedd llawer yn ei adnabod—oedd sefydlu porth y gorllewin. Porth i ble yw porth y gorllewin, ac i bwy?

Well can I first say that, obviously, Alun Cairns has resigned in the last couple of hours, and I think that was the right thing to do in the circumstances? Clearly, our Government and his Government have had significant differences over a number of issues. But I should say that both Ken Skates and myself have had cordial and professional relationships with Alun Cairns, and, especially on the city deals, we've worked well together, and we certainly wouldn't have wished his time as a Minister to come to an end in this way.

On the question directly posed, it's most unfortunate that the Severnside collaboration has been called 'west Britain' in some of its social media activity. Certainly, that's not designed to get it off to a good start. We are keen, obviously, to look at a forum that can collaborate across the border, just as we do in north Wales with the Mersey Dee Alliance. However, we are sceptical about the intentions behind the setting up of this alliance and giving it, certainly, any institutional character because we fear the UK Government are using this as a Trojan horse to undermine the Welsh Government through whatever comes of the shared prosperity fund. We look forward to seeing if anything comes of the shared prosperity fund. But we are approaching it, I think, with scepticism. The chair that's been appointed, Katherine Bennett, is a very good person and we certainly wouldn't wish to undermine her in any way. This is not a joint appointment, but we certainly would like a conversation with her about how she feels this alliance goes forward, with our concerns in mind. 

Wel, a gaf fi ddweud yn gyntaf, yn amlwg, fod Alun Cairns wedi ymddiswyddo yn ystod yr ychydig oriau diwethaf, a chredaf mai dyna oedd y peth iawn i'w wneud o dan yr amgylchiadau? Yn amlwg, mae ein Llywodraeth a'i Lywodraeth yntau wedi anghytuno ynghylch nifer o faterion. Ond dylwn ddweud bod Ken Skates a minnau wedi cael perthynas dwymgalon a phroffesiynol gydag Alun Cairns, ac yn enwedig ar y bargeinion dinesig, rydym wedi cydweithio'n dda gyda’n gilydd, ac yn sicr, ni fyddem wedi dymuno i'w amser fel Gweinidog ddod i ben fel hyn.

O ran y cwestiwn uniongyrchol, mae'n anffodus iawn fod cydweithrediad Glannau Hafren wedi cael ei alw'n 'orllewin Prydain' yn rhywfaint o'i weithgarwch ar y cyfryngau cymdeithasol. Yn sicr, nid dyna’r cynllun i sicrhau ei fod yn cael dechrau da. Rydym yn awyddus, yn amlwg, i edrych ar fforwm a all gydweithredu dros y ffin, fel y gwnawn yng ngogledd Cymru gyda Cynghrair Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy. Fodd bynnag, rydym yn amheus ynghylch y bwriad y tu ôl i sefydlu'r gynghrair hon, ac yn sicr, ynghylch rhoi unrhyw nodweddion sefydliadol iddi gan ein bod yn ofni bod Llywodraeth y DU yn defnyddio hyn fel ceffyl pren Troea i danseilio Llywodraeth Cymru drwy beth bynnag a ddaw o'r gronfa ffyniant gyffredin. Rydym yn edrych ymlaen at weld a ddaw unrhyw beth o'r gronfa ffyniant gyffredin. Ond credaf ein bod yn ymdrin â hyn gyda pheth amheuaeth. Mae'r cadeirydd a benodwyd, Katherine Bennett, yn unigolyn da iawn ac yn sicr ni fyddem yn dymuno ei thanseilio mewn unrhyw ffordd. Nid apwyntiad ar y cyd mo hwn, ond yn sicr, hoffem gael sgwrs gyda hi ynglŷn â sut y mae'n teimlo y dylai'r gynghrair hon weithredu, gyda'n pryderon mewn golwg.

13:40

Well, Welsh Government, of course, is hailed as a partner in the western gateway project. Within minutes of the launching of the project, the chair that you mentioned referred to 'the powerhouse of the west of Britain'. How do you think that rebranding of Wales as the west of Britain or a part of the west of Britain helps with the work that needs to be done to build a genuine Welsh economy that can then work in genuine partnership with our friends to the east? 

Wel, mae Llywodraeth Cymru, wrth gwrs, yn cael ei galw'n bartner ym mhrosiect porth y gorllewin. O fewn munudau i lansio'r prosiect, cyfeiriodd y cadeirydd y sonioch chi amdani at 'bwerdy gorllewin Prydain'. Sut y credwch fod ail-frandio Cymru yn orllewin Prydain neu ran o orllewin Prydain yn helpu gyda'r gwaith sydd angen ei wneud i adeiladu economi go iawn yng Nghymru a all weithio wedyn mewn partneriaeth go iawn â'n ffrindiau i'r dwyrain?

Well, I happened to speak to Katherine Bennett on the morning that tweet went out and she made clear to me that those were not her words. I suspect the hyperactive office of the aforementioned previous Secretary of State may have had a hand in that, but, I think, putting that to one side, there remains an economic geography there that we want to explore and exploit, but we are a devolved Government, we have a boundary to respect, and we certainly are not going to be naive about the political agendas at play in Westminster around this, but we do want what's best for the people of that part of Wales and our closest neighbours.

Wel, digwyddais siarad â Katherine Bennett ar y bore yr anfonwyd y trydariad hwnnw a dywedodd yn glir wrthyf nad ei geiriau hi oeddent. Rwy’n amau ​​efallai fod gan swyddfa orfywiog y cyn Ysgrifennydd Gwladol y soniwyd amdano gynnau rywbeth i’w wneud â hyn, ond gan roi hynny o'r neilltu am funud, credaf fod daearyddiaeth economaidd yno rydym am ei harchwilio a manteisio arni, ond rydym yn Llywodraeth ddatganoledig, mae gennym ffin i'w pharchu, ac yn sicr, nid ydym am fod yn naïf ynghylch yr agendâu gwleidyddol sydd ar waith yn San Steffan mewn perthynas â hyn, ond rydym eisiau'r gorau i bobl yn y rhan honno o Gymru a'n cymdogion agosaf.

'We remain sceptical', I don't think is good enough when it comes to some of the messaging that I have certainly heard and read around the western gateway project. What we want to see is a Welsh Government that genuinely builds a Welsh economy, and I fear that Welsh Government has been taken for a ride by the Wales Office under Alun Cairns. The Welsh Government has been far too keen, I think, to hang on to the coat-tails of Alun Cairns as Secretary of State for Wales. We know that Welsh Government agreed on the nod to the renaming of the second Severn crossing as the Prince of Wales Bridge, which we know went down like a lead balloon with people in Wales. We know that Welsh Government did have an opportunity to have its say on that issue and decided, for whatever reason, not to, and I fear that when it comes to the western gateway, as well as projects across the border between the north-east of Wales and the north-west of England, that Welsh Government isn't taking its role seriously enough in creating a genuinely strong Welsh economy.

I am a big supporter of cross-border working. Cross-border working works to the mutual benefit of neighbouring countries and regions globally. That is no different for us in Wales. But will the Minister see that as long as we have an impression of a Welsh Government that is going with a begging bowl to those partnership meetings, that doesn't seem to want to be there as a genuine partner, Wales will be undersold by this Welsh Government?

Ni chredaf fod 'rydym yn parhau i fod yn amheus’ yn ddigon da o ran rhai o'r negeseuon rwy’n sicr wedi'u clywed a'u darllen ynglŷn â phrosiect porth y gorllewin. Yr hyn rydym am ei weld yw Llywodraeth Cymru sydd o ddifrif yn adeiladu economi Cymru, ac rwy'n ofni bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cael ei chamarwain gan Swyddfa Cymru o dan Alun Cairns. Credaf fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn llawer rhy awyddus i ddal ei gafael yng nghynffon côt Alun Cairns fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru. Gwyddom fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cytuno i ailenwi'r ail bont Hafren yn Bont Tywysog Cymru, a gwyddom na chroesawyd hynny o gwbl gan bobl Cymru. Gwyddom fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cael cyfle i ddweud ei dweud ar y mater hwnnw a’i bod wedi penderfynu peidio â gwneud hynny am ba reswm bynnag, ac rwy’n ofni, mewn perthynas â phorth y gorllewin, yn ogystal â phrosiectau dros y ffin rhwng gogledd-ddwyrain Cymru a gogledd-orllewin Lloegr, nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru o ddifrif ynglŷn â'i rôl yn creu economi Gymreig wirioneddol gryf.

Rwy'n cefnogi gweithio trawsffiniol yn fawr. Mae gweithio trawsffiniol yn gweithio er budd cyffredin gwledydd a rhanbarthau cyfagos ledled y byd. Nid yw hynny'n wahanol i ni yng Nghymru. Ond a wnaiff y Gweinidog weld, cyhyd â bod gennym ddarlun o Lywodraeth Cymru yn mynd gyda dysgl gardod i'r cyfarfodydd partneriaeth nad yw'n ymddangos ei bod am fod yno fel partner go iawn, y bydd Cymru yn cael ei thanwerthu gan y Llywodraeth hon?

Well, I think that's a little overexcited. I think I would struggle with—[Interruption.]

Wel, credaf fod hynny braidd yn orgynhyrfus. Credaf y buaswn yn cael trafferth gyda—[Torri ar draws.]

I'd like you to get a bit more excited about making use of the Welsh economy. Get excited about—

Hoffwn pe baech ychydig yn fwy cynhyrfus ynglŷn â gwneud defnydd o economi Cymru. Cynhyrfu am—

And I think I would struggle—. I would struggle—[Interruption.] With respect, you've asked your question. Your question is finished. I'm trying to answer it, if you will allow me to.

A chredaf y buaswn yn cael trafferth—. Buaswn yn cael trafferth—[Torri ar draws.] Gyda phob parch, rydych wedi gofyn eich cwestiwn. Mae eich cwestiwn wedi’i orffen. Rwy'n ceisio ei ateb, os caniatewch i mi wneud hynny.

Well, no, there was a snide remark. That's what I heard first. 

Wel, na, cafwyd sylw coeglyd. Dyna a glywais gyntaf.

Allow the Minister to carry on with answering your question.

Gadewch i'r Gweinidog barhau i ateb eich cwestiwn.

Rhun ap Iorwerth is offended I made a snide remark. He's accused us of having a begging-bowl attitude, so that's pretty snide, I would say, in respect, to that. 

And in terms of Alun Cairns' coat-tails, I'd struggle to reach them, with respect. So, there's no subservient attitude here and I think it doesn't help a calm discussion about how we can advance the economic interests of south Wales to dress it up in such hysterical language.

As I've made clear, the term of 'west Britain' was certainly not ours and it wasn't, indeed, even the chair's, and I certainly would not—and I was clear in my earlier answer—endorse that. As I've said, we're not naive about the political agendas here at play. This was not a joint appointment. This is not something we are jointly setting up. The UK Government have taken this initiative. We'll watch it with interest. If it is a forum for sharing information, we'd be happy to be part of it. If it's any more than that, we will not.

Mae Rhun ap Iorwerth yn ddig am imi wneud sylw coeglyd. Mae wedi ein cyhuddo o fod ag agwedd dysgl gardod, felly mae hynny'n eithaf coeglyd, buaswn yn dweud, â phob parch.

Ac o ran cynffon côt Alun Cairns, buaswn yn cael trafferth ei chyrraedd, gyda phob parch. Felly, nid oes agwedd daeogaidd yma ac ni chredaf fod defnyddio iaith mor hysterig yn hybu trafodaeth gall ynglŷn â sut y gallwn hyrwyddo buddiannau economaidd de Cymru.

Fel y dywedais yn glir, yn sicr nid ein term ni oedd 'gorllewin Prydain’, na therm y cadeirydd yn wir, ac yn sicr, ni fuaswn—a dywedais yn glir yn fy ateb cynharach—yn cymeradwyo hynny. Fel y dywedais, nid ydym yn naïf ynghylch yr agendâu gwleidyddol sydd ar waith yma. Nid oedd hwn yn apwyntiad ar y cyd. Nid yw hyn yn rhywbeth rydym yn ei sefydlu ar y cyd. Llywodraeth y DU sy’n gyfrifol am y fenter hon. Byddwn yn ei gwylio â diddordeb. Os yw'n fforwm ar gyfer rhannu gwybodaeth, rydym yn fwy na pharod i fod yn rhan ohono. Os yw'n fwy na hynny, ni fyddwn yn gwneud hynny.

13:45

Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Russell George.

Conservative spokesperson, Russell George.

Diolch, Llywydd. Deputy Minister, has the timetable for the South East Wales Transport Commission slipped?

Diolch, Lywydd. Ddirprwy Weinidog, a yw'r amserlen ar gyfer Comisiwn Trafnidiaeth De-ddwyrain Cymru wedi llithro?

Thank you. That's good to hear. In June of this year, Deputy Minister, your boss, the Minister, said to this Chamber that transport is an area where the Welsh Government has ambitious plans for the future. He said he expected an interim report for the South East Wales Transport Commission within six months. The Minister also said, and I'm quoting here:

'I've been very keen and clear in saying to the chair and to the public that if the commission is able to bring forward viable suggestions that can be delivered'

in the short term, within the next six-month period, to ease congestion on the M4, they should be done so without delay.

Since these statements back in June, can I ask a couple of questions? Can I ask why it has taken until October to establish the membership of the commission? And can I also ask: can you confirm that, by the end of this year, we will have the interim report, or will it just be an update? And can I ask, what appears to be kicking into the long grass—can you tell me if this interim report has been kicked into the long grass, or do you still anticipate the report to be delivered by the end of this year?

Diolch. Mae'n braf clywed hynny. Ym mis Mehefin eleni, dywedodd y Dirprwy Weinidog, eich bos, y Gweinidog, wrth y Siambr hon fod trafnidiaeth yn faes lle mae gan Lywodraeth Cymru gynlluniau uchelgeisiol ar gyfer y dyfodol. Dywedodd ei fod yn disgwyl adroddiad interim i Gomisiwn Trafnidiaeth De-ddwyrain Cymru o fewn chwe mis. Dywedodd y Gweinidog hefyd, ac rwy'n dyfynnu:

'rwyf wedi bod yn awyddus ac yn glir iawn wrth ddweud wrth y cadeirydd ac wrth y cyhoedd, os gall y comisiwn gyflwyno awgrymiadau ymarferol y gellir eu cyflwyno'

yn y tymor byr, o fewn y chwe mis nesaf, i liniaru tagfeydd ar yr M4, y dylid gwneud hynny heb oedi.

Ers y datganiadau hyn yn ôl ym mis Mehefin, a gaf fi ofyn ychydig o gwestiynau? A gaf fi ofyn pam ei bod wedi cymryd tan fis Hydref i sefydlu aelodaeth y comisiwn? Ac a gaf fi ofyn hefyd: a allwch gadarnhau y bydd gennym yr adroddiad interim erbyn diwedd eleni, neu ai diweddariad yn unig fydd hwn? Ac a gaf fi ofyn, ymddengys fod hyn wedi'i wthio i'r naill ochr—a allwch ddweud wrthyf a yw'r adroddiad interim hwn wedi'i wthio i'r naill ochr, neu a ydych yn dal i ragweld y bydd yr adroddiad yn cael ei gyflwyno erbyn diwedd eleni?

Both the First Minister and the economy Minister made it very clear to the chair of the commission that we expect to have early recommendations by Christmas, and that remains our expectation.

There has been some time taken to assemble a very high calibre panel of people. They've published their terms of reference and their way of working. I'm very encouraged that they are not going to be constrained, in the way that previous studies have, to simply look at road options, but will look at the full array of interventions, including behaviour change, to tackle the congestion and the car dependency in that part of Wales, and not simply the traditional approaches that have dominated this debate for many years.

So, I fully expect an exciting range of proposals, with some initial thoughts by the end of this year.

Mae'r Prif Weinidog a Gweinidog yr economi wedi dweud yn glir iawn wrth gadeirydd y comisiwn ein bod yn disgwyl cael argymhellion cynnar erbyn y Nadolig, a dyna yw ein disgwyliad o hyd.

Cymerwyd peth amser i gynnull panel o bobl uchel eu parch. Maent wedi cyhoeddi eu cylch gorchwyl a'u ffordd o weithio. Mae'n galonogol iawn na fyddant wedi'u cyfyngu, fel a ddigwyddodd gydag astudiaethau blaenorol, i edrych ar opsiynau ffyrdd yn unig, ond byddant yn edrych ar yr ystod lawn o ymyriadau, gan gynnwys newid ymddygiad, i fynd i'r afael â thagfeydd a'r ddibyniaeth ar geir yn y rhan honno o Gymru, yn hytrach na'r dulliau traddodiadol sydd wedi dominyddu'r ddadl hon ers blynyddoedd lawer.

Felly, rwy'n disgwyl ystod gyffrous o gynigion, gyda rhai syniadau cychwynnol erbyn diwedd eleni.

Thank you, Minister. You'll also be aware that the volume of traffic on the M4 is increasing day by day. We've had a new poll, which shows that almost twice as many people in Wales now believe that the M4 relief road should be built, contradicting the view of the First Minister and the Welsh Government. But can you confirm whether or not the option of building the M4 relief road is, or isn't, within the scope of the South East Wales Transport Commission's terms of reference? And, if so, and they recommend to you to go ahead and build it, will you do that or will you reject the findings of this independent commission?

Diolch, Weinidog. Fe fyddwch hefyd yn ymwybodol fod traffig ar yr M4 yn cynyddu'n ddyddiol. Rydym wedi cael arolwg barn newydd, sy'n dangos bod bron i ddwywaith cymaint o bobl yng Nghymru bellach yn credu y dylid adeiladu ffordd liniaru'r M4, yn groes i farn y Prif Weinidog a Llywodraeth Cymru. Ond a allwch gadarnhau p'un a yw'r opsiwn o adeiladu ffordd liniaru'r M4 o fewn cwmpas cylch gorchwyl Comisiwn Trafnidiaeth De-ddwyrain Cymru ai peidio? Ac os felly, ac os ydynt yn argymell eich bod yn ei hadeiladu, a fyddwch yn gwneud hynny neu a fyddwch yn gwrthod canfyddiadau'r comisiwn annibynnol hwn?

No. Having gone through a public inquiry that looked at the black route, there'd be absolutely no point in setting up another inquiry to go and re-examine the exact same option. So, that is not an option that the commission is looking at. They're looking at alternatives, which we believe can be delivered quicker and cheaper to better effect than the road that was previously examined.

Russell George mentions a poll that was published yesterday, which—. Well, I'd say two things about that: first of all, the First Minister made his decision not because it was popular but because it was the right thing to do, because the inspector's report did not take proper recognition of the climate emergency nor the collapse in biodiversity. That was a principled decision the Government took, not one chasing popular headlines. And the poll, really, isn't worth a great deal, when you think about the way it was framed. Had the question been framed to say to people, 'Would you be willing for your hospital and your school to be cancelled for a project that's more than doubled in budget?', it might have produced a different result.

Na. Ar ôl cynnal ymchwiliad cyhoeddus a edrychodd ar y llwybr du, ni fyddai unrhyw bwrpas sefydlu ymchwiliad arall i fynd i ailedrych ar yr un opsiwn yn union. Felly, nid yw hwnnw'n opsiwn y mae'r comisiwn yn ei ystyried. Maent yn edrych ar opsiynau eraill y credwn y gellir eu cyflwyno'n gyflymach ac yn rhatach ac a fyddai'n cael gwell effaith na'r ffordd a archwiliwyd eisoes.

Mae Russell George yn sôn am arolwg barn a gyhoeddwyd ddoe, sydd—. Wel, buaswn yn dweud dau beth am hynny: yn gyntaf oll, gwnaeth y Prif Weinidog ei benderfyniad nid oherwydd ei fod yn boblogaidd ond oherwydd mai dyna'r peth iawn i'w wneud, oherwydd nid oedd adroddiad yr arolygydd yn rhoi cydnabyddiaeth briodol i'r argyfwng hinsawdd na'r effaith ddinistriol ar fioamrywiaeth. Roedd hwnnw'n benderfyniad egwyddorol a wnaed gan y Llywodraeth, nid un i geisio bod yn boblogaidd. Ac nid yw'r arolwg barn yn werth llawer, mewn gwirionedd, pan feddyliwch am y ffordd y cafodd ei ofyn. Pe bai'r cwestiwn wedi'i ffurfio i ofyn i bobl, 'A fyddech yn fodlon i'ch ysbyty a'ch ysgol gael eu canslo ar gyfer prosiect y mae ei gyllideb wedi mwy na dyblu?', efallai y byddai wedi cynhyrchu canlyniad gwahanol.

Llefarydd Plaid Brexit, David Rowlands.

Brexit Party spokesperson, David Rowlands.

Diolch, Llywydd. Deputy Minister, the proposal to make Newport the focus for economic growth has been welcomed by all in South Wales East, and we congratulate the Welsh Government on its announcement. However, I understand there has been criticism of this move by Cardiff city council, who argue that this would take jobs and investment out of Wales and undermine Cardiff's role as the economic driver of the Welsh economy.

Does the Minister not agree with me that their argument goes against the regional development plan and the setting up of strategic development plans that actually encompass the Cardiff capital region?

Diolch, Lywydd. Ddirprwy Weinidog, mae’r cynnig i wneud Casnewydd yn ganolbwynt ar gyfer twf economaidd wedi'i groesawu gan bawb yn Nwyrain De Cymru, ac rydym yn llongyfarch Llywodraeth Cymru ar ei chyhoeddiad. Fodd bynnag, deallaf fod cyngor dinas Caerdydd wedi beirniadu’r cynnig hwn, gan ddadlau y byddai'n mynd â swyddi a buddsoddiad allan o Gymru ac yn tanseilio rôl Caerdydd fel sbardun economaidd i economi Cymru.

Onid yw'r Gweinidog yn cytuno â mi fod eu dadl yn mynd yn groes i'r cynllun datblygu rhanbarthol a'r gwaith o sefydlu cynlluniau datblygu strategol sy'n cwmpasu prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd mewn gwirionedd?

Well, those are probably comments best directed to the leader of Cardiff council. The national development framework is out to consultation, and we look forward to considering all representations as part of that.

Wel, mae'n debyg mai at arweinydd cyngor Caerdydd y dylid cyfeirio'r sylwadau hynny. Mae ymgynghoriad ar waith ar y fframwaith datblygu cenedlaethol, ac edrychwn ymlaen at ystyried pob sylw fel rhan o hynny.

13:50

Well, I thank the Deputy Minister for that brief answer, but, Deputy Minister, the draft national framework encompasses local development plans, strategic development plans, developments of national significance, which all sit alongside 'Planning Policy Wales', and all supposedly based on a regional structure. Given this desire to move to regional centres of governance, could the Welsh Government give consideration to having just five regional centres of governance, perhaps based on the Welsh Assembly electoral regions, rather than the somewhat haphazard mix of local authorities-based economic regions that now exist or are proposed? These larger regions would have larger budgets, which would better facilitate strategic planning, particularly for infrastructure projects, thus underpinning the Government's strategic development plan for Wales.

Wel, diolch i'r Dirprwy Weinidog am ei ateb cryno, ond Ddirprwy Weinidog, mae'r fframwaith cenedlaethol drafft yn cwmpasu cynlluniau datblygu lleol, cynlluniau datblygu strategol, datblygiadau o arwyddocâd cenedlaethol, pob un ohonynt yn sefyll ochr yn ochr â 'Pholisi Cynllunio Cymru', a phob un yn seiliedig yn ôl y sôn ar strwythur rhanbarthol. O ystyried yr awydd hwn i newid i ganolfannau llywodraethu rhanbarthol, a allai Llywodraeth Cymru ystyried cael pum canolfan lywodraethu ranbarthol yn unig, yn seiliedig, efallai, ar ranbarthau etholiadol Cynulliad Cymru, yn hytrach na'r gymysgedd ychydig yn ddi-drefn o ranbarthau economaidd sy'n seiliedig ar awdurdodau lleol sydd bellach yn bodoli neu'n cael eu hargymell? Byddai gan y rhanbarthau mwy hyn gyllidebau mwy, a fyddai'n hwyluso cynllunio strategol yn well, yn enwedig ar gyfer prosiectau seilwaith, ac felly'n sail i gynllun datblygu strategol y Llywodraeth ar gyfer Cymru.

If I've understood the Member's point correctly, the regions that exist are based, certainly in the south-east, on the Cardiff capital region, which is a city region that's now been in development for some years and has the buy-in of the local authorities. You can certainly make arguments about where the line should be drawn between the mid Wales region and the Swansea bay city region, but you can always have these judgments about which bit should be in which and so on. We are willing to keep an open mind. If there's support within the local authorities for recalibrating those, we'd look at it, of course. But we have a small capacity at play here between the local authorities and the Welsh Government, and we need to pick an optimum number where we can get some gravity together to be able to marshal our resources properly to great effect, and the more we chop them around, the more difficult it becomes to get the results we're looking for.

Os wyf wedi deall pwynt yr Aelod yn iawn, mae'r rhanbarthau sy'n bodoli yn seiliedig, yn sicr yn y de-ddwyrain, ar brifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd, dinas-ranbarth a fu'n cael ei ddatblygu ers rhai blynyddoedd bellach ac sydd wedi cael cefnogaeth yr awdurdodau lleol. Yn sicr, gallwch ddadlau ynglŷn â ble y dylid tynnu’r llinell rhwng rhanbarth canolbarth Cymru a dinas-ranbarth bae Abertawe, ond gallwch bob amser gael y safbwyntiau hyn ynglŷn â pha ddarn a ddylai fod ym mha un ac yn y blaen. Rydym yn barod i gadw meddwl agored. Os oes cefnogaeth ymhlith yr awdurdodau lleol i'w hailraddnodi, byddem yn ystyried hynny, wrth gwrs. Ond ychydig o gapasiti sydd gennym i chwarae ag ef yma rhwng yr awdurdodau lleol a Llywodraeth Cymru, ac mae angen inni ddewis y nifer gorau posibl fel y gallwn sicrhau bod gennym allu i reoli ein hadnoddau mewn modd priodol ac effeithiol, a pho fwyaf y byddwn yn eu hollti, yr anoddaf fydd cael y canlyniadau rydym yn edrych amdanynt.

Seilwaith Cysylltedd Digidol
Digital Connectivity Infrastructure

3. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am seilwaith cysylltedd digidol ar gyfer cymoedd de Cymru? OAQ54618

3. Will the Minister make a statement on digital connectivity infrastructure for the south Wales valleys? OAQ54618

Yes. The south Wales Valleys have seen significant investment in digital connectivity infrastructure, with the Superfast Cymru scheme investing over £66.9 million to provide fast fibre broadband access to over 244,600 premises. 

Gwnaf. Mae cymoedd de Cymru wedi cael buddsoddiad sylweddol mewn seilwaith cysylltedd digidol, gyda chynllun Cyflymu Cymru yn buddsoddi dros £66.9 miliwn i ddarparu mynediad at fand eang ffeibr cyflym i dros 244,600 o adeiladau.

Thank you for that answer, Deputy Minister. I know, of course, this is a largely non-devolved area of work, but I do recognise that, over the last few years, because of the failure of the UK Government to provide sufficient investment where the commercial market won't provide this vital service for our communities and business, the Welsh Government has stepped into this space and invested in high-quality broadband infrastructure, improving digital connectivity through the Superfast Cymru programme, as you've already highlighted—something I know that has a very positive impact in my constituency. So, can I ask the Deputy Minister: what work are you doing with Welsh Government colleagues to press the UK Government to follow your lead and to provide funding for high-quality digital infrastructure that can further support areas like Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney to improve their productivity and their competitiveness as an area for investment?

Diolch am eich ateb, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Gwn, wrth gwrs, fod hwn yn faes gwaith sydd heb ei ddatganoli i raddau helaeth, ond rwy'n cydnabod, dros yr ychydig flynyddoedd diwethaf, oherwydd methiant Llywodraeth y DU i ddarparu buddsoddiad digonol lle na fydd y farchnad fasnachol yn darparu'r gwasanaeth hanfodol hwn i’n cymunedau a’n busnesau, fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi camu i’r adwy ac wedi buddsoddi mewn seilwaith band eang o ansawdd uchel, gan wella cysylltedd digidol drwy raglen Cyflymu Cymru, fel y nodoch chi eisoes—rhywbeth rwy'n ymwybodol ei fod yn cael effaith gadarnhaol iawn yn fy etholaeth. Felly, a gaf fi ofyn i'r Dirprwy Weinidog: pa waith rydych yn ei wneud gyda'ch cyd-Aelodau yn Llywodraeth Cymru i bwyso ar Lywodraeth y DU i ddilyn eich arweiniad ac i ddarparu cyllid ar gyfer seilwaith digidol o ansawdd uchel a all roi rhagor o gefnogaeth i ardaloedd fel Merthyr Tudful a Rhymni wella eu cynhyrchiant a'u cystadleurwydd fel ardal i fuddsoddi ynddi?

Thank you for that question. Dawn Bowden is absolutely right that this is a non-devolved area, but, because of market failure and the inactivity of the UK Government, the Welsh Government has been forced to step in here to divert significant resources from devolved services to address this clear failing by the UK Government to act. We have achieved significant results: a 95 per cent coverage of premises in Wales of superfast broadband. Now, we genuinely believe that fast internet access is now an essential modern service. The UK Government has a universal service obligation for postal services, so, if you post a letter to a farm track, isolated, it still—even though it may not be profitable, there's an obligation on the Royal Mail to deliver that letter. We think there should be a similar universal service obligation on telecommunications providers to provide modern, fast broadband.

The UK Government's come up with what it calls a universal service obligation, which is that in name only, I'm afraid. It's a right to request up to 10 Mbps, where the cost of building is no more than £3,400, from March 2020. So, this will still leave large parts of rural Wales without a functioning broadband service. So, that clearly is not worth the paper it is written on. We are looking to see what we can do, and we have a statement and debate coming up shortly on what more the Welsh Government can do to reach the areas that we've yet to reach.

There is some progress in terms of other technologies, notably 4G and 5G, which are able also to deliver internet services. I met with the telecommunications companies recently, who I'm very pleased to say have come up with their own plan to achieve a step change in provision of 4G coverage in Wales by 2025, to increase coverage from 58 per cent to 86 per cent, without intervention by Ofcom. That, I must say, is very welcome, and we are working with them to see what we can do to help maximise that beyond 86 per cent if possible. We are worried that this will only be achieved by 2025, which still leaves a very long gap.

We are also working as part of bidding for 5G trials in rural areas. Simon Gibson is leading a task and finish group for the Welsh Government looking at 5G and, as part of that, has put in a bid to the DCMS 5G trials for test beds, and that is about to be considered by them, which would see a focus particularly on Blaenau Gwent, the Heads of the Valleys and Monmouthshire, which was the result of the £250,000 piece of work that the Government has supported. So, I think that there are things that we are doing, despite the fact that this is non-devolved. But, really, we need the UK Government to step up to the plate here PDQ.  

Diolch am eich cwestiwn. Mae Dawn Bowden yn llygad ei lle fod hwn yn faes heb ei ddatganoli, ond oherwydd methiant y farchnad ac anweithgarwch Llywodraeth y DU, mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi gorfod camu i mewn yma i ddargyfeirio adnoddau sylweddol oddi wrth wasanaethau datganoledig i fynd i’r afael â’r methiant amlwg hwn gan Lywodraeth y DU i weithredu. Rydym wedi cyflawni canlyniadau sylweddol: band eang cyflym iawn mewn 95 y cant o safleoedd yng Nghymru. Nawr, rydym yn credu o ddifrif fod mynediad cyflym at y rhyngrwyd bellach yn wasanaeth modern hanfodol. Mae gan Lywodraeth y DU rwymedigaeth gwasanaeth cyffredinol ar gyfer gwasanaethau post, felly, os ydych yn postio llythyr at drac fferm, anghysbell, mae'n dal i fod—er efallai nad yw'n broffidiol, mae gan y Post Brenhinol rwymedigaeth i ddosbarthu'r llythyr hwnnw. Credwn y dylid cael rhwymedigaeth gwasanaeth cyffredinol debyg i ddarparwyr telathrebu ddarparu band eang modern, cyflym.

Mae Llywodraeth y DU yn cynnig yr hyn y mae'n ei alw'n rhwymedigaeth gwasanaeth cyffredinol, ac mae hynny mewn enw yn unig, mae arnaf ofn. Ceir hawl i ofyn am hyd at 10 Mbps, lle nad yw'r gost adeiladu yn fwy na £3,400, o fis Mawrth 2020. Felly, bydd hyn yn dal i adael rhannau helaeth o gefn gwlad Cymru heb wasanaeth band eang sy'n gweithio. Felly yn amlwg, nid yw hynny'n werth y papur y mae wedi'i ysgrifennu arno. Rydym yn edrych i weld beth y gallwn ei wneud, ac mae gennym ddatganiad a dadl cyn bo hir ar beth arall y gall Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud i gyrraedd yr ardaloedd nad ydym wedi eu cyrraedd eto.

Ceir rhywfaint o gynnydd o ran technolegau eraill, yn enwedig 4G a 5G, sydd hefyd yn gallu darparu gwasanaethau rhyngrwyd. Cyfarfûm â'r cwmnïau telathrebu yn ddiweddar, ac rwy'n falch iawn o ddweud eu bod wedi llunio eu cynllun eu hunain i sicrhau newid sylweddol o ran darpariaeth 4G yng Nghymru erbyn 2025, er mwyn cynyddu'r cwmpas o 58 y cant i 86 y cant, heb ymyrraeth gan Ofcom. Rhaid i mi ddweud bod hynny'n galonogol iawn, ac rydym yn gweithio gyda hwy i weld beth y gallwn ei wneud i helpu i gynyddu hynny y tu hwnt i 86 y cant os oes modd. Rydym yn bryderus na fydd hyn yn cael ei gyflawni tan 2025, sy'n dal i adael bwlch hir iawn.

Rydym hefyd yn gweithio fel rhan o'r broses o gynnig am dreialon 5G mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Mae Simon Gibson yn arwain grŵp gorchwyl a gorffen sy’n edrych ar 5G ar gyfer Llywodraeth Cymru, ac fel rhan o hynny, mae wedi cyflwyno cais i dreialon 5G yr Adran dros Ddiwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon ar gyfer ardaloedd prawf, ac maent ar fin ei ystyried, cais a fyddai’n arwain at ffocws arbennig ar Flaenau Gwent, Blaenau'r Cymoedd a Sir Fynwy, sef canlyniad gwaith gwerth £250,000 y mae'r Llywodraeth wedi'i gefnogi. Felly, credaf ein bod yn gwneud rhai pethau, er nad yw hyn yn fater wedi'i ddatganoli. Ond mewn gwirionedd, mae angen i Lywodraeth y DU ysgwyddo'i chyfrifoldeb am hyn ar unwaith.

13:55

Minister, last month, the Federation of Small Businesses produced a report on how broadband and mobile connectivity hinders small businesses in south-east Wales. With regard to Wales, they point out that mobile phones are increasingly becoming a key element of connectivity for small business owners. In areas where superfast broadband is not available, there are disproportionately high numbers of small firms that say that they use their mobile phones for internet banking and to interact with customers and suppliers at the same time. Minister, what action will you take to extend broadband coverage to areas that are currently hard to reach, such as parts of the south-east Wales Valleys? Thank you.

Weinidog, y mis diwethaf, cynhyrchodd y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach adroddiad ar sut y mae cysylltedd band eang a ffonau symudol yn rhwystro busnesau bach yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru. Wrth drafod Cymru, maent yn tynnu sylw at y ffaith bod ffonau symudol yn dod yn elfen fwyfwy allweddol o gysylltedd i berchnogion busnesau bach. Mewn ardaloedd lle nad oes band eang cyflym iawn ar gael, mae niferoedd anghymesur o uchel o gwmnïau bach yn dweud eu bod yn defnyddio eu ffonau symudol ar gyfer bancio dros y rhyngrwyd ac i ryngweithio â chwsmeriaid a chyflenwyr ar yr un pryd. Weinidog, pa gamau y byddwch yn eu cymryd i ymestyn cyrhaeddiad band eang i ardaloedd sy'n anodd eu cyrraedd ar hyn o bryd, megis rhannau o Gymoedd de-ddwyrain Cymru? Diolch.

Well, with respect to Mohammad Asghar, I have just answered that question. I would say to him that the UK Government—regardless of party, the UK Government has the lead role to play here. And, since his party has been in Government, we are falling woefully behind. We've stepped in where we shouldn't to provide this service. It is now time that the Government acts. 

Wel, gyda phob parch i Mohammad Asghar, rwyf newydd ateb y cwestiwn hwnnw. Buaswn yn dweud wrtho mai Llywodraeth y DU—waeth beth fo'i phlaid, Llywodraeth y DU sydd â'r rôl arweiniol i'w chwarae yma. Ac ers i'w blaid ddod i rym, rydym ar ei hôl hi'n druenus. Rydym wedi camu i'r adwy lle na ddylem orfod gwneud hynny i ddarparu'r gwasanaeth hwn. Mae'n bryd bellach i'r Llywodraeth weithredu.

Datblygu Economaidd yng Ngogledd Cymru
Economic Development in North Wales

4. Sut y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi datblygu economaidd yng Ngogledd Cymru? OAQ54626

4. How is the Welsh Government supporting economic development in North Wales? OAQ54626

In the last year, the Development Bank of Wales has supported 109 businesses in north Wales, with a total of £40 million of investment in the region since 2016. Business Wales has helped more than 6,000 businesses and entrepreneurs generate £30 million of investment, £16 million in exports and nearly 3,000 new jobs.

Yn ystod y flwyddyn ddiwethaf, mae Banc Datblygu Cymru wedi cefnogi 109 o fusnesau yng ngogledd Cymru, gyda chyfanswm o £40 miliwn o fuddsoddiad yn y rhanbarth ers 2016. Mae Busnes Cymru wedi helpu mwy na 6,000 o fusnesau ac entrepreneuriaid i gynhyrchu £30 miliwn o fuddsoddiad, £16 miliwn mewn allforion a bron i 3,000 o swyddi newydd.

On 28 October, the Minister for Economy and Transport issued a written statement on the north Wales metro. Within that, much of the content was actually taken from the North Wales Economic Ambition Board's growth vision and growth bid documents—from integrated travel zones to the Wrexham to Bidston route to road and rail infrastructure. Heads of terms on the growth deal were due for agreement by the end of February, then deferred to July, then to October or November, and, once agreed, we understand that it will take four to six months to finalise the business case ahead of any spades in the ground.

However, yesterday, our local paper reported that representatives of the North Wales Economic Ambition Board joined the Welsh and UK Governments to sign the heads of terms and agree on the seven programmes that will form the deal from 2020 onwards, and the chair of the board said:

'Our next steps will be to begin implementing the priority projects and leverage funding from the private sector in key areas',

expected to reach a total investment of £1 billion. Why has the Welsh Government not shared this fantastic progress with us after all these months of delay, when it has been raised time and time again here? And how will the Welsh Government ensure that we will now be briefed on those priority programmes as they go forward, when they're likely to begin, and how they will be delivered?

Ar 28 Hydref, cyhoeddodd Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ar fetro gogledd Cymru. Roedd llawer o gynnwys y datganiad hwnnw wedi'i gymryd o ddogfennau gweledigaeth twf a chais twf Bwrdd Uchelgais Economaidd Gogledd Cymru—o barthau teithio integredig i'r llwybr rhwng Wrecsam a Bidston i'r seilwaith ffyrdd a rheilffyrdd. Roedd disgwyl i benawdau'r telerau ar y fargen twf gael eu cytuno erbyn diwedd mis Chwefror, yna cawsant eu gohirio tan fis Gorffennaf, yna tan fis Hydref neu fis Tachwedd, ac ar ôl iddynt gael eu cytuno, deallwn y bydd yn cymryd pedwar i chwe mis i gwblhau'r achos busnes cyn rhoi unrhyw rawiau yn y ddaear.

Fodd bynnag, ddoe, nododd ein papur lleol fod cynrychiolwyr Bwrdd Uchelgais Economaidd Gogledd Cymru wedi ymuno â Llywodraeth Cymru a Llywodraeth y DU i arwyddo penawdau'r telerau a chytuno ar y saith rhaglen a fydd yn ffurfio’r fargen o 2020 ymlaen, a dywedodd cadeirydd y bwrdd:

'Ein camau nesaf fydd dechrau gwaith ar y prosiectau â blaenoriaeth a cheisio cyllid gan y sector preifat mewn meysydd allweddol',

y disgwylir iddo ddod i gyfanswm o £1 biliwn o fuddsoddiad. Pam nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi rhannu’r cynnydd gwych hwn gyda ni wedi'r holl fisoedd hyn o oedi, o gofio bod hyn wedi'i godi yma dro ar ôl tro? A sut y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn sicrhau y byddwn yn cael ein briffio ar y rhaglenni blaenoriaeth hynny wrth iddynt fynd rhagddynt, pryd fyddant yn debygol o ddechrau, a sut y cânt eu cyflwyno?

I'm not entirely sure what to make of that question, really. The delay in the signing of the North Wales Economic Ambition Board was a result of delays by the UK Government. He then seemed to criticise us for adopting policies that the north Wales ambition board had advocated in its plan. He normally criticises us for not collaborating sufficiently with the North Wales Economic Ambition Board, so I'm not entirely sure of the point he was trying to get at there.

We now have a way forward with the ambition board, and it's for them to work as a region. The whole point of these city regions is that leadership needs to come locally. It's for the local authorities working together to come up with a plan to satisfy the Welsh Government and the UK Government that they have robust plans in place that can be delivered on time and on budget, and then we will release the funds. It's not all the time to come complaining to the Welsh Government that they expect us to take the lead. This is the whole point of regional economic development: it's led by the region, and we work closely with them to do that. We co-produce that with them through our new regional economic approach, and the chief regional officer for north Wales is intimately involved with the board to do what we can. But this is a partnership and both partners have to act.

Nid wyf yn hollol siŵr sut i ymateb i'r cwestiwn hwnnw, a dweud y gwir. Roedd yr oedi wrth arwyddo gyda Bwrdd Uchelgais Economaidd Gogledd Cymru yn ganlyniad i oedi gan Lywodraeth y DU. Ymddengys ei fod wedyn yn ein beirniadu am fabwysiadu polisïau roedd bwrdd uchelgais gogledd Cymru wedi'u hyrwyddo yn ei gynllun. Mae fel arfer yn ein beirniadu am beidio â chydweithredu'n ddigonol â Bwrdd Uchelgais Economaidd Gogledd Cymru, felly nid wyf yn hollol siŵr beth oedd y pwynt y ceisiai ei wneud.

Bellach, mae gennym ffordd ymlaen gyda'r bwrdd uchelgais, a mater iddynt hwy yw gweithio fel rhanbarth. Holl bwynt y dinas-ranbarthau hyn yw bod angen i'r arweinyddiaeth fod yn lleol. Mater i'r awdurdodau lleol, gan weithio gyda'i gilydd, yw llunio cynllun i fodloni Llywodraeth Cymru a Llywodraeth y DU fod ganddynt gynlluniau cadarn ar waith y gellir eu cyflawni ar amser ac o fewn y gyllideb, ac yna byddwn yn darparu'r arian. Nid dod i gwyno i Lywodraeth Cymru drwy'r amser eu bod yn disgwyl inni gymryd yr awenau. Dyma holl bwynt datblygu economaidd rhanbarthol: caiff ei arwain gan y rhanbarth, ac rydym yn gweithio'n agos gyda hwy i wneud hynny. Rydym yn cydgynhyrchu hynny gyda hwy drwy ein dull economaidd rhanbarthol newydd, ac mae prif swyddog rhanbarthol gogledd Cymru yn gweithio'n agos â'r bwrdd i wneud yr hyn a allwn. Ond partneriaeth yw hon, ac mae'n rhaid i'r ddau bartner weithredu.

14:00
Parodrwydd Cefnffyrdd
Trunk Road Preparedness

5. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am barodrwydd cefnffyrdd cyn tywydd gwael posibl? OAQ54613

5. Will the Minister provide an update on trunk road preparedness in advance of potential adverse weather conditions? OAQ54613

Yes. Winter preparedness is vital for our transport networks. We are in regular contact with local authorities to monitor salt stock levels, ensuring that we can maintain the safety and reliability of the network. We also work closely with rail and bus companies so that the public transport system is prepared.

Gwnaf. Mae parodrwydd ar gyfer y gaeaf yn hanfodol i'n rhwydweithiau trafnidiaeth. Rydym mewn cysylltiad rheolaidd ag awdurdodau lleol i fonitro lefelau stociau halen, gan sicrhau y gallwn gynnal diogelwch a dibynadwyedd y rhwydwaith. Rydym hefyd yn gweithio'n agos gyda chwmnïau rheilffyrdd a bysiau i sicrhau parodrwydd y system drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus.

Thank you for your answer, Deputy Minister. Certainly in my constituency over recent weeks there's been a number of flooding issues where we've seen a number of road closures. And what constituents come to me about is the fact that they can't get information about where roads are closed, whether it be trunk roads or local-authority-responsibility roads. Now, I know the Minister has previously mentioned when he's come to the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee that communication is something that he would like to see improved for planned roadworks. I appreciate that flooding is not planned, but it would be useful, would you not agree, to have a one-stop shop where Traffic Wales can list all road closures, whether they are planned or in the event of flooding incidents? And I would hope that you would agree it's not beyond the wit of man—

Diolch am eich ateb, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Yn sicr, yn fy etholaeth dros yr wythnosau diwethaf, bu nifer o broblemau gyda llifogydd lle rydym wedi gweld nifer o ffyrdd yn cau. A’r hyn y mae etholwyr yn dod ataf yn ei gylch yw’r ffaith na allant gael gwybodaeth am ble mae'r ffyrdd ar gau, boed yn gefnffyrdd neu’n ffyrdd sy'n gyfrifoldeb i'r awdurdod lleol. Nawr, gwn fod y Gweinidog eisoes wedi crybwyll wrth Bwyllgor yr Economi, Seilwaith a Sgiliau fod cyfathrebu'n rhywbeth yr hoffai ei weld yn cael ei wella ar gyfer gwaith ffordd a gynllunnir. Rwy'n derbyn nad yw llifogydd wedi'u cynllunio, ond oni fyddech yn cytuno y byddai'n ddefnyddiol cael siop un stop lle gall Traffig Cymru restru'r holl ffyrdd sydd ar gau, boed yn gau wedi'i gynllunio neu mewn achosion o lifogydd? A buaswn yn gobeithio eich bod yn cytuno nad yw y tu hwnt i allu dyn—

—or woman, Joyce, to have the facility to allow local authorities to pass on information to Traffic Wales's website, so that we've got that one-stop shop for any kind of road disruption.

—neu fenyw, Joyce, i gael cyfleuster i ganiatáu i awdurdodau lleol drosglwyddo gwybodaeth i wefan Traffig Cymru, fel bod gennym y siop un stop honno ar gyfer unrhyw fath o broblemau ar y ffordd.

Yes, I'd agree with that, and that is supposed to be happening. The Twitter feeds, certainly of the trunk road agencies that I follow, are regularly updating on both planned and unplanned road closures. So, if the Member has some particular examples of where that's failing to happen, I'd be happy to look into it further.

Iawn, buaswn yn cytuno â hynny, ac mae hynny i fod i ddigwydd. Mae'r ffrydiau Twitter, yn sicr rhai'r asiantaethau cefnffyrdd rwyf yn eu dilyn, yn rhoi diweddariadau rheolaidd ar ffyrdd sydd wedi cau, boed yn gau wedi'i gynllunio neu beidio. Felly, os oes gan yr Aelod rai enghreifftiau penodol o ble nad yw hynny'n digwydd, rwy'n fwy na pharod i ymchwilio ymhellach i hynny.

Deputy Minister, as the winter comes, the hours of darkness get longer and, therefore, we need to be looking at driving in the hours of darkness, and we would, obviously, rely upon street lighting, where it is available, to be operationally effective, particularly along the trunk roads. Now, in Port Talbot the streetlighting and the overhead section has been taken away for several months. The stumps still stand there and in the darkness and the night you can't see the stumps because it's that dark. When will the Welsh Government actually be putting the lights back in place so that elevated section of the M4, which should be lit, is lit? It should be safer for drivers, particularly in an area that is criticised very much for the traffic congestion.

Ddirprwy Weinidog, wrth i'r gaeaf agosáu, mae'r oriau tywyll yn mynd yn hwy, ac felly mae angen inni edrych ar yrru yn ystod yr oriau tywyll, a byddem yn amlwg yn dibynnu ar oleuadau stryd, lle maent ar gael, i weithio'n effeithiol, yn enwedig ar hyd y cefnffyrdd. Nawr, ym Mhort Talbot, mae'r goleuadau stryd yn y rhan uwchddaearol wedi cael eu tynnu oddi yno ers misoedd lawer. Mae'r bonion yno o hyd, ac yn y tywyllwch ac yn y nos ni allwch weld y bonion gan ei bod mor dywyll. Pryd fydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn gosod y goleuadau yn eu holau, fel bod rhan uwchddaearol yr M4 a ddylai fod wedi'i goleuo, yn cael ei goleuo? Dylai fod yn fwy diogel i yrwyr, yn enwedig mewn ardal sy'n cael ei beirniadu'n fawr am y tagfeydd traffig.

Well, certainly, the columns were cut down in April after one of them collapsed. The other structures were found to have failures that made them a safety risk. They were, therefore, removed. A report was then commissioned to look at what options were available to us, and found that in the 20 years since the lights have been in place the standards have changed and, in fact, by modern standards, it wouldn't have been built like that in the first place, and the view of the experts was that the section of road was overlit. They're now looking at what the options are, of how alternatives can be put in place and how we can bear cognisance to the decarbonisation agenda. So, we would possibly have lighting options using less energy. So, that is currently taking place. It will take some three months for the lighting columns to be ordered, so it's unlikely to happen this financial year. We are considering options in the meantime, particularly floodlighting, but that would need generators. But we are hoping to have some recommendations we can act on in the coming months.

Wel, yn sicr, torrwyd y colofnau ym mis Ebrill ar ôl i un ohonynt gwympo. Canfuwyd fod gan y strwythurau eraill fethiannau a oedd yn eu gwneud yn risg diogelwch. Fe'u symudwyd o'r herwydd. Yna, comisiynwyd adroddiad i edrych ar ba opsiynau a oedd ar gael i ni, a chanfuwyd bod y safonau wedi newid yn yr 20 mlynedd ers gosod y goleuadau, ac mewn gwirionedd, yn ôl safonau modern, ni fyddai'r ffordd wedi cael ei hadeiladu fel hynny yn y lle cyntaf, a barn yr arbenigwyr oedd fod y darn hwnnw o'r ffordd wedi'i oroleuo. Maent yn edrych yn awr ar beth yw'r opsiynau, ar sut y gellir rhoi dewisiadau amgen ar waith a sut y gallwn ystyried yr agenda ddatgarboneiddio. Felly, o bosibl, byddai gennym opsiynau goleuo sy'n defnyddio llai o ynni. Felly, mae hynny'n digwydd ar hyn o bryd. Bydd yn cymryd tua thri mis i archebu'r colofnau goleuo, felly mae'n annhebygol o ddigwydd yn y flwyddyn ariannol hon. Rydym yn ystyried opsiynau yn y cyfamser, yn enwedig llifoleuadau, ond byddai angen generaduron ar gyfer hynny. Ond rydym yn gobeithio cael rhai argymhellion y gallwn eu rhoi ar waith yn ystod y misoedd nesaf.

Cysylltiadau Trafnidiaeth yng Ngorllewin De Cymru
Transport Links in South Wales West

6. Pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i wella cysylltiadau trafnidiaeth yng Ngorllewin De Cymru? OAQ54625

6. What action is the Welsh Government taking to improve transport links in South Wales West? OAQ54625

Thank you. The Welsh Government is working with local authorities to develop a comprehensive programme of enhancements across all modes to improve transport links across the region that will support our communities and deliver sustainable growth.

Diolch. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gydag awdurdodau lleol i ddatblygu rhaglen gynhwysfawr o welliannau ar draws pob dull trafnidiaeth i wella cysylltiadau trafnidiaeth ar draws y rhanbarth a fydd yn cefnogi ein cymunedau ac yn sicrhau twf cynaliadwy.

14:05

Thank you, Deputy Minister. While somewhat justifiably a lot of the attention has been given to congestion on the M4 around Newport and the impact that it is having on the economy of the entire M4 corridor, my region is also suffering from congestion on the motorway. Junction 48 has seen nearly a 50 per cent increase in traffic in recent years, and junction 47 sees nearly 80,000 vehicles per day. Unfortunately, for many, there is no reliable alternative. The main bus operator in Swansea has just been fined because its services are so poor and unreliable. Patients travelling to Singleton and Morriston hospitals found the bus late more often than not, and the service was often cancelled altogether. And as for the train, many of my constituents complain of overcrowding and delays, and the cost per mile is higher than their car. Minister, when can my constituents expect a cheaper, more reliable public transport service?

Diolch, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Er efallai y gellir cyfiawnhau llawer o'r sylw i dagfeydd ar yr M4 ger Casnewydd a'r effaith y mae hynny'n ei chael ar economi coridor yr M4 yn gyffredinol, mae fy rhanbarth i hefyd yn dioddef o dagfeydd ar y draffordd. Mae cynnydd o bron i 50 y cant wedi bod mewn traffig ar gyffordd 48 yn ystod y blynyddoedd diwethaf, ac mae bron i 80,000 o gerbydau y dydd yn defnyddio cyffordd 47. Yn anffodus, i lawer, nid oes dewis arall dibynadwy i'w gael. Mae'r prif weithredwr bysiau yn Abertawe newydd gael dirwy gan fod ei wasanaethau mor wael ac annibynadwy. Mae bysiau'r cleifion sy'n teithio i ysbytai Singleton a Treforys yn hwyr yn amlach na pheidio, ac mae'r gwasanaeth yn aml yn cael ei ganslo'n gyfan gwbl. Ac o ran y trên, mae llawer o fy etholwyr yn cwyno am orlenwi ac oedi, ac mae'r gost fesul milltir yn uwch na'u ceir. Weinidog, pryd y gall fy etholwyr ddisgwyl gwasanaeth trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus rhatach a mwy dibynadwy?

Well, certainly in relation to junction 48 of the M4 at Hendy, I am able to announce that we will be making investments in the next few months. Improving the traffic flow and easing congestion there is part of the economic stimulus that we've announced in response to Brexit. We are making more than £3 million available to put in lights and active travel improvements at Hendy, which should make a difference this financial year, which I'm very pleased about.

In terms of the broader point, we are working with the Department for Transport on increasing rail capacity from Swansea to London. I must say, we've been very frustrated by the progress that's been made. This was announced, you will remember, when the electrification of the main line was cancelled, and in the two years since then we've had virtually no communication from the Department for Transport to help us progress this. They've not shared documents with us, and they've not progressed this in the way that they promised us they would when they cancelled the electrification of the main line.

I must say also that I'm disappointed that we couldn't act in this place on a more cross-party basis to take this forward. When Carl Sargeant was transport Minister and a coalition was put together to make the case for electrification on the main line, that was done on the basis of all parties in this Chamber working together and making representations to Westminster, and Carl led a very successful campaign. Since the Conservatives unilaterally cancelled that deal and have not delivered on what they said they would as a result of that, we've heard silence from the Conservative benches, who have not been working with us to lobby the Department for Transport to put that right.

Wel, yn sicr mewn perthynas â chyffordd 48 yr M4 yn Hendy, gallaf gyhoeddi y byddwn yn buddsoddi yn yr ychydig fisoedd nesaf. Mae gwella llif y traffig a lliniaru tagfeydd yn rhan o'r ysgogiad economaidd rydym wedi'i gyhoeddi mewn ymateb i Brexit. Rydym yn darparu mwy na £3 miliwn i osod goleuadau a gwneud gwelliannau teithio llesol yn Hendy, a ddylai wneud gwahaniaeth yn ystod y flwyddyn ariannol hon, ac rwy'n falch iawn o hynny.

O ran y pwynt ehangach, rydym yn gweithio gyda'r Adran Drafnidiaeth i gynyddu capasiti trenau rhwng Abertawe a Llundain. Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud, mae'r cynnydd a wnaed wedi bod yn rhwystredig iawn. Cyhoeddwyd hyn, fe gofiwch, pan ganslwyd cynigion i drydaneiddio'r brif reilffordd, ac yn y ddwy flynedd ers hynny, nid ydym wedi clywed fawr ddim gan yr Adran Drafnidiaeth i'n cynorthwyo i fwrw ymlaen â hyn. Nid ydynt wedi rhannu dogfennau gyda ni, ac nid ydynt wedi bwrw ymlaen â hyn yn y ffordd y gwnaethant addo inni y byddent yn ei wneud pan wnaethant ganslo'r cynigion i drydaneiddio'r brif reilffordd.

Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud hefyd fy mod yn siomedig na allem weithredu yn y lle hwn ar sail fwy trawsbleidiol i fwrw ymlaen â hyn. Pan oedd Carl Sargeant yn Weinidog trafnidiaeth ffurfiwyd clymblaid i ddadlau'r achos dros drydaneiddio'r brif reilffordd, gwnaed hynny ar sail pob plaid yn y Siambr hon yn gweithio gyda'i gilydd a chyflwyno sylwadau i San Steffan, ac arweiniodd Carl ymgyrch lwyddiannus iawn. Ers i’r Ceidwadwyr ganslo’r fargen honno eu hunain a methu cyflawni’r hyn y dywedasant y byddent yn ei gyflawni o ganlyniad i hynny, ni chlywsom ddim byd ond distawrwydd oddi ar feinciau’r Ceidwadwyr nad ydynt wedi bod yn gweithio gyda ni i lobïo’r Adran Drafnidiaeth i wneud iawn am hynny.

So, I would hope that—. We're talking about rail, Darren, and this is the deal that the UK Government, the promise your Government made—

Felly, buaswn yn gobeithio bod—. Rydym yn siarad am reilffyrdd, Darren, a dyma'r fargen a wnaeth Llywodraeth y DU, yr addewid a wnaeth eich Llywodraeth—

Darren Millar is asking, 'What about roads?' Well, one subject at a time. Let's pay attention to rail, which is a deal that your Government made with all of us in this Chamber, not just our party, to deliver electrification of the main line, and you cancelled the deal. 

Mae Darren Millar yn gofyn, 'Beth am ffyrdd?' Wel, un pwnc ar y tro. Gadewch i ni roi sylw i reilffyrdd, sy'n fargen a wnaeth eich Llywodraeth â phob un ohonom yn y Siambr hon, nid ein plaid ni yn unig, i drydaneiddio'r brif reilffordd, ac fe wnaethoch chi ganslo'r fargen.

You promised improvements.

Fe wnaethoch chi addo gwelliannau.

You cancelled the deal, and you then said, in exchange for that—

Fe wnaethoch chi ganslo'r fargen, ac yna fe ddywedoch chi, yn gyfnewid am hynny—

Since Transport for Wales took over the rail service, have you seen the state of it?

Ers i Trafnidiaeth Cymru ddod yn gyfrifol am y gwasanaeth rheilffyrdd, a ydych wedi gweld ei gyflwr?

If you pay attention, you'll understand my reasoning.

Os gwnewch chi dalu sylw, fe ddeallwch fy rhesymeg.

You don't need to listen to Darren Millar when he's sat down.

Nid oes angen i chi wrando ar Darren Millar pan nad yw ar ei draed.

Well, when his microphone is on, Presiding Officer, it's very difficult not to.

Wel, Lywydd, mae'n anodd iawn peidio pan fo'i feicroffon ymlaen.

It's now gone off, I'm pleased to say.

You didn't stick to your deal. You haven't worked with us to get the replacement that you said you would put in place. So, it's time for you to examine your conscience and work with us on a cross-party basis again to deliver better improvements across the south Wales corridor.

Then, finally, to answer Caroline Jones's point, the south Wales Swansea bay metro, which we are working on along with the local authorities in the area, we have put some funding in that and we'll be putting more in to speed up the progress.

We also have increased capacity on the railway line. We've got new services and new fares being announced next month. We've got a 40 per cent increase in Sunday services across the network about to go live, as well as Sunday service on the Maesteg line for the first time. So, we are making progress, but we could make a damn sight more if the UK Government did its share of the work as well.

Mae bellach wedi diffodd, rwy'n falch o ddweud.

Ni wnaethoch gadw at eich bargen. Nid ydych wedi gweithio gyda ni i gael yr un newydd y dywedoch chi y byddech yn ei rhoi ar waith. Felly, mae'n bryd ichi archwilio'ch cydwybod a gweithio gyda ni ar sail drawsbleidiol unwaith eto i sicrhau gwell gwelliannau ar draws coridor de Cymru.

Yna, yn olaf, i ateb pwynt Caroline Jones, metro de Cymru bae Abertawe, rydym yn gweithio arno gyda'r awdurdodau lleol yn yr ardal, rydym wedi rhoi rhywfaint o gyllid i'r broses honno a byddwn yn rhoi mwy o gyllid er mwyn cyflymu'r cynnydd.

Rydym hefyd wedi cynyddu capasiti ar y rheilffordd. Mae gennym wasanaethau newydd a phrisiau tocynnau newydd a fydd yn cael eu cyhoeddi y mis nesaf. Mae 40 y cant yn fwy o wasanaethau dydd Sul ar fin cychwyn ar draws y rhwydwaith, yn ogystal â gwasanaeth dydd Sul ar reilffordd Maesteg am y tro cyntaf. Felly, rydym yn gwneud cynnydd, ond gallem wneud mwy o lawer pe bai Llywodraeth y DU yn gwneud ei chyfran o'r gwaith hefyd.

Seilwaith Trafnidiaeth yng Ngogledd Cymru
Transport Infrastructure in North Wales

7. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am seilwaith trafnidiaeth yng ngogledd Cymru? OAQ54636

7. Will the Minister make a statement on transport infrastructure in north Wales? OAQ54636

Well, I'm looking forward to this. [Laughter.] The Welsh Government will invest in all modes to deliver the modern, high-quality transport system that's fundamental to achieving our sustainability, in all senses of the word.

Wel, rwy'n edrych ymlaen at hyn. [Chwerthin.] Bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn buddsoddi ym mhob dull trafnidiaeth i ddarparu'r system drafnidiaeth fodern o ansawdd uchel sy'n hollbwysig i gyflawni ein cynaliadwyedd, ym mhob ystyr o'r gair.

One area of investment that you are responsible for but haven't taken very seriously is the need for investment in the A55 trunk road in my constituency. You will be aware of the significant disruption that often takes place on the A55, particularly when there is road maintenance taking place or, indeed, when there are accidents on that road because of the lack of a hard shoulder along significant parts of it. The failure to address the congestion on the A55 is having a devastating impact on our visitor experience, it's causing ambulances not to be able to get to patients on time or to get them to hospitals when they need to, and, of course, it's causing untold damage to the economy in terms of people not being able to get to or from work or, indeed, places of education or employment.

I give you the example of the recent roadworks in Llanddulas, which caused tailbacks that amounted to over an hour of extra travel time through the A55 in my constituency, and caused untold havoc on roads, including the B5381, the B5383, which I'm sure you're very familiar with, and the A547, all of which are local roads that cost a significant amount to repair once the heavy traffic from the A55, for which they're not designed, has to travel along them in order to avoid the chaos that your Government causes because of the lack of investment. So, can you tell us when will we see a proper upgrade of the A55 throughout north Wales, not just in Labour-held constituencies?

Un maes buddsoddi rydych yn gyfrifol amdano ond heb ei gymryd o ddifrif yw'r angen am fuddsoddiad yng nghefnffordd yr A55 yn fy etholaeth. Fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol o'r tarfu sylweddol sy'n digwydd yn aml ar yr A55, yn enwedig pan fydd gwaith cynnal a chadw yn mynd rhagddo ar y ffordd, neu yn wir, pan fydd damweiniau'n digwydd ar y ffordd honno o ganlyniad i'r diffyg llain galed ar rannau sylweddol ohoni. Mae'r methiant i fynd i'r afael â'r tagfeydd ar yr A55 yn cael effaith ddinistriol ar ein profiad i ymwelwyr, mae'n peri i ambiwlansys fethu cyrraedd cleifion mewn pryd neu eu cludo i ysbytai pan fydd angen, ac wrth gwrs, mae'n achosi niwed aruthrol i'r economi o ran pobl yn methu cyrraedd neu adael eu gwaith, neu leoliadau addysg neu gyflogaeth yn wir.

Un enghraifft yw'r gwaith ffordd diweddar yn Llanddulas, a achosodd dagfeydd a arweiniodd at dros awr o amser teithio ychwanegol ar yr A55 yn fy etholaeth, gan achosi anhrefn llwyr ar ffyrdd, gan gynnwys y B5381, y B5383, sy'n gyfarwydd iawn i chi, rwy'n siŵr, â'r A547, pob un ohonynt yn ffyrdd lleol sy'n costio cryn dipyn i'w hatgyweirio pan fydd yn rhaid i'r traffig trwm oddi ar yr A55, nad ydynt wedi'u cynllunio ar ei gyfer, deithio arnynt er mwyn osgoi'r anhrefn y mae eich Llywodraeth yn ei achosi oherwydd y diffyg buddsoddiad. Felly, a allwch ddweud wrthym pryd y gwelwn yr A55 yn cael ei huwchraddio'n iawn ar draws gogledd Cymru, nid mewn etholaethau Llafur yn unig?

14:10

So, just let me get this straight, is he complaining that we're not investing, or is he complaining that we are investing and then complaining about the roadworks that that investment causes? I'm not entirely clear of the tenor of his complaint. He can't have it all ways. When we are upgrading and investing, it involves disruption, and that is unfortunately a fact that we can't get away from.

We are investing in a range of initiatives at junctions 15 and 16 of the A55, where we have junction improvements and developments, and the A55 Abergwyngregyn to Tai'r Meibion improvement scheme, which is currently seeing investment. [Interruption.] It's a corridor, Darren Millar; you need investments right along the corridor. In the Flintshire corridor, the Dee river bridge improvement and in the Menai crossing, we are investing. In fact, we're investing £60 million a year of capital funding for local authorities to invest in a highways refurbishment scheme. 

But tackling congestion isn't just about road improvements, it's about a multimodal approach to give people alternatives to roads, and we are investing significantly in the railway. And I'm sure he will join me in welcoming an announcement that I can make—[Interruption.] Absolutely, there is something for Clwyd West. Pay attention. I look forward to the press release from you welcoming the fact that I can today announce a £1.6 million investment in Old Colwyn promenade for the upgrade to improve active travel facilities and raised coastal defences. [Interruption.] He says, 'About time'; there's no pleasing some people, is there? So, we are investing in Clwyd West and we're investing in active travel to encourage modal shift, so I'm sure you'll welcome that. 

Gadewch i mi ddeall hyn yn iawn, a yw'n cwyno nad ydym yn buddsoddi, neu a yw'n cwyno ein bod yn buddsoddi ac yna'n cwyno am y gwaith ffordd y mae'r buddsoddiad hwnnw'n ei achosi? Nid wyf yn deall ei gŵyn yn iawn. Ni all ei chael hi bob ffordd. Pan fyddwn yn uwchraddio ac yn buddsoddi, mae hynny'n golygu tarfu, ac yn anffodus mae honno'n ffaith na allwn ei hosgoi.

Rydym yn buddsoddi mewn ystod o fentrau ar gyffyrdd 15 ac 16 ar yr A55, lle mae gennym ddatblygiadau a gwelliannau ar waith ar y cyffyrdd, a chynllun ar gyfer gwella ffordd yr A55 Abergwyngregyn i Dai’r Meibion, y buddsoddir ynddo ar hyn o bryd. [Torri ar draws.] Mae'n goridor, Darren Millar; mae arnoch angen buddsoddiadau ar hyd y coridor. Yng nghoridor Sir y Fflint, gwelliannau pont afon Dyfrdwy a chroesfan y Fenai, rydym yn buddsoddi. Mewn gwirionedd, rydym yn buddsoddi £60 miliwn y flwyddyn o arian cyfalaf i awdurdodau lleol ei fuddsoddi mewn cynllun adnewyddu priffyrdd.

Ond nid yw mynd i'r afael â thagfeydd yn golygu gwella ffyrdd yn unig, mae'n ymwneud â dull amlfoddol i roi dewisiadau amgen i bobl yn lle ffyrdd, ac rydym yn buddsoddi'n sylweddol yn y rheilffordd. Ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd yn ymuno â mi i groesawu cyhoeddiad y gallaf ei wneud—[Torri ar draws.] Yn sicr, mae rhywbeth ar gyfer Gorllewin Clwyd. Talwch sylw. Edrychaf ymlaen at weld y datganiad i'r wasg gennych yn croesawu'r ffaith y gallaf gyhoeddi buddsoddiad o £1.6 miliwn heddiw ym mhromenâd Hen Golwyn ar gyfer y gwaith uwchraddio i wella cyfleusterau teithio llesol a chodi amddiffynfeydd arfordirol uwch. [Torri ar draws.] Mae'n dweud, 'Hen bryd'; nid oes plesio ar rai pobl. Felly, rydym yn buddsoddi yng Ngorllewin Clwyd ac rydym yn buddsoddi mewn teithio llesol i annog newid moddol, felly rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn croesawu hynny.

Cynyddu Capasiti Teithwyr yn Islwyn
Increasing Passenger Capacity in Islwyn

8. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am gynlluniau Trafnidiaeth Cymru i gynyddu capasiti teithwyr ar gyfer defnyddwyr rheilffyrdd yn Islwyn? OAQ54629

8. Will the Minister provide an update on Transport for Wales's plans to increase passenger capacity for rail users in Islwyn? OAQ54629

The Minister, Ken Skates, set out his vision for rail in Wales in his statement on 24 September. As part of our ambitious plans for the south Wales metro, Transport for Wales will deliver additional services, with improved rolling stock and stations in Islwyn.

Nododd y Gweinidog, Ken Skates, ei weledigaeth ar gyfer rheilffyrdd yng Nghymru yn ei ddatganiad ar 24 Medi. Fel rhan o'n cynlluniau uchelgeisiol ar gyfer metro de Cymru, bydd Trafnidiaeth Cymru yn darparu gwasanaethau ychwanegol, gyda gwell cerbydau trenau a gorsafoedd yn Islwyn.

Diolch, Deputy Minister. Thank you for that answer. The Ebbw Vale to Cardiff line reopened by the Welsh Labour Government has been one of the most visible success stories of devolution. In the 11 years since the line has been reopened, passengers have flocked to use the hourly service. As the Member for Islwyn, I will continue to eulogise around the previously unavailable benefits that this has offered the Islwyn communities of Risca, Newbridge and Cross Keys. However, forward movement is the point, as will be the extension to Newport.

Transport for Wales announced in October of this year plans to introduce far greater capacity for up to 6,500 more commuters a week from December this year across the network, and the additional news that Islwyn passengers on the Ebbw Vale to Cardiff line will have the benefit of fit-for-purpose modern class 170 trains with real space on board, passenger information systems, accessible toilets, air conditioning, Wi-Fi and power sockets. So, Deputy Minister, what can I tell the people of Islwyn about when they will see this improved capacity for carriage trains on their line, and what is the timescale for the first class 170 train to run on that line?

Diolch, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Diolch am eich ateb. Mae rheilffordd Glyn Ebwy i Gaerdydd, a ailagorwyd gan Lywodraeth Lafur Cymru, wedi bod yn un o lwyddiannau mwyaf gweladwy datganoli. Yn yr 11 mlynedd ers ailagor y rheilffordd, mae teithwyr wedi heidio i ddefnyddio'r gwasanaeth bob awr. Fel yr Aelod dros Islwyn, byddaf yn parhau i ganmol y manteision nad oeddent ar gael o'r blaen y mae hyn yn eu cynnig i gymunedau Rhisga, Trecelyn a Crosskeys yn Islwyn. Fodd bynnag, symud ymlaen yw'r pwynt, a dyna fydd yn digwydd gyda'r estyniad i Gasnewydd.

Cyhoeddodd Trafnidiaeth Cymru gynlluniau ym mis Hydref eleni i gyflwyno llawer mwy o gapasiti ar gyfer hyd at 6,500 o gymudwyr ychwanegol bob wythnos o fis Rhagfyr eleni ymlaen ar draws y rhwydwaith, a’r newyddion ychwanegol y bydd teithwyr o Islwyn ar reilffordd Glyn Ebwy i Gaerdydd yn elwa o drenau modern dosbarth 170 sy'n addas at y diben, gyda digonedd o le, systemau gwybodaeth i deithwyr, toiledau hygyrch, systemau aerdymheru, wi-fi a socedi trydan. Felly, Ddirprwy Weinidog, beth y gallaf ei ddweud wrth bobl Islwyn ynglŷn â phryd y gallant weld y capasiti gwell hwn ar drenau ar eu rheilffordd, a beth yw'r amserlen ar gyfer y trên dosbarth 170 cyntaf ar y rheilffordd honno?

Well, I think Rhianon Passmore has stolen my thunder. [Laughter.] She's included the announcement in the question, and she's quite right to say it. We should be proud of the real improvements we're making to the communities she represents so ably in the Chamber. From 16 December this year, as part of the December timetable change, there will be class 170 trains between Cardiff and Ebbw Vale and between Cheltenham and Maesteg, with the benefit of modern class 170 trains, with more space, onboard passenger information systems, accessible toilets, air conditioning, wi-fi and power sockets, which will provide space for up to 6,500 more commuters every week, a real tangible benefit, as a result of the rail leadership the Welsh Government are providing. And by December 2022, there'll be even more increases in capacity, with an extra 180 seats on the Ebbw Vale to Cardiff line in morning peak, and that is something we should celebrate, and it is as a direct result of the action this Labour Government is taking to improve the facilities for people in Islwyn.

Wel, credaf fod Rhianon Passmore wedi achub y blaen arnaf. [Chwerthin.] Roedd ei chwestiwn yn cynnwys y cyhoeddiad, ac mae'n llygad ei lle i ddweud hynny. Dylem fod yn falch o'r gwelliannau gwirioneddol rydym yn eu gwneud i'r cymunedau y mae'n eu cynrychioli mor dda yn y Siambr. O 16 Rhagfyr eleni ymlaen, fel rhan o'r newid i'r amserlen ym mis Rhagfyr, bydd trenau dosbarth 170 yn gweithredu rhwng Caerdydd a Glyn Ebwy a rhwng Cheltenham a Maesteg, gyda manteision trenau dosbarth 170 modern, gyda mwy o le, systemau gwybodaeth i deithwyr ar y trenau, toiledau hygyrch, systemau aerdymheru, wi-fi a socedi trydan, a fydd yn darparu lle i hyd at 6,500 o gymudwyr ychwanegol bob wythnos, mantais wirioneddol o ganlyniad i arweinyddiaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar reilffyrdd. Ac erbyn mis Rhagfyr 2022, bydd mwy o gynnydd eto yn y capasiti, gyda 180 sedd ychwanegol ar reilffordd Glyn Ebwy i Gaerdydd yn ystod oriau brig y bore, ac mae hynny'n rhywbeth y dylem ei ddathlu, ac mae'n digwydd o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i'r camau y mae'r Llywodraeth Lafur hon yn eu cymryd i wella'r cyfleusterau i bobl yn Islwyn.

14:15
Economi Ardal Bae Abertawe
The Economy of the Swansea Bay Area

9. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am economi ardal bae Abertawe? OAQ54620

9. Will the Minister make a statement on the economy of the Swansea bay area? OAQ54620

Yes. Between 2011 and 2017, gross value added per head in the Swansea bay area increased by 14.3 per cent, and in 2018, there were 18,025 active enterprises in the Swansea bay area.

Gwnaf. Rhwng 2011 a 2017, cynyddodd gwerth ychwanegol gros y pen yn ardal bae Abertawe 14.3 y cant, ac yn 2018, roedd 18,025 o fentrau gweithredol yn ardal bae Abertawe.

One of the highlights of it is the SA1 development that is in my constituency, which is a mixed development including houses and flats, hotels, restaurants and major employers that includes Admiral, University of Wales Trinity Saint David and companies with substantial growth potential, such as the Wales Centre for Advanced Batch Manufacture. Much of that has been done due to investment by the private sector and the Welsh Government. How much has been invested in the area, and how much more is there expected to be?

Un o'r uchafbwyntiau yw datblygiad SA1 yn fy etholaeth, sef datblygiad cymysg sy'n cynnwys tai a fflatiau, gwestai, bwytai a chyflogwyr mawr sy'n cynnwys Admiral, Prifysgol Cymru y Drindod Dewi Sant a chwmnïau â photensial twf sylweddol, fel Canolfan Cymru ar gyfer Gweithgynhyrchu Swp Uwch. Cyflawnwyd llawer o hynny o ganlyniad i fuddsoddiad gan y sector preifat a Llywodraeth Cymru. Faint sydd wedi'i fuddsoddi yn yr ardal, a faint yn fwy y gellir ei ddisgwyl?

The Welsh Government has invested £59 million in the SA1 development, and on top of that, Swansea University has secured £100 million of European Union funds to support major new facilities and research and development programmes in the development. On top of that, working with the Swansea bay city region and the UK Government, we are investing further in Swansea city centre through the city deal. We would like to make further interventions through the movement of the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency into Swansea city centre, which we think would have a tangible impact on the whole of Swansea—Swansea east and west. Unfortunately, we've had no luck engaging the UK Government on that, but I would certainly welcome a campaign of regional Members to try and work with us to try and get that, because I think that could make a significant impact on the fabric of Swansea.

I think the other question, to respond to the broader point that Mike Hedges is making, is how we spread the development of SA1 beyond that into his constituency, which has some of the most economically challenged wards in the country. There, our regional approach and our commitment to the foundational economy I think has much potential.

Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi buddsoddi £59 miliwn yn natblygiad SA1, ac yn ychwanegol at hynny, mae Prifysgol Abertawe wedi sicrhau £100 miliwn o gronfeydd yr Undeb Ewropeaidd i gefnogi cyfleusterau newydd pwysig a rhaglenni ymchwil a datblygu yn y datblygiad. Yn ogystal â hynny, gan weithio gyda dinas-ranbarth bae Abertawe a Llywodraeth y DU, rydym yn buddsoddi ymhellach yng nghanol dinas Abertawe drwy'r fargen ddinesig. Hoffem wneud ymyriadau pellach drwy symud yr Asiantaeth Trwyddedu Gyrwyr a Cherbydau i ganol dinas Abertawe, a fyddai, yn ein barn ni, yn cael effaith bendant ar Abertawe gyfan—dwyrain a gorllewin Abertawe. Yn anffodus, nid ydym wedi cael unrhyw lwc wrth ymgysylltu â Llywodraeth y DU ynghylch hynny, ond buaswn yn sicr yn croesawu ymgyrch gan Aelodau rhanbarthol i geisio gweithio gyda ni i wneud hynny, gan y credaf y gallai gael effaith sylweddol ar wead Abertawe.

Credaf mai'r cwestiwn arall, i ymateb i'r pwynt ehangach y mae Mike Hedges yn ei wneud, yw sut y lledaenwn ddatblygiad SA1 y tu hwnt i hynny i'w etholaeth, sy'n cynnwys rhai o'r wardiau mwyaf economaidd ddifreintiedig yn y wlad. Yno, credaf fod gan ein hymagwedd ranbarthol a'n hymrwymiad i'r economi sylfaenol gryn dipyn o botensial.

Ocê. Diolch yn fawr am hynny. Sori.

Okay. Thank you very much for that. Sorry.

You mentioned the Swansea bay city deal, Deputy Minister, and, of course, we're waiting for the first £18 million of that to come through. I understand the delay is down to Welsh Government not telling the city deal lead, Rob Stewart, a Labour colleague of yours, the terms and conditions of the £18 million that they've been waiting for. He's complained that it's taken 16 weeks, which is far too long. Can you tell us what the reason for the delay is, please?   

Fe sonioch chi am fargen ddinesig bae Abertawe, Ddirprwy Weinidog, ac wrth gwrs, rydym yn dal i aros i £18 miliwn cyntaf y fargen ddod drwodd. Deallaf mai'r rheswm dros yr oedi yw nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dweud wrth arweinydd y fargen ddinesig, Rob Stewart, un o'ch cymheiriaid Llafur, beth yw telerau ac amodau'r £18 miliwn y maent wedi bod yn aros amdano. Mae wedi cwyno ei bod wedi cymryd 16 wythnos, sy'n rhy hir o lawer. A allwch ddweud wrthym beth yw'r rheswm am yr oedi, os gwelwch yn dda?

The way that the city deal project has been set up by the UK Government and the Treasury has been extremely challenging and complicated for local authorities that are not kitted out to take projects through a five-case business model approach. Two independent reports done into the city deal pointed out that the capacity did not exist locally and, as a result, great frustration was building up on the part of local authorities who had the ideas and they had the plans to take these projects forward, but simply could not meet the tests of the business cases demanded by the Treasury, which we then had to discharge as part of the heads of terms of the city deal. So, it's been a very frustrating process all round. Those independent reports suggested a series of reforms to blast that out of the way, and the region is making progress in delivering those. Part of meeting the concerns laid out in that report was the implementation of terms and conditions to make sure the money would be well spent, and we've been working through with the region the detailed implementation of those terms and conditions. I believe we are very close to the point of being able to sign them off.

Mae'r ffordd y mae prosiect y fargen ddinesig wedi'i sefydlu gan Lywodraeth y DU a'r Trysorlys wedi bod yn hynod heriol a chymhleth i awdurdodau lleol nad oes ganddynt fodd o fynd â phrosiectau drwy ddull model busnes pum achos. Mae dau adroddiad annibynnol a gwblhawyd ar y fargen ddinesig wedi nodi nad oedd capasiti'n bodoli'n lleol, ac o ganlyniad, roedd cryn dipyn o rwystredigaeth yn cronni ar ran awdurdodau lleol a oedd â'r syniadau a'r cynlluniau i fwrw ymlaen â'r prosiectau hyn, ond ni allent fodloni meini prawf yr achosion busnes roedd y Trysorlys yn eu mynnu, a bu'n rhaid i ni eu cyflawni wedyn fel rhan o benawdau telerau'r fargen ddinesig. Felly, bu'n broses rwystredig iawn ym mhob ffordd. Awgrymodd yr adroddiadau annibynnol hynny gyfres o ddiwygiadau i gael gwared ar hynny, ac mae'r rhanbarth yn gwneud cynnydd wrth eu cyflawni. Rhan o'r ateb i'r pryderon a nodwyd yn yr adroddiad hwnnw oedd rhoi telerau ac amodau ar waith i sicrhau y byddai'r arian yn cael ei wario'n dda, ac rydym wedi bod yn gweithio gyda'r rhanbarth i roi'r telerau a'r amodau hynny ar waith yn fanwl. Credaf ein bod yn agos iawn at allu eu cymeradwyo.

Diolch i'r Dirprwy Weinidog. 

Thank you to the Deputy Minister. 

2. Cwestiynau i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol a’r Gweinidog Brexit (yn rhinwedd ei gyfrifoldebau fel Gweinidog Brexit)
2. Questions to the Counsel General and Brexit Minister (in respect of his Brexit Minister responsibilities)

Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw'r cwestiynau i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol yn rhinwedd ei gyfrifoldeb fel Gweinidog Brexit. Mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf [OAQ54630] wedi'i dynnu yn ôl, felly cwestiwn 2—Mike Hedges.

The next item, therefore, is questions to the Counsel General in respect of his Brexit Minister responsibilities. The first question [OAQ54630] has been withdrawn, therefore question 2—Mike Hedges.

14:20
Effaith Brexit ar Buro Dŵr Yfed
The Impact of Brexit on Drinking Water Purification

2. Pa asesiad y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'i wneud o effaith Brexit ar buro dŵr yfed? OAQ54619

2. What assessment has the Counsel General made of the impact of Brexit on drinking water purification? OAQ54619

Primary responsibility for providing clean, safe drinking water lies with the water companies. The water companies, working with the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, water regulators and the devolved Governments, carried out robust and detailed mitigation planning to prevent impacts on the supply of safe and clean water once the UK leaves the European Union.

Y cwmnïau dŵr sydd â'r prif gyfrifoldeb am ddarparu dŵr yfed glân a diogel. Mae'r cwmnïau dŵr, gan weithio gydag Adran yr Amgylchedd, Bwyd a Materion Gwledig, rheoleiddwyr dŵr a'r Llywodraethau datganoledig, wedi cynhyrchu cynlluniau lliniaru cadarn a manwl i atal effeithiau ar gyflenwad dŵr diogel a glân pan fydd y DU yn gadael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd.

One of the most important things in life is clean drinking water, as many people in some third-world countries discover daily, unfortunately. What Brexit has taught us, however, is how hollowed-out our economy has become and how dependent on imports for basic necessities we as a country have become. While it's not life changing to only be able to buy seasonal vegetables, lack of clean water is life changing and possibly life ending. What is the Welsh Government doing to ensure the continuity of supply of chemicals needed for water purification, and what support are they giving to the water company covering most of Wales and the other water company covering the rest of Wales in order to ensure that the water we get out of our taps is clean and of the standard we expect and we are having now?

Un o'r pethau pwysicaf mewn bywyd yw dŵr yfed glân, fel y mae llawer o bobl mewn rhai o wledydd y trydydd byd yn ei ddarganfod bob dydd, yn anffodus. Yr hyn y mae Brexit wedi'i ddysgu inni, fodd bynnag, yw'r ffordd y mae ein heconomi wedi teneuo a pha mor ddibynnol rydym ni fel gwlad ar fewnforio angenrheidiau sylfaenol. Er nad yw'n newid bywyd i allu prynu llysiau tymhorol yn unig, mae diffyg dŵr glân yn newid bywydau ac o bosibl yn rhoi diwedd ar fywydau. Beth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i sicrhau parhad y cyflenwad o gemegau sydd eu hangen i buro dŵr, a pha gefnogaeth y maent yn ei rhoi i'r cwmni dŵr sy'n gwasanaethu'r rhan fwyaf o Gymru a'r cwmni dŵr arall sy'n gwasanaethu gweddill Cymru er mwyn sicrhau bod y dŵr a gawn o'n tapiau yn lân ac o'r ansawdd rydym yn ei ddisgwyl ac yn ei gael ar hyn o bryd?

Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd (Ann Jones) i’r Gadair.

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Ann Jones) took the Chair.

I thank the Member for that supplementary question. This is a very important question, of course. Wales has some of the highest quality drinking water in Europe, with our compliance against the relevant standards standing at 99.95 per cent. So, it's an important issue for us and we will always want to continue to align to those standards, wherever Brexit takes us. He will be aware, of course, that security of the water supply in the UK has been part of the Operation Yellowhammer planning process, and the water industries' representative body, Water UK, and the water companies, including those operating in Wales, have been working collectively to ensure they have a granular understanding of the supply chain. They've taken specific measures in relation to stockpiling critical chemicals used to treat water, as well as establishing mutual aid arrangements with other water companies. In a worst-case scenario—but we think it's very unlikely this would be necessary—the statutes give Welsh Ministers power to issue directions to our water companies to mitigate any effects that might arise.

Diolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn atodol. Mae hwn yn gwestiwn pwysig iawn, wrth gwrs. Mae gan Gymru beth o'r dŵr yfed o'r safon uchaf yn Ewrop, gyda'n cydymffurfiaeth yn erbyn y safonau perthnasol yn 99.95 y cant. Felly, mae'n fater pwysig i ni, a byddwn bob amser yn awyddus i barhau i fodloni'r safonau hynny, ni waeth beth fydd yn digwydd yn sgil Brexit. Fe fydd yn ymwybodol, wrth gwrs, fod diogelwch y cyflenwad dŵr yn y DU wedi bod yn rhan o broses gynllunio Operation Yellowhammer, ac mae corff cynrychiadol y diwydiannau dŵr, Water UK, a’r cwmnïau dŵr, gan gynnwys y rheini sy’n gweithredu yng Nghymru, wedi bod yn gweithio ar y cyd i sicrhau bod ganddynt ddealltwriaeth fanwl o'r gadwyn gyflenwi. Maent wedi cymryd camau penodol mewn perthynas â chasglu cemegau hanfodol a ddefnyddir i drin dŵr, yn ogystal â sefydlu trefniadau cyd-gymorth gyda chwmnïau dŵr eraill. Yn y senario waethaf—ond credwn ei bod yn annhebygol iawn y byddai hyn yn angenrheidiol—mae'r statudau'n rhoi'r grym i Weinidogion Cymru roi cyfarwyddiadau i'n cwmnïau dŵr liniaru unrhyw effeithiau a allai godi.

Diwydiant yng Ngogledd Cymru
Industry in North Wales

3. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'u cael gyda diwydiant yng ngogledd Cymru yn dilyn cyhoeddi estyniad i Brexit tan 31 Ionawr 2020? OAQ54631

3. What discussions has the Counsel General had with industry in north Wales following the announcement of a Brexit extension until 31 January 2020? OAQ54631

My ministerial colleagues and I have engaged widely with businesses on Brexit issues as part of our engagement with stakeholders across Wales. Most recently, the Minister for Economy and Transport led a round-table meeting on small and medium-sized enterprise access to finance on 24 October in Wrexham.

Mae fy nghyd-Weinidogion a minnau wedi ymgysylltu'n helaeth â busnesau ar faterion sy'n ymwneud â Brexit fel rhan o'n gwaith ymgysylltu â rhanddeiliaid ledled Cymru. Yn fwyaf diweddar, arweiniodd Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth gyfarfod bord gron ar fynediad busnesau bach a chanolig at gyllid ar 24 Hydref yn Wrecsam.

Diolch yn fawr, Minister, for that answer. Alyn and Deeside is home to some of Wales's most high-tech and advanced industry and the dedicated and skilled workforce that are within that area. For these employers and those employees, planning is key. Can the Minister detail further the contact he and his officials, and any other ministerial colleagues, have had with the major employers within the area and the associated trade unions, like Unite the Union, to ensure that they can continue to plan? Can he also spell out what other support is there available to them? And, finally, how confident is he that the UK Government, the Tory UK Government, are listening to these groups and these employers for the sake of their families and are sharing the relevant information with them?

Diolch yn fawr am eich ateb, Weinidog. Mae Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy yn gartref i rai o ddiwydiannau mwyaf uwch-dechnolegol a blaengar Cymru a'r gweithlu ymroddedig a medrus sydd yn yr ardal honno. I'r cyflogwyr a'r gweithwyr hyn, mae cynllunio'n allweddol. A all y Gweinidog fanylu ymhellach ar y cyswllt y mae ef a'i swyddogion, ac unrhyw gyd-weinidogion eraill, wedi'i gael gyda phrif gyflogwyr yr ardal a'r undebau llafur cysylltiedig, fel undeb Unite, i sicrhau y gallant barhau i gynllunio? A all nodi hefyd pa gymorth arall sydd ar gael iddynt? Ac yn olaf, pa mor hyderus yw ef fod Llywodraeth y DU, Llywodraeth Dorïaidd y DU, yn gwrando ar y grwpiau hyn a'r cyflogwyr hyn er lles eu teuluoedd ac yn rhannu'r wybodaeth berthnasol â hwy?

I thank the Member for that question. Since his time in the Chamber, he has always sought to understand the impact of Brexit on his constituency and on employers there, so I appreciate his continuing concern in relation to that.

The Welsh Government continues to engage with businesses in a variety of different ways, either face-to-face direct engagement, round-table sessions, which both the Minister for the Economy and Transport and I and others have led on, communications via Business Wales and the business support networks, as well as a range of media channels. He'll know that the Government is providing ongoing business support through the economy futures fund and the work of the Development Bank of Wales, and the Minister for Economy and Transport most recently announced a further £6 million for the Brexit resilience fund, announced at the end of last week, which consists of a blend of grant and loan funding that companies can apply for. And in addition to that, we continue to do everything we can to publicise and promote the information that we have on the Paratoi Cymru/Preparing Wales website, which includes the Brexit portal, which has had, I think, 39,000 users to date.

Diolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn. Ers iddo ddod i'r Siambr, mae bob amser wedi ceisio deall effaith Brexit ar ei etholaeth ac ar gyflogwyr yno, felly rwy’n gwerthfawrogi ei bryder parhaus mewn perthynas â hynny.

Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i ymgysylltu â busnesau mewn amryw o wahanol ffyrdd, naill ai drwy ymgysylltu'n uniongyrchol wyneb yn wyneb, sesiynau bord gron, sy'n rhywbeth y mae Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth a minnau ac eraill wedi arwain arnynt, cyfathrebiadau drwy Busnes Cymru a'r rhwydweithiau cymorth busnes, yn ogystal ag ystod o sianeli'r cyfryngau. Fe fydd yn ymwybodol fod y Llywodraeth yn darparu cymorth busnes parhaus drwy gronfa dyfodol yr economi a gwaith Banc Datblygu Cymru, ac yn fwyaf diweddar, cyhoeddodd Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth £6 miliwn arall ar gyfer cronfa cydnerthedd Brexit a gyhoeddwyd ddiwedd yr wythnos diwethaf, sy'n cynnwys cyfuniad o arian grant a chyllid benthyciad y gall cwmnïau wneud cais amdano. Ac yn ogystal â hynny, rydym yn parhau i wneud popeth yn ein gallu i hyrwyddo a rhoi cyhoeddusrwydd i'r wybodaeth sydd gennym ar wefan Paratoi Cymru, sy'n cynnwys y porth Brexit, sydd wedi cael 39,000 o ddefnyddwyr hyd yn hyn, rwy'n credu.

14:25

In September, the CBI director general Carolyn Fairbairn said:

'So many businesses here in Wales are full of optimism and enthusiasm. They want to be talking about—and acting on—Welsh strengths. To signal that Wales is open for business. But desperately want to put an end to uncertainty.'

Quoting businesses in north Wales at the start of October, the Daily Post said:

'Uncertainty fuels uncertainty. We need an end to all Brexit uncertainty.'

In mid October, the chair of Ocado and the former Marks and Spencer boss, Stuart Rose, said he now supports the new UK Government deal, saying he was involved in the original 'remain' campaign, but he's also a realist, and he said he hoped he's a pragmatist and a respecter of the democratic process.

And, finally, the chief economist and strategist at city investment firm Schroders said passing the new deal could unlock stronger growth in the economy:

'if the deal passes through Parliament on Saturday',

which it didn't,

'we should see stronger growth in the UK economy as the cloud of Brexit uncertainty lifts.'

What action are you taking to listen to industry and business, whose key concern is that lack of certainty, and to avoid, therefore, dragging this out for months more as parties seek to renegotiate, re-referendum or what have you. The future growth of the Welsh economy and the well-being of employment and people in Wales depends on that certainty, articulated so effectively by business. Uncertainty needs to end.

Ym mis Medi, dywedodd cyfarwyddwr cyffredinol Cydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain, Carolyn Fairbairn:

Mae cymaint o fusnesau yma yng Nghymru yn llawn optimistiaeth a brwdfrydedd. Maent yn awyddus i sôn am—a gweithredu ar—gryfderau Cymru. I nodi bod Cymru'n agored ar gyfer busnes. Ond maent yn wirioneddol awyddus i roi terfyn ar ansicrwydd.

Gan ddyfynnu busnesau yng ngogledd Cymru ddechrau mis Hydref, dywedodd y Daily Post:

Mae ansicrwydd yn bwydo ansicrwydd. Mae angen inni roi terfyn ar holl ansicrwydd Brexit.

Yng nghanol mis Hydref, dywedodd cadeirydd Ocado a chyn-bennaeth Marks and Spencer, Stuart Rose, ei fod bellach yn cefnogi cytundeb newydd Llywodraeth y DU, gan ddweud ei fod yn rhan o’r ymgyrch wreiddiol i 'aros', ond ei fod hefyd yn realydd, a dywedodd ei fod yn gobeithio ei fod yn bragmatydd ac yn parchu'r broses ddemocrataidd.

Ac yn olaf, dywedodd prif economegydd a strategydd cwmni buddsoddi Schroders y gallai derbyn y cytundeb newydd ddatgloi twf cryfach yn yr economi:

os yw'r cytundeb yn cael ei basio gan Senedd y DU ddydd Sadwrn,

rhywbeth na ddigwyddodd,

dylem weld twf cryfach yn economi'r DU wrth i gwmwl ansicrwydd Brexit godi.

Pa gamau rydych yn eu cymryd i wrando ar ddiwydiant a busnes ynglŷn â'u prif bryder, sef y diffyg sicrwydd hwnnw, a thrwy hynny, osgoi rhygnu ymlaen â hyn am fisoedd yn rhagor wrth i bleidiau geisio ailnegodi, ailgynnal refferendwm neu beth bynnag. Mae twf economi Cymru yn y dyfodol a lles cyflogaeth a phobl yng Nghymru yn dibynnu ar y sicrwydd hwnnw, a fynegwyd mor effeithiol gan y byd busnes. Mae angen rhoi diwedd ar yr ansicrwydd.

Well, I welcome and appreciate the Member's concern for the interests of business. If only that was shared by his parliamentary party in Westminster who have ridden roughshod over the concerns of business since the beginning of the Brexit debate.

I, too, heard the remarks of Carolyn Fairbairn, and I think I also heard her say that business investment was 26 per cent under trend as a consequence of Brexit. And also, business growth was several percentage points beneath what would we expect it to be.

He's right, in fact, to identify the question of uncertainty. We hear every day in Wales the impact that Brexit is already having on businesses and employers and livelihoods right across the country. But the alternative universe that he's positing is one where this deal is good for business, and it just is not. And the notion that this deal draws this matter to a certain close is complete fiction. This is a bad deal and it gives us the certainty of a bad deal for businesses right across Wales. We are looking at substantial additional costs for small businesses that export that they can barely afford to pay. Maybe he'll confirm to me if the UK Government is planning on compensating them for that. But otherwise, these are significant burdens that businesses in Wales can ill afford to have to take on.

Wel, rwy'n croesawu ac yn gwerthfawrogi pryderon yr Aelod ynghylch buddiannau busnes. O na byddai ei blaid seneddol yn San Steffan, sydd wedi sathru ar bryderon busnes ers dechrau dadl Brexit, yn rhannu'r un pryderon.

Clywais innau sylwadau Carolyn Fairbairn, a chredaf imi ei chlywed yn dweud hefyd fod buddsoddiad busnes 26 y cant o dan y duedd o ganlyniad i Brexit. Ac yn ogystal, roedd twf busnes sawl pwynt canran yn is na'r hyn y byddem yn ei ddisgwyl.

Mae'n llygad ei le, mewn gwirionedd, i nodi mater ansicrwydd. Rydym yn clywed bob dydd yng Nghymru am yr effaith y mae Brexit eisoes yn ei chael ar fusnesau a chyflogwyr a bywoliaeth pobl ledled y wlad. Ond mae'r bydysawd amgen y mae'n sôn amdano yn un lle mae'r cytundeb hwn yn dda i fusnes, ac nid yw hynny'n wir. Ac mae'r syniad fod y cytundeb yn rhoi diwedd pendant i'r mater hwn yn ffuglen bur. Mae hwn yn gytundeb gwael ac mae'n rhoi sicrwydd i ni o fargen wael i fusnesau ledled Cymru. Rydym yn edrych ar gostau ychwanegol sylweddol i fusnesau bach sy'n allforio, costau nad ydynt prin yn gallu fforddio'u talu. Efallai y gall gadarnhau i mi a yw Llywodraeth y DU yn bwriadu eu digolledu am hynny. Ond fel arall, mae'r rhain yn feichiau sylweddol na all busnesau yng Nghymru fforddio gorfod eu hysgwyddo.

Uncertainty needs to end, yes, but for very many businesses, the very threat of Brexit needs to end. Let me read to you from an e-mail I've received from a constituent who runs a small consultancy from Anglesey, with the majority of the business's money coming from the European Union:

'The damage that Brexit so far has done to our business is significant',

he says,

'mainly due to the ill feeling that other countries feel towards the UK. We have been excluded from several projects because of risk or other such excuses. This is a real pity for what was a growing business providing income, tax and jobs in the area. Now we're stagnant and waiting for all this to pass so that we can resume growth.'

And he was asking for my reassurance that I'd campaign for 'remain'. I can certainly give him a categorical assurance on that front. But what countless companies like that can see is that the delays of a few months here or there aren't really what's relevant—it's that threat of what they lose from not being within the European Union, and there is no deal, they see, that is as good as the one that they have now.

Mae angen i'r ansicrwydd ddod i ben, oes, ond i lawer iawn o fusnesau, mae angen i fygythiad Brexit ynddo'i hun ddod i ben. Gadewch imi ddarllen rhan o e-bost a dderbyniais gan etholwr sy'n rhedeg cwmni ymgynghorol bach ar Ynys Môn, gyda'r rhan fwyaf o arian y busnes yn dod o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd:

Mae'r niwed y mae Brexit wedi'i wneud hyd yn hyn i'n busnes yn sylweddol,

meddai,

yn bennaf oherwydd y drwgdeimlad y mae gwledydd eraill yn ei deimlo tuag at y DU. Rydym wedi cael ein cau allan o sawl prosiect oherwydd risg neu esgusodion eraill o'r fath. Mae hyn yn drueni mawr i fusnes a oedd yn tyfu ac yn darparu incwm, trethi a swyddi yn yr ardal. Rydym bellach yn aros yn ein hunfan ac yn aros i hyn i gyd ddod i ben fel y gallwn ailddechrau tyfu.

Ac roedd yn gofyn am fy sicrwydd y buaswn yn ymgyrchu dros 'aros'. Yn sicr, gallaf roi sicrwydd pendant iddo o ran hynny. Ond yr hyn y gall cwmnïau dirifedi o'r fath ei weld yw nad yr oedi o ychydig fisoedd fan hyn fan draw yw'r hyn sy'n berthnasol mewn gwirionedd—ond y bygythiad o ran yr hyn a gollant o beidio â bod yn rhan o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd, ac fe welant nad oes yna gytundeb sydd cystal â'r un sydd ganddynt ar hyn o bryd.

I will, if I may, echo the points the Member has just made. I mean, his experience and the issues that his constituents have raised with him strike a very clear chord with what we hear from businesses all the time. It was only last week, I think, or the week before, that I had an e-mail from a leading figure of the business community saying the notion that the Boris Johnson deal is the solution to business uncertainty is complete fiction. And I think, and I share with the Member his conviction, that the best way of getting the certainty that businesses in Wales have been able to flourish under, as a consequence of our membership of the European Union, is for us to have a referendum where we can campaign to remain and win that argument.

Os caf, rwyf am adleisio'r pwyntiau y mae'r Aelod newydd eu gwneud. Hynny yw, mae ei brofiad a'r materion y mae ei etholwyr wedi'u codi gydag ef yn adleisio'r hyn a glywn gan fusnesau drwy'r amser. Yr wythnos diwethaf, rwy’n credu, neu’r wythnos cynt, cefais e-bost gan ffigwr blaenllaw yn y gymuned fusnes yn dweud bod y syniad fod cytundeb Boris Johnson yn ateb i ansicrwydd busnes yn ffuglen bur. Ac yn fy marn i, ac rwy'n rhannu argyhoeddiad yr Aelod, y ffordd orau o gael y sicrwydd hwnnw y mae busnesau yng Nghymru wedi gallu ffynnu oddi tano o ganlyniad i’n haelodaeth o’r Undeb Ewropeaidd, yw cael refferendwm lle gallwn ymgyrchu dros aros ac ennill y ddadl honno.

14:30
Cwestiynau Heb Rybudd gan Lefarwyr y Pleidiau
Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

We now turn to spokespeople's questions, and first this afternoon is the Conservative spokesperson, Darren Millar. 

Trown yn awr at gwestiynau'r llefarwyr, ac yn gyntaf y prynhawn yma mae llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Darren Millar.

Minister, will you outline the Welsh Government's position on Brexit?

Weinidog, a wnewch chi amlinellu safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar Brexit?

The Welsh Government's position on Brexit is that any version of Brexit is a worse deal for Wales than remaining part of the European Union and that the only way that people in the UK can get their voice heard in this debate is to vote Labour at the next election and have a referendum, where we in Wales will campaign to remain. 

Safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar Brexit yw bod unrhyw fersiwn o Brexit yn gytundeb gwaeth i Gymru na pharhau i fod yn rhan o’r Undeb Ewropeaidd, ac mai’r unig ffordd y gall pobl yn y DU ddweud eu dweud yn y ddadl hon yw pleidleisio dros Lafur yn yr etholiad nesaf a chael refferendwm, lle byddwn ni yng Nghymru yn ymgyrchu dros aros.

I'm pleased to hear at least a consistent message coming from your mouth this time, because, of course, we've had all sorts of flip-flopping from the Welsh Government in recent months. Now, you've attempted there to articulate the UK Labour Party's position on Brexit, but the reality is that the UK Labour Party doesn't have a position on Brexit. What you've got is a position on holding a second referendum, because your leadership, the leadership of the UK Labour Party, doesn't have the bottle to actually say which way it will campaign in that referendum. Now, my party is very clear. We've got a policy to get Brexit done. Other parties, to be fair to them, are also very clear that they want to remain. But the UK Labour Party is doing the hokey cokey on this matter, with one foot in and one foot out on whether to leave or remain. 

Now, Minister, I'm sure that you would agree with me that it's vital that the public know what the position of any future UK Government is on Brexit. So, do you agree with me that it's time for your colleagues in the UK Labour Party to come clean with the public, to set out a clear position on Brexit, and to give voters across Wales the opportunity to have their say on 12 December, knowing exactly what you stand for?

Rwy'n falch o glywed neges gyson yn dod o'ch ceg y tro hwn, o leiaf, oherwydd, wrth gwrs, rydym wedi clywed pob math o newid meddwl gan Lywodraeth Cymru dros y misoedd diwethaf. Nawr, rydych wedi ceisio mynegi safbwynt Plaid Lafur y DU ar Brexit, ond y gwir amdani yw nad oes gan Blaid Lafur y DU safbwynt ar Brexit. Yr hyn sydd gennych yw safbwynt ar gynnal ail refferendwm, gan nad yw eich arweinyddiaeth, arweinyddiaeth Plaid Lafur y DU, yn ddigon dewr i ddweud sut y byddant yn ymgyrchu yn y refferendwm hwnnw. Nawr, mae fy mhlaid yn glir iawn. Mae gennym bolisi i gyflawni Brexit. Mae pleidiau eraill, a bod yn deg iddynt, hefyd yn glir iawn eu bod yn dymuno aros. Ond mae Plaid Lafur y DU yn gwneud yr hoci coci ar hyn, gydag un droed i mewn ac un droed allan o ran gadael neu aros.

Nawr, Weinidog, rwy'n siŵr y byddech yn cytuno ei bod yn hanfodol fod y cyhoedd yn gwybod beth yw safbwynt unrhyw Lywodraeth yn y DU yn y dyfodol ar Brexit. Felly, a ydych yn cytuno ei bod yn bryd i'ch cymheiriaid ym Mhlaid Lafur y DU ddweud y gwir wrth y cyhoedd, nodi safbwynt clir ar Brexit, a rhoi cyfle i bleidleiswyr ledled Cymru ddweud eu dweud ar 12 Rhagfyr, gan wybod beth yn union rydych chi'n sefyll drosto?

I think this exchange is rather poignant really, and I think his interest in the politics of Westminster is particularly poignant. He mentions flip-flops—I should commiserate with him; he obviously knows first hand the impact of the flip-flopping of his constituency colleague, David Jones, and, so, I just commiserate with him about that. I'm sure that he has flip-flops and broken promises very much uppermost in his mind in these questions. 

Credaf fod y sgwrs hon braidd yn drist mewn gwirionedd, a chredaf fod ei ddiddordeb yng ngwleidyddiaeth San Steffan yn arbennig o drist. Mae'n sôn am newid meddwl—dylwn gydymdeimlo ag ef; mae'n amlwg ei fod yn ymwybodol o effaith newid meddwl ei gydweithiwr etholaethol, David Jones, ac felly, cydymdeimlaf ag ef ynglŷn â hynny. Rwy'n siŵr fod newid meddwl a thorri addewidion ar flaen ei feddwl yn y cwestiynau hyn.

I'm sorry, I didn't actually hear you set out the position of your party. But, look, here's the situation: the idea of a second referendum that your party is positing is absolutely absurd. Why would anybody expect the Labour Party to respect the result or outcome of a second referendum if you haven't respected the first? The truth is, and it's an inconvenient truth for you, I know, but Wales voted to leave the EU in the referendum on Brexit, including 57 per cent of your own constituents. Yet, in spite of this, you and many others in this Chamber have done everything you can to block the instruction that we have received from the people of Wales and the rest of the United Kingdom. So, you've got no respect for democracy, you've got no respect for those who voted to leave, and absolutely no intention of delivering what the people of Wales voted for. 

So, I ask you this: how can anybody trust the Labour Party to deliver on the result of a second referendum if they haven't been bothered to support the outcome of the first?

Mae'n ddrwg gennyf, ni chlywais gennych beth yw safbwynt eich plaid. Ond edrychwch, dyma’r sefyllfa: mae’r syniad o ail refferendwm y mae eich plaid yn ei gynnig yn hollol hurt. Pam fyddai unrhyw un yn disgwyl i'r Blaid Lafur barchu canlyniad ail refferendwm os nad ydych wedi parchu'r cyntaf? Y gwirionedd yw, a gwn ei fod yn wirionedd anghyfleus i chi, ond pleidleisiodd Cymru i adael yr UE yn y refferendwm ar Brexit, gan gynnwys 57 y cant o'ch etholwyr eich hun. Ac eto, er hyn, rydych chi a llawer o bobl eraill yn y Siambr hon wedi gwneud popeth yn eich gallu i rwystro'r cyfarwyddyd a gawsom gan bobl Cymru a gweddill y Deyrnas Unedig. Felly, nid oes gennych unrhyw barch at ddemocratiaeth, nid oes gennych unrhyw barch at y rheini a bleidleisiodd i adael, ac nid oes bwriad o gwbl gennych i gyflawni'r hyn y pleidleisiodd pobl Cymru drosto.

Felly, gofynnaf i chi: sut y gall unrhyw un ymddiried yn y Blaid Lafur i gyflawni canlyniad ail refferendwm os nad ydynt wedi trafferthu cefnogi canlyniad y cyntaf?

And this from a party that campaigned in Westminster against the Assembly after the result of the referendum. I think it's quite extraordinary your position on this argument, Darren. Let me put it very simply for you—[Interruption.] I'm happy to answer the question; perhaps you can let me to do that. The policy of the Labour Party is one of respect to the electors of the United Kingdom, to whom promises were made, and promises have been broken, and they were largely broken by people who are running the Government of his party in Westminster. It is absolutely clear to us the only way of drawing a line under this—these three years of broken promises on the part of his party—is to give the British people an opportunity to have their say, and to have their say on the deal that Boris Johnson has brought back, which we are confident will be exposed as being a much worse outcome than remaining a member of the European Union. 

A daw hyn gan blaid a ymgyrchodd yn San Steffan yn erbyn y Cynulliad ar ôl canlyniad y refferendwm. Credaf fod eich safbwynt ar y ddadl hon yn eithaf rhyfeddol, Darren. Gadewch imi ddweud wrthych yn syml iawn—[Torri ar draws.] Rwy'n fwy na pharod i ateb y cwestiwn; efallai y gallwch adael imi wneud hynny. Mae polisi'r Blaid Lafur yn un o barch at etholwyr y Deyrnas Unedig y gwnaed addewidion iddynt, addewidion a gafodd eu torri, a chawsant eu torri i raddau helaeth gan bobl sy'n rhedeg Llywodraeth ei blaid yn San Steffan. Mae'n gwbl amlwg i ni mai'r unig ffordd o dynnu llinell o dan hyn—tair blynedd o dorri addewidion gan ei blaid—yw rhoi cyfle i bobl Prydain ddweud eu dweud, ac i wneud hynny ar gytundeb Boris Johnson, ac rydym yn hyderus y dangosir ei fod yn ganlyniad llawer gwaeth na pharhau i fod yn aelod o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd.

The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Delyth Jewell. 

Llefarydd Plaid Cymru, Delyth Jewell.

Diolch. Weinidog, hoffwn ofyn i chi ynghylch cynlluniau Llafur ar gyfer negodi cytundeb Brexit newydd. Rwy'n ymwybodol eich bod wedi bod ym Mrwsel yn ddiweddar yn cwrdd â chynrychiolwyr o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd. A allwch chi ddweud wrtha i os gwnaethoch chi gynnal trafodaethau gyda nhw ynglŷn â chynlluniau'ch plaid i negodi cytundeb newydd wedi ei seilio ar greu undeb dollau newydd? Ac a wnaethoch eu holi a fydden nhw'n barod i rhoi estyniad arall i erthygl 50 er mwyn caniatáu amser i negodi'r cytundeb hwn ac yna i alw refferendwm?

Thank you. Minister, I would like to ask you about the Labour Party’s plans for negotiating a new Brexit deal. Now, I’m aware that you’ve been in Brussels recently meeting with representatives of the European Union. Can you tell me whether you had any discussions with them about your party’s plan to negotiate a new deal based on creating a new customs union? And did you ask them whether they would be willing to allow another extension to article 50 in order to provide time to negotiate this deal and to then call a referendum?

14:35

Diolch am y cwestiwn. Roedd y cwestiwn o safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar Brexit ar dop yr agenda, ac fe wnaethom ni'n glir bod ein Llywodraeth ni yma o blaid aros yn aelod o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd. Wrth gwrs, roedd pobl roeddwn i'n cwrdd â nhw yn disgwyl i fi ddweud hynny. Wnaethon ni ddim trafod, wrth gwrs, mewn manylder y cwestiwn o'r math o gytundeb y byddem ni'n ei negodi. Ond, ar achlysuron ac ymweliadau arall yn y gorffennol, rŷn ni wedi cyflwyno iddyn nhw ddogfen 'Securing Wales' Future', sydd wedi ei chytuno ar y cyd â Phlaid Cymru, ac felly mae ganddyn nhw ddarlun clir o'r math o Brexit, pe baem ni'n gorfod gadael, rŷn ni'n meddwl y byddai'n gwneud y lleiaf o niwed i ni yma yng Nghymru.

Thank you for the question. The question of the Welsh Government’s position on Brexit was at the top of the agenda and we made it clear that our Government here was in favour of remaining a member of the European Union. Of course, the people we were meeting were expecting me to say that. We didn’t discuss, of course, in detail the question of what sort of agreement we would negotiate. But, on other visits and other occasions in the past, we have presented to them the ‘Securing Wales’ Future’ document, which was agreed jointly with Plaid Cymru, and so they have a clear picture of the kind of Brexit that, if we had to leave, we think would cause the least damage here in Wales.

Diolch am yr ateb yna. Hoffwn ofyn, o ganlyniad, a fydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn cynnal asesiad effaith economaidd o effaith debygol bargen newydd Jeremy Corbyn ar economi a phorthladdoedd Cymru. Wrth gwrs, does dim llawer o fanylion penodol ynglŷn ag union natur y cytundeb hwn ar gael yn gyhoeddus, ond rwy'n cymryd, fel Gweinidog Llafur mewn Llywodraeth Lafur, eich bod yn gwybod union fwriad eich plaid o ran y cytundeb newydd rydych eisiau ei negodi. Byddwch yn ymwybodol bod Michael Gove wedi dweud wrthyf fi nad yw'r Llywodraeth Brydeinig bresennol wedi cynnal asesiadau effaith ar gyfer porthladdoedd Cymru chwaith, sy'n bryderus iawn o ystyried pwysigrwydd porthladd Caergybi yn enwedig. Allwch chi gadarnhau, felly, mai bwriad eich Llywodraeth fyddai cynnal asesiadau manwl o effaith bargen Brexit Jeremy Corbyn ar economi a phorthladdoedd Cymru, o flaen unrhyw refferendwm, os yw'ch plaid mewn llywodraeth ar ôl yr etholiad?

Thank you. I would like to ask as a result of that whether the Welsh Government will carry out an economic impact assessment of a new deal negotiated by Jeremy Corbyn on the economy and ports of Wales. Of course, there’s not much detail about the nature of this available at the moment, but I assume that, as a Labour Minister in a Labour Government, you know your party’s intentions in terms of the deal that you want to negotiate. You will be aware that Michael Gove told me that the current UK Government hasn’t conducted an impact assessment for Welsh ports, which is hugely concerning given the importance of the port of Holyhead particularly. Can you confirm, therefore, that it’s your Government’s intention to conduct detailed impact assessments of the Jeremy Corbyn deal on the Welsh economy and Welsh ports before any referendum, if your party is in government after the election?

Wel, dwi ddim yn siarad ar ran Jeremy Corbyn, nac unrhyw aelod arall o'r meinciau yn San Steffan, ond rwy'n gallu siarad ar ran Llywodraeth Cymru ar y cwestiwn yma. Mae'r broses rŷn ni wedi ymwneud â hi, o'r cychwyn cyntaf, wedi bod yn un yn seiliedig ar dystiolaeth a ffeithiau a gwybodaeth byd go iawn, yn hytrach na sloganau a gobeithion. Ac rwy'n falch ein bod ni wedi llwyddo, gyda Phlaid Cymru, i gyhoeddi dogfen sy'n cynnwys y dystiolaeth hynny. Ond bydd yr Aelod yn gwybod, wrth gwrs, ar ôl hynny, ein bod ni wedi cyhoeddi sawl papur arall sy'n dangos impact o bob mathau—economaidd ac eraill—o safbwyntiau polisi Llywodraeth Cymru yn ymwneud â Brexit.

I’m not talking on behalf of Jeremy Corbyn, or any other member of the benches in Westminster, but I can speak on behalf of the Welsh Government on this question. The process that we have been involved in from the very beginning has been one based on evidence and facts and information from the real world, rather than slogans and hopes. And I’m pleased that we’ve managed to publish, with Plaid Cymru, a document that includes that evidence. The Member will know that, since then, we have published a number of other papers that show all sorts of impacts—economic and otherwise—of the Welsh Government's policy position on Brexit.

Finally, Minister, I want to turn to the news that Alun Cairns has finally resigned as Secretary of State for Wales, following revelations he helped to cover up for an ally who deliberately sabotaged a rape trial. I'm sure you'll agree with me that Alun Cairns's actions were disgraceful, indefensible and indicative of a deep rot at the heart of the Conservative Party in Wales. It's quite apparent that Alun Cairns, and other senior members of the Conservative Party in Wales, were aware of what Ross England had done before they selected and endorsed him as their candidate. And I'd be interested to know whether you agree with me that an inquiry needs to take place to ascertain who knew what and when—

Yn olaf, Weinidog, rwyf am droi at y newyddion fod Alun Cairns wedi ymddiswyddo o'r diwedd fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru, yn dilyn y newyddion ei fod wedi helpu i gynorthwyo ffrind a danseiliodd achos llys ar drais yn fwriadol. Rwy'n siŵr eich bod yn cytuno â mi fod ymddygiad Alun Cairns yn warthus, yn anamddiffynadwy ac yn arwydd o bydredd dwfn wrth wraidd y Blaid Geidwadol yng Nghymru. Mae'n eithaf amlwg fod Alun Cairns, ac uwch aelodau eraill o'r Blaid Geidwadol yng Nghymru, yn ymwybodol o'r hyn roedd Ross England wedi'i wneud cyn iddynt ei ddewis a'i gymeradwyo fel eu hymgeisydd. A hoffwn wybod a fyddech yn cytuno fod angen cynnal ymchwiliad i ddarganfod pwy oedd yn gwybod beth a phryd—

These are questions to the Counsel General about Brexit.

Cwestiynau i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol ynghylch Brexit yw'r rhain.

—and that everyone in a position of power implicated in that scandal should resign. In terms—

—ac y dylai pawb mewn sefyllfa o bŵer sy'n gysylltiedig â'r sgandal honno ymddiswyddo. O ran—

Sorry. No, your mic is off. Sorry, Delyth, your mic is off. These are questions about Brexit; it is not about anything that may have been said over the Twitter for that. It's about Brexit. You started off okay, but I think you've strayed off, so if you can relate it to a Brexit question, that would be fine.

Mae'n ddrwg gennyf. Na, mae eich meicroffon wedi'i ddiffodd. Mae'n ddrwg gennyf, Delyth, mae eich meicroffon wedi'i ddiffodd. Cwestiynau am Brexit yw'r rhain; nid ydynt yn ymwneud ag unrhyw beth a allai fod wedi'i ddweud am hynny ar Twitter. Mae'n ymwneud â Brexit. Fe ddechreuoch chi'n iawn, ond credaf eich bod wedi crwydro, felly os gallwch ei gysylltu â chwestiwn am Brexit, byddai hynny'n iawn.

Okay. In terms of your duties as Brexit Minister, I'd like to ask you how Alun Cairns's resignation will affect your Government's workings with the UK Government? Do you expect them to appoint a replacement as Secretary of State for Wales ahead of the election, in terms of the duties that he had on the JMC(EN)? And does this leave inter-governmental workings, in terms of Brexit preparations, at any kind of impasse?

Iawn. O ran eich dyletswyddau fel Gweinidog Brexit, hoffwn ofyn i chi sut y bydd ymddiswyddiad Alun Cairns yn effeithio ar waith eich Llywodraeth gyda Llywodraeth y DU? A ydych yn disgwyl iddynt benodi rhywun yn ei le fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru cyn yr etholiad, o ran y dyletswyddau a oedd ganddo ar y Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion (Negodiadau’r UE)? Ac a yw hyn yn creu anawsterau mewn unrhyw fodd i waith rhynglywodraethol mewn perthynas â pharatoadau Brexit?

In the context of Brexit questions, I won't be drawn on the broader point, but I think the First Minister has made our position clear in relation to matters surrounding the former Secretary of State for Wales. In relation to questions of relevance to Brexit, in my experience, the place where we have made most progress in discussions with the UK Government is where we have been able to deal with them directly. Even then, it has been a significant challenge in many, many ways. But it is evidently the case that those direct contacts are the best way of protecting Wales's interests into the future.

Yng nghyd-destun cwestiynau am Brexit, nid wyf am roi sylw i'r pwynt ehangach, ond credaf fod y Prif Weinidog wedi egluro ein safbwynt yn glir mewn perthynas â materion sy'n ymwneud â chyn Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru. Mewn perthynas â chwestiynau sy'n berthnasol i Brexit, yn fy mhrofiad i, y man lle rydym wedi gwneud y cynnydd mwyaf mewn trafodaethau â Llywodraeth y DU yw lle rydym wedi gallu ymdrin â hwy'n uniongyrchol. Hyd yn oed wedyn, mae wedi bod yn her sylweddol mewn nifer fawr o ffyrdd. Ond mae'n amlwg yn wir mai'r cysylltiadau uniongyrchol hynny yw'r ffordd orau o amddiffyn buddiannau Cymru yn y dyfodol.

Effaith Oedi Pellach o ran Brexit
The Impact of Further Brexit Delay

4. A wnaiff y Cwnsler Cyffredinol ddatganiad am yr effaith y bydd oedi pellach i gytundeb Brexit yn ei chael ar Orllewin Caerfyrddin a De Sir Benfro? OAQ54642

4. Will the Counsel General make a statement on the impact that a further delay to a Brexit deal being passed will have on Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire? OAQ54642

The flextension to 31 January means a disastrous 'no deal' Brexit has been avoided or at least postponed. Economically, it means the maintenance of the status quo. It also provides the opportunity to reject Boris Johnson’s hard Brexit deal and put the decision back to the people.

Mae'r estyniad hyblyg hyd at 31 Ionawr yn golygu bod Brexit digytundeb trychinebus wedi'i osgoi, neu ei ohirio o leiaf. Yn economaidd, mae hynny'n golygu cynnal y status quo. Mae hefyd yn rhoi cyfle i wrthod cytundeb Brexit caled Boris Johnson a rhoi’r penderfyniad yn ôl i’r bobl.

14:40

I had a feeling you'd probably say something along those lines, Counsel General, so I'm glad I'm not disappointed. Of course, I think, ultimately we all hear what we want to hear, and I'd like to tell you what farmers in my constituency are saying to me, because they need and want certainty surrounding Brexit, and I know from the many conversations that I've had, they want a deal done. One way or another, they want a deal done so they have certainty, so that they can plan for the future. Yet, last month, in Westminster, the Labour Party voted against approving the Conservative Government's new deal, which they had struck with agreement with the EU, which seemed to be supported by quite a wide variety of different organisations, different sectors of industry, farmers, and so on. And the policy of the Welsh Government seems to be to have a second referendum. What guarantee can you give my farmers in Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire that if you did go and have that second referendum, you would actually bother to implement the result?

Roedd gennyf deimlad y byddech chi'n dweud rhywbeth tebyg i hynny, Gwnsler Cyffredinol, felly rwy'n falch na chefais fy siomi. Wrth gwrs, yn y pen draw, credaf fod pob un ohonom yn clywed yr hyn rydym am ei glywed, a hoffwn ddweud wrthych beth y mae ffermwyr yn fy etholaeth yn ei ddweud wrthyf, gan eu bod yn dymuno cael ac angen sicrwydd ynglŷn â Brexit, ac o'r nifer o sgyrsiau rwyf wedi'u cael, gwn eu bod yn awyddus i gael cytundeb. Rywsut neu'i gilydd, maent am gael cytundeb er mwyn cael sicrwydd fel y gallant gynllunio ar gyfer y dyfodol. Ac eto, y mis diwethaf, yn San Steffan, pleidleisiodd y Blaid Lafur yn erbyn cymeradwyo cytundeb newydd y Llywodraeth Geidwadol, cytundeb a wnaethant gyda’r UE, ac a oedd i'w weld yn ennyn cefnogaeth amrywiaeth eithaf eang o wahanol sefydliadau, gwahanol sectorau diwydiannol, ffermwyr, ac yn y blaen. Ac ymddengys mai polisi Llywodraeth Cymru yw cael ail refferendwm. Pa warant y gallwch ei rhoi i fy ffermwyr yng Ngorllewin Caerfyrddin a De Sir Benfro, pe baech yn cynnal ail refferendwm, y byddech yn trafferthu cyflawni'r canlyniad?

I thank the Member for acknowledging the consistency of my approach at the start of her question. I have farmers discussing their concerns with me as well, and the concerns they ask me are about what certainty do they have of replacement funding from the UK Government for the support they get at the moment. What funding can we secure for regional investment in Wales from the UK Government to replace the support we are able to provide them at the moment? Unfortunately, the position, I have to say to them, is that, despite the sunny slogans of Boris Johnson, in terms of the hard reality, I cannot give them the assurance that they want. The reason for that is that the UK Government has been completely neglectful of the agricultural sector as a significant part of our economy, despite the headline-grabbing statements that we sometimes see. So, that is the reality and that is what farmers are saying to me, and I'm surprised that farmers in her constituency aren't also saying to her that they are concerned the UK Government isn't living up to its responsibilities.

Diolch i'r Aelod am gydnabod cysondeb fy ymagwedd ar ddechrau ei chwestiwn. Mae gennyf ffermwyr sy'n trafod eu pryderon gyda minnau hefyd, ac mae eu pryderon yn ymwneud â pha sicrwydd a gânt o gyllid gan Lywodraeth y DU yn lle'r gefnogaeth a gânt ar hyn o bryd. Pa gyllid y gallwn ei sicrhau ar gyfer buddsoddi rhanbarthol yng Nghymru gan Lywodraeth y DU yn lle'r gefnogaeth y gallwn ei darparu iddynt ar hyn o bryd? Yn anffodus, mae'n rhaid imi ddweud wrthynt mai'r sefyllfa mewn gwirionedd, er gwaethaf sloganau gobeithiol Boris Johnson, yw na allaf roi'r sicrwydd y maent yn dymuno'i gael. Y rheswm am hynny yw bod Llywodraeth y DU wedi esgeuluso'r sector amaethyddol yn llwyr fel rhan arwyddocaol o'n heconomi, er gwaethaf y datganiadau a welwn weithiau yn y penawdau. Felly, dyna'r realiti, a dyna y mae ffermwyr yn ei ddweud wrthyf, ac rwy'n synnu nad yw ffermwyr yn ei hetholaeth hi'n dweud wrthi eu bod yn poeni nad yw Llywodraeth y DU yn cyflawni ei chyfrifoldebau.

Minister, the constituents of Angela Burns clearly highlighted the concerns over a possible delay, but what are your considerations for those same constituents if this deal goes through and we have 11 months to negotiate a free trade agreement, which is unlikely? Everybody other than Michael Gove seems to think that's impossible, and he's adamant that they will not seek an extension to any transition period, which means there'll be a 'no deal' exit on 31 December next year. What are the implications for those constituents if that happens?

Weinidog, nododd etholwyr Angela Burns y pryderon ynghylch oedi posibl, ond beth yw eich ystyriaethau ar gyfer yr etholwyr hynny os caiff y cytundeb hwn ei dderbyn a bod gennym 11 mis i negodi cytundeb masnach rydd, sy'n annhebygol? Ymddengys bod pawb heblaw Michael Gove o'r farn fod hynny'n amhosibl, ac mae e'n bendant na fyddant yn gofyn am estyniad i unrhyw gyfnod pontio, sy'n golygu y byddwn yn gadael heb gytundeb ar 31 Rhagfyr y flwyddyn nesaf. Beth yw'r goblygiadau i'r etholwyr hynny os bydd hynny'n digwydd?

Well, I think the Member makes a very important point there. Although 31 January gives some confidence in relation to an imminent 'no deal', the point he makes is at the heart of the weakness in the deal that Boris Johnson has brought back from the European Union, which is that there is no certainty that we are not simply looking at a deferred 'no deal' exit. And we know what damage that will cause to the farming sector, to various sectors of our economy and our communities at large. I share with him his scepticism that the kind of free trade agreement—unless it's extremely minimalist—that he describes in the political declaration can be achieved within that period, even on his own terms. Again, if we just look at the UK Government's own figures here, even if those trade agreements are possible to put in place, the advantage that brings to the UK economy is absolutely dwarfed by the damage that that sort of relationship with the European Union would pose to our economy into the future.

Wel, credaf fod yr Aelod yn gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn. Er bod 31 Ionawr yn rhoi rhywfaint o hyder inni mewn perthynas â Brexit heb gytundeb yn y dyfodol agos, mae'r pwynt a wna yn mynd at wraidd y gwendid yng nghytundeb Boris Johnson gyda'r Undeb Ewropeaidd, sef na cheir unrhyw sicrwydd nad ydym yn sôn am Brexit heb gytundeb gohiriedig. A gwyddom pa ddifrod y bydd hynny'n ei achosi i'r sector ffermio, i wahanol sectorau o'n heconomi a'n cymunedau yn gyffredinol. Rhannaf ei amheuaeth y gellir cyflawni'r math o gytundeb masnach rydd—oni bai ei fod yn hynod o gyfyngedig—y mae'n ei ddisgrifio yn y datganiad gwleidyddol o fewn y cyfnod hwnnw, hyd yn oed ar ei delerau ei hun. Unwaith eto, os edrychwn ar ffigurau Llywodraeth y DU, hyd yn oed os oes modd rhoi'r cytundebau masnach hynny ar waith, nid yw'r fantais i economi'r DU yn sgil hynny yn ddim o gymharu â'r niwed y byddai perthynas o'r fath â'r Undeb Ewropeaidd yn ei wneud i'n heconomi yn y dyfodol.

Rhaglen Erasmus+
The Erasmus+ Programme

5. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'u cael gyda'r Gweinidog Addysg ynghylch cyfranogiad parhaus myfyrwyr o Gymru yn rhaglen Erasmus+ ar ôl Brexit? OAQ54639

5. What discussions has the Counsel General had with the Minister for Education about the continuing participation of students from Wales in the Erasmus+ programme following Brexit? OAQ54639

In addition to regular discussions on this and related issues at Cabinet sub-committee, I've met with the Minister for Education separately on a number of occasions to discuss the potential impacts of Brexit on the Erasmus+ programme.

Yn ogystal â thrafodaethau rheolaidd ar hyn a materion cysylltiedig yn is-bwyllgor y Cabinet, rwyf wedi cyfarfod â'r Gweinidog Addysg ar wahân ar sawl achlysur i drafod effeithiau posibl Brexit ar raglen Erasmus+.

Thank you, Counsel General. As you will know, Welsh learners have really benefited from Erasmus+, with over €40 billion being brought into Wales between 2014 and 2018 to support over 7,000 participants in 245 projects. I know the EU Commission has suggested that, for the cycle starting in 2021, the scheme will become global in scope, but, as with so much else, the uncertainty caused by Brexit means that there are question marks around future Welsh and UK participation. What discussions have you had around the continued participation of Welsh learners, for whom the experience can be life changing, and, in particular, around enabling vocational learners to access these opportunities?

Diolch, Gwnsler Cyffredinol. Fel y gwyddoch, mae dysgwyr o Gymru wedi elwa’n fawr o Erasmus+, gyda dros €40 biliwn yn dod i Gymru rhwng 2014 a 2018 i gefnogi dros 7,000 o gyfranogwyr mewn 245 o brosiectau. Gwn fod Comisiwn yr UE wedi awgrymu, ar gyfer y cylch a fydd yn cychwyn yn 2021, y bydd cwmpas y cynllun yn dod yn fyd-eang, ond fel gyda chymaint o bethau eraill, mae'r ansicrwydd a berir gan Brexit yn golygu bod marciau cwestiwn ynghylch cyfranogiad Cymru a'r DU yn y dyfodol. Pa drafodaethau rydych wedi'u cael ynghylch cyfranogiad parhaus dysgwyr o Gymru, y gall y profiad hwn newid eu bywydau, ac yn benodol, ynghylch galluogi dysgwyr galwedigaethol i gael mynediad at y cyfleoedd hyn?

14:45

This is a really important point, so I thank you for raising this. It was on 16 October that I met—courtesy of Colegau Cymru, who I thank for arranging this—a group of vocational learners from across south Wales who had benefitted from participating in Erasmus+ placements, and I heard at first hand about the benefits of that programme, which they described in their own lives and in their own workplaces. It was about building confidence, about personal development, about learning different perspectives on the world and the world of work, building relationships with people in other countries, and also taking back to their own workplaces new ideas and fresh ways of looking at things. All of them were clear that this was not the sort of thing that they would otherwise have been able to take advantage of in their own lives.

She talks about the future scoping of the replacement Erasmus scheme, and it strikes exactly the kind of priorities that we would wish to see: supporting disadvantaged learners into Erasmus, part-time learners, and a more global scope in many other ways. Those are exactly the kinds of things that I'm sure we would all want to see our young people in Wales being able to participate in fully.

I know that the Minister for Education has been advocating for this position with the UK Government from the outset, and I believe that, more recently, we've had some confidence, if we can't participate in the Erasmus replacement scheme into the future, which remains our priority, that the UK Government has a UK-wide scheme in mind. But the fundamental point, coming back to the point that I made earlier, is that the Treasury has to commit funding in order for that to happen, and, without that funding, it will not be able to be a reality.

Mae hwn yn bwynt pwysig iawn, felly diolch i chi am ei godi. Ar 16 Hydref, cyfarfûm—drwy garedigrwydd Colegau Cymru, a diolch iddynt am drefnu hyn—â grŵp o ddysgwyr galwedigaethol o bob rhan o dde Cymru a oedd wedi elwa o gymryd rhan mewn lleoliadau Erasmus+, a chlywais o lygad y ffynnon am fanteision y rhaglen honno, a ddisgrifiwyd ganddynt yn eu bywydau eu hunain ac yn eu gweithleoedd eu hunain. Roedd yn ymwneud â magu hyder, datblygiad personol, dysgu am wahanol safbwyntiau ar y byd a byd gwaith, meithrin perthynas â phobl mewn gwledydd eraill, yn ogystal â mynd â syniadau newydd a ffyrdd newydd o edrych ar bethau yn ôl i'w gweithleoedd eu hunain. Roedd pob un ohonynt yn sicr nad oedd hyn yn rhywbeth y byddent wedi gallu manteisio arno fel arall yn eu bywydau eu hunain.

Mae hi'n sôn am gwmpas y cynllun newydd yn lle cynllun Erasmus yn y dyfodol, ac mae'n mynd i'r afael â'r union fath o flaenoriaethau yr hoffem eu gweld: cynorthwyo dysgwyr difreintiedig i gymryd rhan yn rhaglen Erasmus, dysgwyr rhan-amser, a chwmpas mwy byd-eang mewn sawl ffordd arall. Dyna'r union fathau o bethau rwy'n siŵr y byddai pob un ohonom am weld ein pobl ifanc yng Nghymru yn gallu cymryd rhan lawn ynddynt.

Gwn fod y Gweinidog Addysg wedi bod yn dadlau dros hyn gyda Llywodraeth y DU o'r cychwyn cyntaf, a chredaf ein bod, yn fwy diweddar, wedi cael rhywfaint o hyder, os na allwn gymryd rhan yn y cynllun newydd yn lle cynllun Erasmus yn y dyfodol, rhywbeth sy'n parhau i fod yn flaenoriaeth gennym, fod gan Lywodraeth y DU gynllun mewn golwg ar gyfer y DU gyfan. Ond y pwynt sylfaenol, gan ddychwelyd at y pwynt a wneuthum yn gynharach, yw bod yn rhaid i'r Trysorlys ymrwymo cyllid er mwyn i hynny ddigwydd, a heb yr arian hwnnw, ni fydd modd ei wireddu.

Troseddau Trawsffiniol
Cross-border Crime

6. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'u cael gyda chymheiriaid yn Llywodraeth y DU ynghylch tracio troseddau trawsffiniol ar ôl Brexit? OAQ54637

6. What discussions has the Counsel General had with counterparts in the UK Government regarding tracking cross-border crime following Brexit? OAQ54637

I myself last discussed matters relating to the future security partnership at the February meeting of the ministerial forum. Nowhere else in the world has the level of close multilateral co-operation in relation to law enforcement and judicial matters that exists between EU member states, and that co-operation must continue even if the UK leaves the European Union.   

Y tro diwethaf i mi drafod materion sy'n ymwneud â'r bartneriaeth ddiogelwch yn y dyfodol oedd yng nghyfarfod y fforwm gweinidogol ym mis Chwefror. Nid oes gan unrhyw le arall yn y byd yr un lefel o gydweithredu amlochrog agos mewn perthynas â gorfodi'r gyfraith a materion barnwrol â'r hyn sy'n bodoli rhwng aelod-wladwriaethau'r UE, ac mae'n rhaid i'r cydweithredu hwnnw barhau hyd yn oed os yw'r DU yn gadael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd.

Thank you, Counsel General, for that answer. Following the horrendous deaths of 39 Vietnamese migrants in Essex last month, a number of senior MPs and experts have cautioned that the UK faces a real risk of being excluded from Europol and its agencies, including the anti-trafficking unit and the European Migrant Smuggling Centre, post Brexit. They went on to say that, even with a deal, the UK would have downgraded access to those organisations.

The UK's right to access and share information on a whole host of security issues like human trafficking and international crime could be severely hampered at a time when international co-operation is needed the most. Being excluded from an organisation that has an unrivalled ability to track crimes across Europe and beyond is of grave concern. So, Minister, what discussions have you had with the Westminster Government—or will you have when it returns—about how they intend to maintain access to all those agencies that I've just mentioned, especially now, when we're in such turbulent times internationally?   

Diolch am eich ateb, Gwnsler Cyffredinol. Yn dilyn marwolaethau erchyll 39 o fudwyr o Fiet-nam yn Essex y mis diwethaf, mae nifer o uwch ASau ac arbenigwyr wedi rhybuddio bod y DU yn wynebu risg wirioneddol o gael ei heithrio o Europol a'u hasiantaethau, gan gynnwys yr uned atal masnachu pobl a Chanolfan Smyglo Mudwyr Ewrop, ar ôl Brexit. Aethant yn eu blaenau i ddweud y byddai mynediad y DU at y sefydliadau hynny, hyd yn oed gyda chytundeb, yn cael ei israddio.

Gallai hawl y DU i gyrchu a rhannu gwybodaeth am lu o faterion diogelwch fel masnachu pobl a throseddau rhyngwladol gael ei llesteirio'n ddifrifol ar adeg pan fo mwy o angen nag erioed am gydweithredu rhyngwladol. Mae cael eich eithrio o sefydliad sydd â gallu dihafal i olrhain troseddau ledled Ewrop a thu hwnt yn achos pryder mawr. Felly, Weinidog, pa drafodaethau a gawsoch gyda Llywodraeth San Steffan—neu y byddwch yn eu cael ar ôl iddi ddychwelyd—ynglŷn â sut y bwriadant gynnal mynediad at yr holl asiantaethau rwyf newydd eu crybwyll, yn enwedig nawr, a ninnau mewn cyfnod mor gythryblus yn rhyngwladol?

Well, I'll reassure the Member that it's exactly that kind of close engagement and involvement into the future with the various Europe-wide law enforcement bodies and agencies—. It's exactly that kind of relationship that I was advocating in that ministeral forum and I and other Ministers have continued to press for in the interim period. As she says, whether it is Europol or Schengen, the SIS II system, whether it is about sharing passenger name records or criminal records, there is a multiplicity of EU-wide law enforcement and security arrangements from which we benefit at the moment, and from which exclusion will have a real impact on us and on our security.

Now, of course, the ambition that the UK Government has is to negotiate the best available relationships with those organisations after Brexit. But the reality is that there are several obstacles in the path of those negotiations delivering the same level of engagement and involvement that we currently have, not least amongst them the question of the UK's data adequacy. All of this is shared data, and, as we know in this Chamber, if we become a third country, we'll have to restart a process of qualifying to access data of any sort. It's a major stumbling block. As a non-Schengen third country our access to a number of these arrangements will, even at best, be depleted.

And there's a third dimension here as well, which is that many of them require a level playing field in terms of human rights protection, and losing the benefit and the shelter of the EU charter and fundamental rights may itself pose an obstacle to getting the kind of arrangements we would want to see in place in those negotiations.

Wel, gallaf roi sicrwydd i'r Aelod mai dyna'r union fath o ymwneud ac ymgysylltu agos yr hoffem ei gael yn y dyfodol gyda'r gwahanol gyrff ac asiantaethau gorfodi'r gyfraith ledled Ewrop—. Dyna'r union fath o berthynas roeddwn yn dadlau drosti yn y fforwm gweinidogol hwnnw ac rwyf fi a Gweinidogion eraill wedi parhau i bwyso amdani yn y cyfamser. Fel y dywed, boed yn Europol neu'n Schengen, system SIS II, boed yn ymwneud â rhannu cofnodion enwau teithwyr neu gofnodion troseddol, mae llu o drefniadau gorfodi'r gyfraith a diogelwch ledled yr UE rydym yn elwa arnynt ar hyn o bryd, a bydd cael ein heithrio rhagddynt yn cael effaith wirioneddol arnom ni a'n diogelwch.

Nawr, wrth gwrs, uchelgais Llywodraeth y DU yw negodi'r berthynas orau sy'n bosibl gyda'r sefydliadau hyn ar ôl Brexit. Ond y gwir amdani yw bod y negodiadau hynny'n wynebu sawl rhwystr o ran sicrhau'r un lefel o ymwneud ac ymgysylltiad ag sydd gennym ar hyn o bryd, yn enwedig y cwestiwn ynghylch digonolrwydd data'r DU. Mae hwn oll yn ddata a rennir, ac fel y gwyddom yn y Siambr hon, pe baem yn dod yn drydedd gwlad, byddai angen inni ailgychwyn proses gymhwyso er mwyn cael mynediad at ddata o unrhyw fath. Mae'n faen tramgwydd mawr. Fel trydedd gwlad nad yw'n wlad Schengen, byddai ein mynediad at nifer o'r trefniadau hyn, hyd yn oed ar y gorau, yn cael ei leihau.

Ac mae trydedd agwedd i hyn hefyd, sef bod llawer ohonynt yn mynnu cyfartalwch o ran amddiffyn hawliau dynol, a gallai colli budd ac amddiffyniad siarter yr UE a hawliau sylfaenol fod yn rhwystr ynddo'i hun rhag sicrhau'r math o drefniadau y byddem am eu cael ar waith yn y negodiadau hynny.

14:50
Diogelu Economi Cymru
Safeguarding the Welsh Economy

7. Pa fesurau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol yn eu cymryd cyn Brexit i ddiogelu economi Cymru? OAQ54635

7. What measures is the Counsel General taking ahead of Brexit to safeguard the Welsh economy? OAQ54635

Whilst we believe the best way to safeguard the Welsh economy is to remain in the European Union, the Welsh Government is doing everything in our power to safeguard the Welsh economy. This includes using measures such as our Brexit resilience fund, where we announced an additional £6 million funding for this week.

Er ein bod yn credu mai'r ffordd orau o ddiogelu economi Cymru yw aros yn yr Undeb Ewropeaidd, mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gwneud popeth yn ein gallu i ddiogelu economi Cymru. Mae hyn yn cynnwys defnyddio mesurau fel ein cronfa cydnerthedd Brexit, y cyhoeddasom gyllid ychwanegol o £6 miliwn ar ei chyfer yr wythnos hon.

Counsel General, a lot of the economic activity in Wales consists of the work of small and medium-sized enterprises, and I believe they're crucial to our economy. They face a lot of cash-flow and confidence pressures in the light of Brexit and what Brexit may bring. I believe a crucial support for them is the Development Bank of Wales, so, could you offer some reassurance today that that development bank is best placed to offer that support, crucial support, to our SMEs before and post Brexit? 

Gwnsler Cyffredinol, gwaith busnesau bach a chanolig eu maint yw llawer o'r gweithgarwch economaidd yng Nghymru, a chredaf eu bod yn hanfodol i'n heconomi. Maent yn wynebu llawer o bwysau o ran llif arian a hyder oherwydd Brexit a'r hyn a allai ddigwydd yn sgil Brexit. Credaf y gall Banc Datblygu Cymru ddarparu cymorth hanfodol iddynt, felly a allech roi sicrwydd i ni heddiw fod y banc datblygu yn y sefyllfa orau i gynnig y cymorth hanfodol hwnnw i’n busnesau bach a chanolig cyn ac ar ôl Brexit?

Yes. I thank the Member for that supplementary. The role that the Development Bank of Wales can play, in particular in engaging with the small and medium-sized business community, is going to be absolutely essential in a post-Brexit world, if that is what comes to pass. Obviously, the Minister for Economy and Transport has significant dealings with the bank. I myself have met with the chair and the chief executive to discuss their arrangements around preparedness and the redeployment of staff if we were to come to that situation.

He says that cash flow and confidence are likely to be two issues that hamper businesses generally, and I agree with that. The Minister for Economy and Transport announced £100 million of capital for the Wales flexible investment fund, which is managed by the Development Bank of Wales, and earlier this year announced more than £120 million further funding for various funds that are manged by the development bank, and the whole point of those is to make funding available in a way that is flexible and appropriate for the particular needs that businesses may have in a post-Brexit world.

We've been clear as a Welsh Government, and we've been clear in pressing the UK Government of this view, that, if we come to that situation, it's incumbent on us to do all that we can to support businesses that can be viable into the medium term, if you like, to get over what will be, inevitably, a very turbulent time. We have not persuaded the UK Government of that view, but that remains very firmly our view.

Of course, we hope for a situation where we have a referendum and a campaign to remain that succeeds, where this risk to those businesses is eliminated. But we have to prepare for a situation in which that doesn't come to pass.

Gallaf. Diolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn atodol. Bydd y rôl y gall Banc Datblygu Cymru ei chwarae, yn enwedig wrth ymgysylltu â chymuned y busnesau bach a chanolig, yn gwbl hanfodol mewn byd ôl-Brexit, os daw pethau i hynny. Yn amlwg, mae Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth yn ymwneud cryn dipyn â'r banc. Rwyf innau wedi cyfarfod â'r cadeirydd a'r prif weithredwr i drafod eu trefniadau ynghylch parodrwydd ac adleoli staff pe bai angen.

Dywed fod llif arian a hyder yn debygol o fod yn ddau beth sy'n llesteirio busnesau yn gyffredinol, ac rwy'n cytuno. Mae Gweinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth wedi cyhoeddi £100 miliwn o gyfalaf ar gyfer cronfa buddsoddi hyblyg Cymru, a reolir gan Fanc Datblygu Cymru, ac yn gynharach eleni, cyhoeddodd fwy na £120 miliwn o gyllid pellach ar gyfer gwahanol gronfeydd a reolir gan y banc datblygu, a holl bwynt y rheini yw sicrhau bod cyllid ar gael mewn ffordd sy'n hyblyg ac yn briodol ar gyfer yr anghenion penodol a allai fod gan fusnesau mewn byd ôl-Brexit.

Rydym wedi dweud yn glir fel Llywodraeth Cymru, ac rydym wedi bod yn glir wrth gyfleu'r safbwynt hwn i Lywodraeth y DU, os wynebwn y sefyllfa honno, fod yn rhaid inni wneud popeth yn ein gallu i gefnogi busnesau a all fod hyfyw i mewn i'r tymor canolig, os mynnwch, i oroesi'r hyn a fydd, yn anochel, yn gyfnod cythryblus iawn. Nid ydym wedi perswadio Llywodraeth y DU ynglŷn â hynny, ond dyna yw ein safbwynt pendant ni o hyd.

Wrth gwrs, rydym yn gobeithio am sefyllfa lle cawn refferendwm ac ymgyrch i aros sy'n llwyddo, lle mae'r risg hon i'r busnesau hynny'n cael ei dileu. Ond mae'n rhaid inni baratoi am sefyllfa lle nad yw hynny'n digwydd.

And, finally, question 8—Lynne Neagle.

Ac yn olaf, cwestiwn 8—Lynne Neagle.

Hawliau Gweithwyr
Workers’ Rights

8. Pa asesiad y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'i wneud o effaith y cytundeb ymadael diweddaraf ar hawliau gweithwyr yng Nghymru? OAQ54615

8. What assessment has the Counsel General made of the impact of the latest withdrawal agreement on workers' rights in Wales? OAQ54615

Well, the withdrawal agreement fails to provide any guarantees that the UK Government is committed to retaining alignment with existing EU rights and protections for workers in Wales.

Wel, nid yw'r cytundeb ymadael yn darparu unrhyw warantau fod Llywodraeth y DU wedi ymrwymo i barhau i gydymffurfio â hawliau ac amddiffyniadau presennol yr UE i weithwyr yng Nghymru.

Thank you for that very clear answer, Minister. It is absolutely clear that the latest withdrawal agreement represents a further weakening of the UK Government's commitment to workers' rights. Frances O'Grady, secretary of the Trades Union Congress, has said:

'This deal would be a disaster for working people. It would hammer the economy, cost jobs and sell workers’ rights down the river.'

Do you agree with Sir Keir Starmer, the UK shadow Brexit Secretary, that there would be a real danger if this deal goes through that there would be a serious weakening of workers' rights and that it would be very likely that the UK would follow other models, such as the United States', which have considerably weaker protections for workers than we currently enjoy here in this country?

Diolch am eich ateb clir iawn, Weinidog. Mae'n gwbl amlwg fod y cytundeb ymadael diweddaraf yn arwydd o wanychu pellach ar ymrwymiad Llywodraeth y DU tuag at hawliau gweithwyr. Mae Frances O'Grady, ysgrifennydd Cyngres yr Undebau Llafur, wedi dweud:

Byddai'r cytundeb hwn yn drychineb i weithwyr. Byddai’n ergyd i'r economi, yn arwain at golli swyddi ac yn troi cefn ar hawliau gweithwyr.

A ydych yn cytuno â Syr Keir Starmer, Ysgrifennydd Brexit yr wrthblaid ar gyfer y DU, y byddai perygl gwirioneddol, pe bai'r cytundeb hwn yn cael ei dderbyn, y byddai hawliau gweithwyr yn cael eu gwanychu'n sylweddol ac y byddai'n debygol iawn y byddai'r DU yn dilyn modelau eraill, fel un yr Unol Daleithiau, sy'n cynnwys amddiffyniadau gwannach o lawer i weithwyr na'r rhai sydd gennym yn y wlad hon ar hyn o bryd?

Well, I think the Member hits the nail on the head. That is exactly, I think, the risk that comes out of this agreement. In fact, I'd go further than to say that it's a risk; I think the nature of the agreement discloses the kind of destination in which the current UK Government wants to take the UK. It's one of deregulation, where the UK has given up on workplace protection and social and environmental rights of the kind that we in Wales both take for granted and would wish of course to continue to align with. 

As her question implies, this deal is even worse than Theresa May's deal, which at least committed the Government to maintaining the current level of EU workers' rights and gave Parliament some mechanism into the future around that. The kind of vision that is outlined in this agreement is fundamentally at odds with the priorities of the Welsh Government here in Wales, as set out in the work of the Fair Work Commission recently, which ensures that we as a Government will continue to take every step that we can to make sure that workers in Wales are not disadvantaged if and when we leave the European Union.

Wel, credaf fod yr Aelod yn taro'r hoelen ar ei phen. Credaf mai dyna'n union yw'r risg yn sgil y cytundeb hwn. Mewn gwirionedd, buaswn yn mynd gam ymhellach na'i alw'n risg; credaf fod natur y cytundeb yn datgelu'r math o ben draw y mae Llywodraeth bresennol y DU yn awyddus i fynd â'r DU iddo. Mae'n un o ddadreoleiddio, lle mae'r DU wedi rhoi'r gorau i amddiffyniad yn y gweithle a hawliau cymdeithasol ac amgylcheddol o'r math rydym ni yng Nghymru yn eu cymryd yn ganiataol ac yr hoffem barhau i gydymffurfio â hwy wrth gwrs.

Fel yr awgryma ei chwestiwn, mae'r cytundeb hwn hyd yn oed yn waeth na chytundeb Theresa May, a oedd o leiaf yn ymrwymo'r Llywodraeth i gynnal hawliau gweithwyr yr UE ar eu lefel bresennol ac a oedd yn rhoi rhywfaint o fecanwaith i Senedd y DU yn y dyfodol mewn perthynas â hynny. Mae'r math o weledigaeth a amlinellir yn y cytundeb hwn yn gwbl groes i flaenoriaethau Llywodraeth Cymru yma yng Nghymru fel y'u nodwyd yng ngwaith y Comisiwn Gwaith Teg yn ddiweddar, sy'n sicrhau y byddwn ni fel Llywodraeth yn parhau i wneud popeth y gallwn i sicrhau nad yw gweithwyr yng Nghymru dan anfantais os a phan fyddwn yn gadael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd.

14:55
3. Dadl o dan Reol Sefydlog 25.15 ar Orchymyn Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006 (Diwygio) 2019—Gorchymyn Adran 109 yn ymwneud â Swyddogion Cofrestru Etholiadol
3. Debate under Standing Order 25.15 on The Government of Wales Act 2006 (Amendment) Order 2019—Section 109 Order relating to Electoral Registration Officers

Item 3 on the agenda this afternoon is a debate under Standing Order 25.15 on the Government of Wales Act 2006 (Amendment) Order 2019—section 109 Order relating to the electoral registration officers. I call on the Counsel General and the Brexit Minister to move the motion—Jeremy Miles.

Eitem 3 ar yr agenda y prynhawn yma yw dadl o dan Reol Sefydlog 25.15 ar Orchymyn Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006 (Diwygio) 2019—Gorchymyn adran 109 yn ymwneud â swyddogion cofrestru etholiadol. Galwaf ar y Cwnsler Cyffredinol a'r Gweinidog Brexit i gynnig y cynnig—Jeremy Miles.

Cynnig NDM7176 Jeremy Miles

Cynnig bod Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru, yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 25.15 yn cymeradwyo fersiwn ddrafft Gorchymyn Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006 (Diwygio) 2019.

Motion NDM7176 Jeremy Miles

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales, in accordance with Standing Order 25.15 approves the draft version of The Government of Wales Act 2006 (Amendment) Order 2019.

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I move the motion to approve this Order in Council under section 109 of the Government of Wales Act 2006. This Order makes some progress in addressing issues of competence that have arisen as a result of the Wales Act 2017. When the Order is made, it will ensure that the Assembly can effectively and comprehensively legislate in relation to electoral law relating to devolved Welsh elections. This was of course the original intention of Parliament when the Wales Act 2017 was developed.

It's also necessary to allow for coherent regulations to be made in relation to canvass reform in time for the 2020 annual canvass, and to ensure that the lines of executive competence between the UK Government and Welsh Ministers are clear. Electoral law is contained in a wide array of primary and secondary legislation, and the role of electoral registration officers is essential to electoral registration and thus to electoral reform. Without the ability to confer functions on an electoral registration officer in new legislation, the electoral functions of the Welsh Ministers are significantly restricted.

It became apparent through the canvass reform project that the particular mechanism by which electoral functions, and specifically those that affect electoral registration officers, have been transferred means that no one person, the Welsh Ministers nor the Secretary of State, would have a fully coherent set of powers in relation to devolved elections. Once this Order is made, we will be able to progress the canvass reform agenda, which will streamline the registration process in Wales and will make it easier for the electorate to engage with.

The Order will also enable us to make the necessary changes to the role of electoral registration officer in relation to devolved elections in primary legislation without needing to seek the consent of the UK Government each time. This includes changes we will be proposing in our forthcoming local government and elections (Wales) Bill. This will support the electoral reform agenda in Wales and it will enable the modernisation of electoral practices, and ultimately it will support voters in engaging with democracy.

The UK Government has recognised the challenges that have been created by the way in which functions have been transferred, together with the operation of the provisions of Schedule 7B to the Government of Wales Act, so they were content to bring forward the Order as a matter of urgency and have ensured its progress through Parliament as speedily as possible. I therefore ask the Assembly to approve it.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Cynigiaf y cynnig i gymeradwyo'r Gorchymyn hwn yn y Cyfrin Gyngor o dan adran 109 o Ddeddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006. Mae'r Gorchymyn hwn yn gwneud rhywfaint o gynnydd wrth fynd i'r afael â materion cymhwysedd sydd wedi codi o ganlyniad i Ddeddf Cymru 2017. Pan wneir y Gorchymyn, bydd yn sicrhau y gall y Cynulliad ddeddfu'n effeithiol ac yn gynhwysfawr mewn perthynas â chyfraith etholiadol sy'n ymwneud ag etholiadau datganoledig Cymru. Dyma oedd bwriad gwreiddiol Senedd y DU, wrth gwrs, pan ddatblygwyd Deddf Cymru 2017.

Mae hefyd yn angenrheidiol er mwyn caniatáu i reoliadau cydlynol gael eu gwneud mewn perthynas â diwygio'r canfasiad mewn pryd ar gyfer canfasiad blynyddol 2020, ac i sicrhau bod y llinellau cymhwysedd gweithredol rhwng Llywodraeth y DU a Gweinidogion Cymru yn glir. Mae cyfraith etholiadol yn cynnwys ystod eang o ddeddfwriaeth sylfaenol ac is-ddeddfwriaeth, ac mae rôl swyddogion cofrestru etholiadol yn hanfodol i gofrestru etholiadol ac felly i ddiwygio etholiadol. Heb y gallu i roi swyddogaethau i swyddogion cofrestru etholiadol mewn deddfwriaeth newydd, mae swyddogaethau etholiadol Gweinidogion Cymru wedi'u cyfyngu'n sylweddol.

Daeth yn amlwg drwy brosiect diwygio'r canfasiad fod y mecanwaith penodol ar gyfer trosglwyddo swyddogaethau etholiadol, ac yn benodol y rheini sy'n effeithio ar swyddogion cofrestru etholiadol, yn golygu na fyddai gan unrhyw unigolyn, Gweinidogion Cymru na'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol set gwbl gydlynol o bwerau mewn perthynas ag etholiadau datganoledig. Pan fydd y Gorchymyn hwn wedi'i wneud, bydd modd inni fwrw ymlaen â'r agenda i ddiwygio'r canfasiad, a fydd yn symleiddio'r broses gofrestru yng Nghymru ac yn ei gwneud hi'n haws i etholwyr ymwneud â hi.

Bydd y Gorchymyn hefyd yn ein galluogi i wneud y newidiadau angenrheidiol i rôl swyddogion cofrestru etholiadol mewn perthynas ag etholiadau datganoledig mewn deddfwriaeth sylfaenol heb fod angen ceisio cydsyniad Llywodraeth y DU bob tro. Mae hyn yn cynnwys newidiadau y byddwn yn eu cynnig yn ein Bil llywodraeth leol ac etholiadau (Cymru) sydd ar y ffordd. Bydd hyn yn cefnogi'r agenda diwygio etholiadol yng Nghymru ac yn galluogi i arferion etholiadol gael eu moderneiddio, ac yn y pen draw, bydd yn cynorthwyo pleidleiswyr i gymryd rhan ym mhroses democratiaeth.

Mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi cydnabod yr heriau a grëwyd yn sgil y ffordd y mae swyddogaethau wedi'u trosglwyddo, ynghyd â gweithrediad darpariaethau Atodlen 7B i Ddeddf Llywodraeth Cymru, felly roeddent yn fodlon cyflwyno'r Gorchymyn fel mater o frys ac maent wedi sicrhau y bydd yn mynd drwy Senedd y DU mor gyflym â phosibl. Gofynnaf felly i'r Cynulliad ei gymeradwyo.

Thank you. Can I call Carwyn Jones to speak on behalf of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee? Carwyn.

Diolch. A gaf fi alw ar Carwyn Jones i siarad ar ran y Pwyllgor Materion Cyfansoddiadol a Deddfwriaethol? Carwyn.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. The Business Committee referred the Government of Wales Act 2006 (Amendment) Order 2019 to the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee in accordance with Standing Order 25.7(i). We took evidence from the Counsel General on the proposed Order at our meeting on 16 September 2019, and we laid our report before the Assembly on 30 September of this year. Since then, we note that the Order was approved by the House of Commons and the House of Lords on 28 October of this year. Dirprwy Lywydd, during our evidence session, the Counsel General explained the purpose and objective for the proposed Order, as well as the relationship between the Order, the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill and the Welsh Government's forthcoming local government Bill. We've noted the background and purpose for the proposed Order and, Dirprwy Lywydd, we are content.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Cyfeiriodd y Pwyllgor Busnes Orchymyn Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006 (Diwygio) 2019 at y Pwyllgor Materion Cyfansoddiadol a Deddfwriaethol yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 25.7(i). Cawsom dystiolaeth gan y Cwnsler Cyffredinol ar y Gorchymyn arfaethedig yn ein cyfarfod ar 16 Medi 2019, a chyflwynasom ein hadroddiad i'r Cynulliad ar 30 Medi eleni. Ers hynny, nodwn fod y Gorchymyn wedi'i gymeradwyo gan Dŷ'r Cyffredin a Thŷ'r Arglwyddi ar 28 Hydref eleni. Ddirprwy Lywydd, yn ystod ein sesiwn dystiolaeth, esboniodd y Cwnsler Cyffredinol ddiben ac amcan y Gorchymyn arfaethedig, yn ogystal â'r berthynas rhwng y Gorchymyn, Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru) a Bil llywodraeth leol Llywodraeth Cymru sydd ar y ffordd. Rydym wedi nodi cefndir a diben y Gorchymyn arfaethedig, ac rydym yn fodlon, Ddirprwy Lywydd.

Thank you. I call on the Counsel General and Brexit Minister to reply.

Diolch. Galwaf ar y Cwnsler Cyffredinol a'r Gweinidog Brexit i ymateb.

I thank Carwyn Jones for his remarks and for the work of CLAC in relation to this Order. If the Assembly approves the Order, it will be considered next by the Privy Council at its next meeting. I expect the date for that meeting to be confirmed following the UK general election. And, in closing, can I put on record my thanks to officials in both the Welsh Government and the UK Government for enabling this legislation to be brought forward rapidly?

Diolch i Carwyn Jones am ei sylwadau ac am waith y Pwyllgor Materion Cyfansoddiadol a Deddfwriaethol mewn perthynas â'r Gorchymyn hwn. Os bydd y Cynulliad yn cymeradwyo'r Gorchymyn, bydd y Cyfrin Gyngor yn ei ystyried yn ei gyfarfod nesaf. Rwy'n disgwyl i'r dyddiad ar gyfer y cyfarfod hwnnw gael ei gadarnhau yn dilyn etholiad cyffredinol y DU. Ac i gloi, a gaf fi gofnodi fy niolch i swyddogion yn Llywodraeth Cymru a Llywodraeth y DU am ei gwneud hi'n bosibl dwyn y ddeddfwriaeth hon gerbron yn gyflym?

15:00

Thank you. The proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Diolch. Y cynnig yw derbyn y cynnig. A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Na. Felly, derbynnir y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.

Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

5. Cwestiynau Amserol
5. Topical Questions

We now move to topical questions, and the first this afternoon, to be answered by the Minister for Health and Social Services, is from Jack Sargeant. 

Symudwn yn awr at y cwestiynau amserol, a daw'r cyntaf y prynhawn yma, a fydd yn cael ei ateb gan y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol, gan Jack Sargeant.

Orkambi a Symkevi
Orkambi and Symkevi

1. Pa ystyriaeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i gwneud o benderfyniad GIG Lloegr i gymeradwyo'r defnydd o Orkambi a Symkevi? 359

1. What consideration has the Welsh Government made of NHS England’s decision to approve the use of Orkambi and Symkevi? 359

Thank you for the question. The use of Orkambi a Symkevi in NHS England is approved only through a commercial access agreement. My officials have met with, and await a formal offer from, Vertex. Given the confidential nature of our discussions, there is, of course, a limit to the comment that I can make. 

Diolch am y cwestiwn. Nid yw GIG Lloegr ond wedi cymeradwyo defnyddio Orkambi a Symkevi drwy gytundeb mynediad masnachol. Mae fy swyddogion wedi cyfarfod â Vertex ac maent yn aros am gynnig ffurfiol ganddynt. O ystyried natur gyfrinachol ein trafodaethau, mae yna derfyn i'r sylwadau y gallaf eu gwneud wrth gwrs.

Thank you for that, Minister. As you are aware, I have constituents who are now travelling across the border to Liverpool and Manchester for treatment. They will be in the same building as England patients who can access this medicine. Minister, can you assure me that negotiations in the conversations you are having with Vertex are ongoing and are positive so that my constituents and the people of Wales can access these medicines as soon as possible? And, finally, Minister, have you also given any consideration to introducing an interim patient access scheme, as was the case in NHS Scotland, while the agreement was being reached on access to these two very important medicines?

Diolch i chi am hynny, Weinidog. Fel y gwyddoch, mae gennyf etholwyr sy'n gorfod teithio dros y ffin i Lerpwl a Manceinion i gael triniaeth. Byddant yn yr un adeilad â chleifion o Loegr sy'n gallu cael mynediad at y feddyginiaeth hon. Weinidog, a allwch fy sicrhau bod y negodiadau yn y sgyrsiau rydych yn eu cael gyda Vertex yn parhau a'u bod yn gadarnhaol fel y gall fy etholwyr a phobl Cymru gael mynediad at y meddyginiaethau hyn cyn gynted â phosibl? Ac yn olaf, Weinidog, a ydych chi hefyd wedi ystyried cyflwyno cynllun dros dro ar gyfer mynediad i gleifion, fel y digwyddodd yn GIG yr Alban, wrth ddod i gytundeb ynghylch mynediad at y meddyginiaethau pwysig hyn?

The Member will be aware of the letter published by Simon Stevens, the chief executive of NHS England on this matter, sent to the House of Commons's Health and Social Care Select Committee. That set out that Northern Ireland and Wales have stood alongside England in the negotiation of the agreement that has been reached. My expectation is that those terms will be honoured. I made public comment yesterday that I would sign up today to exactly the same pro-rata terms for Wales, and I wish to be able to do so. That is my commitment. There should not be a delay for any family in Wales. I look forward to a properly constructive and honest response from Vertex that allows that to take place. 

Bydd yr Aelod yn ymwybodol o'r llythyr a gyhoeddwyd gan Simon Stevens, prif weithredwr GIG Lloegr ar y mater hwn, a anfonwyd at Bwyllgor Dethol Iechyd a Gofal Cymdeithasol Tŷ’r Cyffredin. Roedd hwnnw'n nodi bod Gogledd Iwerddon a Chymru wedi sefyll ochr yn ochr â Lloegr wrth negodi'r cytundeb a wnaed. Rwy'n disgwyl y bydd y telerau hynny'n cael eu hanrhydeddu. Gwneuthum sylw cyhoeddus ddoe y byddwn yn ymrwymo heddiw i'r un telerau pro rata yn union ar gyfer Cymru, a hoffwn allu gwneud hynny. Dyna fy ymrwymiad. Ni ddylai unrhyw deulu wynebu oedi yng Nghymru. Edrychaf ymlaen at ymateb priodol o onest ac adeiladol gan Vertex a fydd yn caniatáu i hynny ddigwydd.

Minister, I know that you share with me concerns that, every day that passes, we have patients in Wales who aren't able to access these extremely important drugs. Now, on 25 October, you said that you and your officials were meeting with representatives from Vertex the following week to discuss details of these terms and how they might be applied. I do understand you've got company confidentiality issues here, but are you able to give us any form of update on that? 

May I also ask what lessons have been learned from the length of time that it's taken to make progress on this issue, and how could things be done differently in future to ensure that we're not left behind the curve when it comes to reaching agreements on making life-saving drugs available for Welsh patients?

And finally, in terms of learning lessons, I understand that in early 2018, the company had been in discussions with NHS Wales on a portfolio proposal for all their current and future cystic fibrosis medicines. However, and I'm directly quoting, these discussions were halted in March/April, due to what we understood at the time to be a staffing issue at NHS Wales all-Wales medicines procurement. Minister, can you shed any light on that and provide assurances that such hold-ups will not happen again?

Weinidog, gwn eich bod yn rhannu fy mhryderon fod gennym, gyda phob dydd sy'n mynd heibio, gleifion yng Nghymru nad ydynt yn gallu cael mynediad at y meddyginiaethau hynod bwysig hyn. Nawr, ar 25 Hydref, fe ddywedoch eich bod chi a'ch swyddogion yn cyfarfod â chynrychiolwyr o Vertex yr wythnos ganlynol i drafod manylion y telerau hyn a sut y gellid eu cymhwyso. Rwy'n deall bod gennych faterion yn ymwneud â chyfrinachedd cwmnïau yma, ond a allwch chi roi unrhyw fath o ddiweddariad i ni ar hynny?

A gaf fi ofyn hefyd pa wersi a ddysgwyd o'r amser a gymerwyd i wneud cynnydd ar y mater hwn, a sut y gellid gwneud pethau'n wahanol yn y dyfodol i sicrhau na chawn ein gadael ar ôl pan fo angen dod i gytundeb i sicrhau bod cyffuriau sy'n achub bywydau ar gael i gleifion Cymru?

Ac yn olaf, o ran dysgu gwersi, deallaf fod y cwmni, ar ddechrau 2018, wedi bod mewn trafodaethau gyda GIG Cymru ar gynnig portffolio ar gyfer eu holl feddyginiaethau ffeibrosis systig presennol ac yn y dyfodol. Fodd bynnag, ac rwy'n dyfynnu'n uniongyrchol, daeth y trafodaethau hyn i stop ym mis Mawrth/Ebrill, oherwydd yr hyn y deallem ar y pryd a oedd yn fater staffio ym mhroses gaffael meddyginiaethau Cymru gyfan GIG Cymru. Weinidog, a allwch chi daflu unrhyw oleuni ar hynny a rhoi sicrwydd i ni na fydd y fath oedi'n digwydd eto?

On your final point, that simply isn't true. It's simply not true. Vertex understand very well the well-established appraisal mechanisms we have right across the United Kingdom for new medicines: the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence appraisal system that we sign up to, the particular appraisal systems also available in Scotland, and here in Wales through the All Wales Medicines Strategy Group. What they have done, in reaching an agreement with England, which is in the text of Simon Stevens's letter, is they've agreed to provide real-time patient data on a basis where they've agreed a price for access to be made available for every patient for whom the treatment and the condition are indicated, and they will then submit their whole portfolio, with that real-time data, to NICE for appraisal. Now that makes sense, and that was not the proposal that was ever provided here in Wales.

I am clear that we are not responsible in Wales for holding up access to these medicines. The issue is that Vertex need to do what they've committed to do, which is in Simon Stevens's letter. And that is the start and the end of the matter. No family in Wales should be put into a less advantageous position than a family across our border because of an inability to meet the terms of the deal that has been agreed. I look forward to a positive and constructive response from the pharmaceutical company.

Ar eich pwynt olaf, nid yw'n wir o gwbl. Nid yw'n wir o gwbl. Mae Vertex yn deall y mecanweithiau gwerthuso sefydledig sydd gennym ar gyfer meddyginiaethau newydd ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig yn iawn: system arfarnu'r Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal rydym wedi ymrwymo iddi, y systemau arfarnu penodol sydd hefyd ar gael yn yr Alban, ac yma yng Nghymru drwy Grŵp Strategaeth Meddyginiaethau Cymru Gyfan. Yr hyn y maent wedi'i wneud, wrth ddod i gytundeb â Lloegr, sydd wedi'i gynnwys yn llythyr Simon Stevens, yw cytuno i ddarparu data cleifion amser real ar sail lle maent wedi cytuno ar bris i sicrhau bod mynediad ar gael i bob claf sy'n dioddef o'r cyflwr ac sydd angen y driniaeth, ac yna byddant yn cyflwyno eu portffolio cyfan, gyda'r data amser real hwnnw, i'r Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal i'w arfarnu. Nawr, mae hynny'n gwneud synnwyr, ac nid dyna'r cynnig a roddwyd yma yng Nghymru.

Rwy'n glir nad ydym ni yng Nghymru yn gyfrifol am oedi mynediad at y meddyginiaethau hyn. Y broblem yw bod angen i Vertex wneud yr hyn y maent wedi ymrwymo i'w wneud, sef yr hyn sydd yn llythyr Simon Stevens. A dyna ddechrau a diwedd y mater. Ni ddylai'r un teulu yng Nghymru gael ei roi mewn sefyllfa lai manteisiol na theulu dros y ffin oherwydd anallu i fodloni telerau'r cytundeb y cytunwyd arno. Edrychaf ymlaen at ymateb cadarnhaol ac adeiladol gan y cwmni fferyllol.

15:05

Thank you. The second topical question this afternoon is from Angela Burns. 

Diolch. Daw'r ail gwestiwn amserol y prynhawn yma gan Angela Burns.

Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Cwm Taf Morgannwg
The Cwm Taf Morgannwg University Health Board

2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am golli 2,763 o gleifion yn ddiweddar o'r rhestr aros ym Mwrdd Iechyd Cwm Taf Morgannwg? 360

2. Will the Minister make a statement on the recent loss of 2,763 patients from the waiting list in Cwm Taf Morgannwg Health Board? 360

These patients were always reported on an internal list within the health board, and their waiting times were monitored. They are now being reported on the correct referral-to-treatment or diagnostic list. Robust mechanisms are now in place to ensure the health board reports all patients correctly.

Roedd y cleifion hyn bob amser wedi eu cofnodi ar restr fewnol o fewn y bwrdd iechyd, ac roedd eu hamseroedd aros yn cael eu monitro. Cânt eu cofnodi nawr ar y rhestr aros rhwng atgyfeirio a thriniaeth neu'r rhestr ddiagnostig gywir. Mae mecanweithiau cadarn yn eu lle nawr i sicrhau bod y bwrdd iechyd yn adrodd am bob claf yn gywir.

I am very pleased to hear you use the word 'now' with great emphasis twice, because I am very concerned about this news. It's yet another failing by the management of Cwm Taf, and I truly feel sorry for the hard-working front-line staff of this health board who, week after week, see the name of the health board being tainted through no fault of their own. I'm also concerned about the confidence that patients living in this health board area have in receiving the care that they so desperately need.

Now, we are aware of the ongoing full-scale review that's been taken into maternity services, and we debated that last month and I think there are some very positive movements there, but you will know from the report that it's been cited on a number of different occasions that there are cultural systemic issues that run throughout the whole of the board's operation. I'll quote directly from the report:

'it is unrealistic to expect that longstanding issues related to culture, attitudes and behaviours can be addressed within a few months.'

So, with this background in mind, I simply ask the following three questions. Will you consider ordering or do you believe that we need to have a more comprehensive review that looks at all the services that Cwm Taf offers, and not just maternity services, if there are these systemic issues at play, and this waiting list issue could be an example of yet another? What confidence, Minister, do you have that other similar losses of data are not being replicated in other health boards? I appreciate that it was on an internal list that you didn't have eyes on, and neither did anybody else. Bearing in mind that this has occurred in one, is it occurring elsewhere? And finally, could you please explain to us what methodology is in place within your department to ensure that the data you receive from all our health boards across Wales is accurate, because good data collection is absolutely essential to help you, the Government, to plan the future delivery of healthcare? In order to be able to plan that, we need that data to be right, we need it to be the truth, the absolute truth and nothing but the truth.    

Rwy'n falch iawn o'ch clywed yn defnyddio'r gair 'nawr' gyda phwyslais mawr ddwywaith, oherwydd rwy'n bryderus iawn am y newyddion hwn. Mae'n fethiant arall eto gan reolwyr Cwm Taf, ac rwy'n teimlo trueni gwirioneddol dros staff rheng flaen gweithgar y bwrdd iechyd hwn sydd, wythnos ar ôl wythnos, yn gweld enw'r bwrdd iechyd yn cael ei bardduo heb fod unrhyw fai arnynt hwy. Rwyf hefyd yn pryderu na fydd cleifion sy'n byw yn ardal y bwrdd iechyd hwn yn hyderus y byddant yn derbyn y gofal y maent ei angen yn daer.

Nawr, rydym yn ymwybodol o'r adolygiad llawn o wasanaethau mamolaeth sydd ar y gweill ar hyn o bryd, ac fe drafodasom hynny y mis diwethaf a chredaf fod rhai camau cadarnhaol iawn yno, ond fe fyddwch yn gwybod o'r adroddiad bod problemau systemig diwylliannol wedi'u nodi ar nifer o wahanol achlysuron a hynny drwy holl weithrediad y bwrdd. Fe ddyfynnaf yn uniongyrchol o'r adroddiad:

Mae'n afrealistig disgwyl y gellir datrys problemau hirsefydlog sy'n ymwneud â diwylliant, agweddau ac ymddygiad o fewn ychydig fisoedd.

Felly, gan gadw'r cefndir hwn mewn cof, gofynnaf y tri chwestiwn canlynol. A wnewch chi ystyried gofyn am, neu a ydych yn credu bod angen cael adolygiad mwy cynhwysfawr sy'n edrych ar yr holl wasanaethau y mae Cwm Taf yn eu cynnig, ac nid gwasanaethau mamolaeth yn unig, os ceir problemau systemig, a gallai'r broblem hon gyda'r rhestrau aros fod yn enghraifft o broblem arall? Pa mor ffyddiog ydych chi, Weinidog, na cheir achosion tebyg o golli data mewn byrddau iechyd eraill? Rwy'n sylweddoli mai rhestr fewnol oedd yr un na welsoch chi, na neb arall ychwaith. O gofio bod hyn wedi digwydd mewn un man, a yw'n digwydd mewn mannau eraill? Ac yn olaf, a allech chi egluro wrthym pa fethodoleg sydd ar waith yn eich adran i sicrhau bod y data rydych yn ei dderbyn gan ein holl fyrddau iechyd ledled Cymru yn gywir, os gwelwch yn dda, oherwydd mae casglu data da yn gwbl hanfodol i'ch helpu chi, y Llywodraeth, i gynllunio ar gyfer darparu gofal iechyd yn y dyfodol? Er mwyn gallu cynllunio hynny, mae angen i'r data hwnnw fod yn gywir, rydym angen y gwir, y gwir i gyd a dim byd ond y gwir.    

I'll deal with your final two points first, because in terms of whether other data issues exist, there is regular scrutiny of reported statistics by our official statistics department within the Government, and they are absolutely scrupulous in the work that they do. And where there are any caveats to data that is received, they're published as part of the statistics report. I'm sure that you and colleagues who do scrutinise those reports when they're provided will note that those caveats are occasionally provided. It's also part of the reason, because we want official statistics for the public to be able to rely upon, that we've not been able to make progress in a number of other areas, because we want to be clear that the data is reliable. I'm under pressure in a number of other areas to make official statistics available, and I've held the line about saying they'll be available when we are certain that we're measuring the same things in the same way across the country, and that is exactly what I expect here.

Actually, what happened here was that the health board themselves asked the NHS delivery unit to validate their waiting lists. That review resulted in these people being properly added to the list. So, the health board themselves said, 'We think we may have a problem, get an external body through the Welsh Government to come in and do so.' And more than that, the delivery unit's report is available on the health board's website, so the level of transparency is there now. They've recognised that this was an issue and it's been dealt with. I don't believe there is a need for a further comprehensive review into the organisation. As you know, the status of the whole organisation has been raised to targeted intervention. If there are any further steps that are required, I will report back openly and transparently, together with advice that I'll receive from the NHS Wales chief executive, the Wales Audit Office and, of course, Healthcare Inspectorate Wales.   

Rwyf am ymdrin â'ch dau bwynt olaf yn gyntaf, oherwydd o ran y cwestiwn a oes problemau eraill yn bodoli gyda data, mae'r ystadegau a gofnodir yn cael eu harchwilio'n rheolaidd gan ein hadran ystadegau swyddogol o fewn y Llywodraeth, ac maent yn gwbl gydwybodol yn y gwaith a wnânt. A lle ceir unrhyw gafeatau i'r data a dderbynnir, cânt eu cyhoeddi fel rhan o'r adroddiad ystadegau. Rwy'n siŵr y byddwch chi a chymheiriaid sy'n craffu ar yr adroddiadau hynny pan gânt eu darparu yn nodi bod y cafeatau hynny'n cael eu darparu o bryd i'w gilydd. Hefyd, oherwydd ein bod eisiau ystadegau swyddogol i'r cyhoedd allu dibynnu arnynt, mae'n rhan o'r rheswm pam nad ydym wedi gallu gwneud cynnydd mewn nifer o feysydd eraill, oherwydd rydym eisiau bod yn glir bod y data yn ddibynadwy. Rwyf dan bwysau mewn nifer o feysydd eraill i sicrhau bod ystadegau swyddogol ar gael, ac rwyf wedi cadw dweud y byddant ar gael pan fyddwn yn sicr ein bod yn mesur yr un pethau yn yr un ffordd ar draws y wlad, a dyna'n union rwy'n ei ddisgwyl yma.

Mewn gwirionedd, yr hyn a ddigwyddodd yma oedd bod y bwrdd iechyd eu hunain wedi gofyn i uned gyflawni'r GIG ddilysu eu rhestrau aros. Arweiniodd yr adolygiad hwnnw at ychwanegu'r bobl hyn at y rhestr yn briodol. Felly, dywedodd y bwrdd iechyd ei hun, 'Rydym yn credu y gallai fod gennym broblem, gadewch i ni gael corff allanol drwy Lywodraeth Cymru i ddod i mewn a gwneud hynny.' Ac yn fwy na hynny, mae adroddiad yr uned gyflawni ar gael ar wefan y bwrdd iechyd, felly mae'r lefel honno o dryloywder yno nawr. Maent wedi cydnabod bod hon yn broblem ac mae wedi cael ei datrys. Nid wyf yn credu bod angen adolygiad cynhwysfawr pellach o'r sefydliad. Fel y gwyddoch, mae statws y sefydliad cyfan wedi'i godi i ymyriad wedi'i dargedu. Os oes angen cymryd unrhyw gamau pellach, byddaf yn adrodd yn ôl yn agored ac yn dryloyw, gyda chyngor y byddaf yn ei gael gan brif weithredwr GIG Cymru, Swyddfa Archwilio Cymru, ac Arolygiaeth Gofal Iechyd Cymru wrth gwrs.    

This might seem like a trivial issue about a data entry error, but behind it lies consistent poor performance of even basic administrative functions. Without proper and accurate data on waiting times, we can't judge whether or not things are getting better or worse. We can't pinpoint the areas that need investment and the areas where patient safety may be at risk because of lengthening waiting times, yet poor quality of data throughout the NHS is an issue highlighted time and time again by committee report after committee report. So, how confident are you that the decisions that you make, when the data that you have shows itself to be consistently unreliable, are the right decisions?

Efallai fod hwn i'w weld yn fater dibwys ynglŷn â gwall cofnodi data, ond y tu ôl iddo, roedd hyd yn oed swyddogaethau gweinyddol sylfaenol yn cael eu perfformio'n wael yn gyson. Heb ddata cywir ar amseroedd aros, ni allwn farnu a yw pethau'n gwella neu'n gwaethygu. Ni allwn nodi'n fanwl y meysydd y mae angen buddsoddi ynddynt a'r meysydd lle gallai diogelwch cleifion fod mewn perygl oherwydd amseroedd aros hwy, ac eto mae ansawdd gwael y data ledled y GIG yn fater sydd wedi cael sylw dro ar ôl tro gan un adroddiad pwyllgor ar ôl y llall. Felly, pa mor hyderus ydych chi fod y penderfyniadau a wnewch, pan fo'r data sydd gennych yn gyson annibynadwy, yn benderfyniadau cywir?

15:10

I don't accept the premise of the Member's question that the data is consistently unreliable. We're open and we're honest about the accuracy that we have in our official statistics. Those official statistics do, of course, help to inform the choices that we make and the scrutiny we have on our services. I think a blanket attack that says, 'You can't rely on data provided by the NHS' is misplaced and it's not the way that I intend to run the health service.

Nid wyf yn derbyn cynsail cwestiwn yr Aelod fod y data yn gyson annibynadwy. Rydym yn agored ac yn onest ynglŷn â'r cywirdeb sydd gennym yn ein hystadegau swyddogol. Mae'r ystadegau swyddogol hynny, wrth gwrs, yn helpu i lywio'r dewisiadau a wnawn a'r gwaith craffu sydd gennym ar ein gwasanaethau. Rwy'n credu bod ymosodiad cyffredinol sy'n dweud, 'Ni allwch ddibynnu ar ddata a ddarperir gan y GIG' yn gyfeiliornus ac nid dyna'r ffordd rwy'n bwriadu rhedeg y gwasanaeth iechyd.

Minister, while I accept that the investigation found no evidence of clinical harm and there was no indication that Cwm Taf had been deliberately trying to manipulate the figures, this does raise serious questions about the management of waiting lists, both in Cwm Taf and across all health boards. I'm sure all of us here can list examples of patients being removed from waiting lists because they didn't respond to a letter they may never have received. Minister, will you launch a wider investigation in waiting list management across all local health boards, and will you look at how technology can be used to improve the management of hospital appointments?

Weinidog, er fy mod yn derbyn na ddaeth yr ymchwiliad o hyd i unrhyw dystiolaeth o niwed clinigol ac er nad oedd unrhyw arwydd bod Cwm Taf wedi bod yn ceisio ystumio'r ffigurau'n fwriadol, mae hyn yn codi cwestiynau difrifol ynghylch y ffordd y caiff rhestrau aros eu rheoli, yng Nghwm Taf ac ar draws yr holl fyrddau iechyd. Rwy'n siŵr y gall pob un ohonom yn y fan hon restru enghreifftiau o gleifion yn cael eu tynnu oddi ar restrau aros am nad oeddent wedi ymateb i lythyr nad oeddent, o bosibl, wedi ei gael. Weinidog, a wnewch chi lansio ymchwiliad ehangach i'r ffordd y caiff rhestrau aros eu rheoli ar draws yr holl fyrddau iechyd lleol, ac a wnewch chi edrych ar sut y gellir defnyddio technoleg i wella'r ffordd y caiff apwyntiadau ysbyty eu rheoli?

As I said before to Angela Burns, I don't think a comprehensive review of Cwm Taf is needed, nor indeed into waiting list management. We are, though, always looking for how to make better use of technology to help manage appointments and waiting lists within the service. Part of what I'm keen to do is to make sure that best practice across health boards is adopted and rather more uniform across our service, so people know when they have appointments and attend those appointments to make sure that we're not running a service that builds in a level of inefficiency. So, I'm always on the look-out for how we improve the service, but I'm not looking to have an unnecessary and wasteful investigation across the national health service here in Wales. 

Fel y dywedais o'r blaen wrth Angela Burns, nid wyf yn credu bod angen adolygiad cynhwysfawr o Gwm Taf, nac yn wir o'r ffordd y caiff rhestri aros eu rheoli. Fodd bynnag, rydym bob amser yn chwilio am ffyrdd i wneud gwell defnydd o dechnoleg i helpu i reoli apwyntiadau a rhestri aros o fewn y gwasanaeth. Rhan o'r hyn rwy'n awyddus i'w wneud yw sicrhau bod arferion gorau yn cael eu mabwysiadu ar draws byrddau iechyd a'u bod yn fwy unffurf ar draws ein gwasanaeth, fel bod pobl yn gwybod, pan fydd ganddynt apwyntiadau a phan fyddant yn mynychu'r apwyntiadau hynny, y gallant fod yn siŵr nad ydym yn rhedeg gwasanaeth sy'n ychwanegu haen o aneffeithlonrwydd. Felly, rwyf bob amser yn meddwl sut y gallwn wella'r gwasanaeth, ond nid wyf yn bwriadu cael ymchwiliad diangen a gwastraffus ar draws y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol yma yng Nghymru.

Thank you very much. The third topical question this afternoon is to be answered by the Trefnydd, and it's Leanne Wood. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn. Leanne Wood sydd i ofyn y trydydd cwestiwn amserol y prynhawn yma, a bydd hwnnw'n cael ei ateb gan y Trefnydd.

Ymddiswyddiad Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru
The Resignation of the Secretary of State for Wales

3. Pa drafodaethau y mae’r Prif Weinidog wedi’u cael gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar y goblygiadau i Gymru yn dilyn ymddiswyddiad Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru? 361

3. What discussions has the First Minister had with the UK Government on the implications for Wales following the resignation of the Secretary of State for Wales? 361

We have had no such discussions.

Nid ydym wedi cael unrhyw drafodaethau o'r fath.

I've been disgusted by the events of the last week involving Ross England. His attempt to obstruct the justice system should have prompted widespread condemnation and immediate disciplinary action by the leadership of the Welsh Tories. Instead, it was followed by the promotion of Ross England as a candidate in a target Assembly seat. We should not forget that at the heart of this story is a woman who will have to live with what was done to her for the rest of her life. There is no way that she should have had to endure a second trial.

The episode has cost the Tory Secretary of State for Wales his Cabinet job. If he did know about this incident, as is suggested by the emergence of an e-mail from a special advisor, then he must withdraw as a candidate in this upcoming election. Anyone who minimises or condones the collapse of a rape trial is not fit for public office. If it is proven that other senior Tory figures in the party in Wales and England knew of this sordid affair but did nothing, then they must also seriously consider their positions.

Do you agree with me that Alun Cairns is unfit for public office and that any inquiry should include who else within the Tory party knew of Ross England's collapsed rape trial? And will you also be making representations to the UK Government when a new Secretary of State for Wales is announced to insist that someone with a knowledge of what our country needs is appointed? While this anachronistic post exists, we can ill afford another voice for the UK Government in Wales as opposed to what is required: a strong voice for Wales within the UK Government. 

Rwyf wedi ffieiddio at ddigwyddiadau'r wythnos ddiwethaf yn ymwneud â Ross England. Dylai ei ymgais i rwystro'r system gyfiawnder fod wedi ysgogi condemniad eang a chamau disgyblu ar unwaith gan arweinwyr y Torïaid Cymreig. Yn hytrach, arweiniodd at ddyrchafiad Ross England fel ymgeisydd mewn sedd darged yn y Cynulliad. Ni ddylem anghofio bod yna fenyw wrth wraidd y stori hon a fydd yn gorfod byw gyda'r hyn a wnaed iddi am weddill ei hoes. Nid oes unrhyw ffordd y dylai fod wedi gorfod dioddef ail achos o gwbl.

Mae'r digwyddiad wedi achosi i Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Torïaidd Cymru golli ei swydd yn y Cabinet. Os oedd yn gwybod am y digwyddiad hwn, fel yr awgrymir mewn e-bost gan gynghorydd arbennig, mae'n rhaid iddo sefyll i lawr fel ymgeisydd yn yr etholiad nesaf hwn. Nid yw unrhyw un sy'n lleihau neu'n esgusodi methiant achos o drais yn addas i gael swydd gyhoeddus. Os profir bod uwch ffigurau Torïaidd yn y blaid yng Nghymru a Lloegr yn gwybod am yr helynt ofnadwy hwn, ond heb wneud dim, mae'n rhaid iddynt hwythau hefyd roi ystyriaeth ddifrifol i'w dyfodol yn eu swyddi.

A ydych yn cytuno â mi fod Alun Cairns yn anaddas ar gyfer gwneud swydd gyhoeddus ac y dylai unrhyw ymchwiliad gynnwys unigolion eraill o fewn y Blaid Dorïaidd a wyddai am fethiant achos trais Ross England? Ac a fyddwch hefyd yn cyflwyno sylwadau i Lywodraeth y DU pan fydd enw Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru newydd yn cael ei gyhoeddi i fynnu eu bod yn penodi rhywun sy'n gwybod beth sydd ei angen ar ein gwlad? Tra bo'r swydd anacronistig hon yn bodoli, ni allwn fforddio llais arall i Lywodraeth y DU yng Nghymru yn lle'r hyn sydd ei angen: llais cryf i Gymru o fewn Llywodraeth y DU.

Well, Diprwy Lywydd, I completely share Leanne Wood's disgust at what happened with the case and the way in which it had been handled by the Conservative Party, and Leanne, of course, reminds us very, very importantly that behind all this is a woman's life who has been impacted by what's happened and, obviously, having to go through the current situation would be extremely distressing, so I think that in all of these discussions, we have to have the woman at heart, the victim at heart.

I will say that I agree with Jeremy Corbyn's comments on this issue, and he said, whilst Alun Cairns can legally stand,

'does he have a moral right to stand as a candidate?'

He goes on to say:

'If he’s stepping down as a minister because of his involvement then I would have thought the very least the Conservative party can do is not put him up as a candidate in the next election.'

And, of course, Leanne's right again to say that we do need a Secretary of State who understands Wales, and I very much look forward to a new Secretary of State after the general election who has Wales's interests at heart, rather than the interests of the Conservative Party at heart. And it's clearly not a good thing that we're in a situation now where the only Minister left in the Wales Office is the former MP for Torbay who, I think it's fair to say, would probably have limited knowledge of the issues affecting us here in Wales.

Wel, Ddirprwy Lywydd, rwy'n llwyr rannu ffieidd-dod Leanne Wood at yr hyn a ddigwyddodd gyda'r achos a'r modd y cafodd ei drin gan y Blaid Geidwadol, ac mae Leanne, wrth gwrs, yn ein hatgoffa, a hynny'n bwysig iawn, fod yna fenyw y tu ôl i hyn i gyd sydd wedi cael ei heffeithio gan yr hyn a ddigwyddodd, ac yn amlwg, byddai gorfod ymdopi â'r sefyllfa bresennol yn peri gofid mawr, felly rwy'n credu, yn yr holl drafodaethau hyn, y dylem gofio'n bennaf am y fenyw, y dioddefwr.

Rwyf am ddweud fy mod yn cytuno â sylwadau Jeremy Corbyn ar y mater, ac fe ddywedodd, er bod gan Alun Cairns hawl gyfreithlon i sefyll,

a oes ganddo hawl foesol i sefyll fel ymgeisydd?

Aiff ymlaen i ddweud:

Os yw'n ymddiswyddo fel gweinidog oherwydd y rhan a chwaraeodd buaswn wedi meddwl mai'r peth lleiaf y gall y Blaid Geidwadol ei wneud yw peidio â'i gynnig fel ymgeisydd yn yr etholiad nesaf. 

Ac wrth gwrs, mae Leanne yn iawn eto i ddweud ein bod angen Ysgrifennydd Gwladol sy'n deall Cymru, ac edrychaf ymlaen yn fawr at gael Ysgrifennydd Gwladol newydd, ar ôl yr etholiad cyffredinol, sy'n canolbwyntio ar fuddiannau Cymru yn hytrach na buddiannau'r Blaid Geidwadol. Ac yn amlwg, nid yw'n beth da ein bod mewn sefyllfa nawr lle mai'r unig Weinidog sydd ar ôl yn Swyddfa Cymru yw'r cyn AS dros Torbay a fyddai'n debygol o fod yn gyfyngedig ei wybodaeth am y materion sy'n effeithio arnom yma yng Nghymru, credaf ei bod yn deg dweud.

15:15

As I've made clear in my comments earlier today, I believe that the Secretary of State for Wales was right to resign from his role, given the circumstances. And I've also made it absolutely clear today that I think this case has been shocking and disturbing, and my heart goes out to this individual.

Now, as the Minister is aware, given today's resignation, an investigation under the UK Government's ministerial code will now take place, and that investigation will now take its course, and I very much agree. And it's important that we maintain the highest possible standards as politicians in all our parliamentary institutions, including here.

Therefore, can the Minister tell us what the Welsh Government is doing to ensure that its own ministerial code is as effective as possible so that the public can be confident in all our parliamentary institutions, and in all our Executive's institutions, to make sure that that code is as robust as possible?

Fel rwyf wedi'i egluro yn fy sylwadau yn gynharach heddiw, credaf fod Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru yn iawn i ymddiswyddo o'i rôl, o ystyried yr amgylchiadau. Ac rwyf hefyd wedi dweud yn gwbl glir heddiw fy mod yn credu bod yr achos hwn wedi bod yn frawychus, ac rwy'n cydymdeimlo'n fawr â'r unigolyn dan sylw.

Nawr, fel y gŵyr y Gweinidog, o gofio'r ymddiswyddiad heddiw, cynhelir ymchwiliad o dan god gweinidogion Llywodraeth y DU, a bydd yr ymchwiliad hwnnw'n mynd rhagddo nawr, ac rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr â hynny. Ac mae'n bwysig ein bod yn cynnal y safonau uchaf posibl fel gwleidyddion yn ein holl sefydliadau seneddol, gan gynnwys y lle hwn.

Felly, a all y Gweinidog ddweud wrthym beth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i sicrhau bod ei chod gweinidogol ei hun mor effeithiol â phosibl fel y gall y cyhoedd gael hyder ym mhob un o'n sefydliadau seneddol, ac ym mhob un o sefydliadau'r Weithrediaeth, i wneud yn siŵr bod y cod hwnnw mor gadarn â phosibl?

I thank Paul Davies for his comments, and I'm familiar with the statement that he issued earlier today, although I do feel it was perhaps a week late in coming. But I will say that the Welsh Government is constantly reviewing the ministerial code, and when additions need to be made to it, then they are done. So, Ministers are regularly issued with copies of the ministerial code, which we have to completely absorb and ensure that we, at all times, are observing what's set out in the ministerial code.

Diolch i Paul Davies am ei sylwadau, ac rwy'n gyfarwydd â'r datganiad a gyhoeddodd yn gynharach heddiw, er fy mod yn teimlo ei fod wythnos yn hwyr yn dod o bosibl. Ond fe ddywedaf fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn adolygu cod y gweinidogion yn rheolaidd, a phan fydd angen gwneud ychwanegiadau ato, cânt eu gwneud. Felly, mae Gweinidogion yn cael copïau o god y gweinidogion yn rheolaidd, ac mae'n rhaid i ni eu mabwysiadu'n llwyr a sicrhau ein bod, bob amser, yn cydymffurfio â'r hyn sydd wedi'i nodi yng nghod y gweinidogion.

One of the impacts that Alun Cairns departure as Secretary of State could have is sending out a clear and substantive message to women who are considering coming forward to report rape that their trauma through a court appearance may be used to vilify them and that the case could collapse, which is exactly what happened in this case.

At a time when we all know that there is already an extremely very low rate of successful rape trials in the UK and in Wales, I think the damage that this very high-profile case can do to further diminish any prospect of women wanting to put themselves through this is extremely high. I would call on Alun Cairns to do the right thing in this case, because he stood by somebody, and it seems in the full knowledge of what that individual did, and making that woman go through a second trial. If one trial isn't enough, two trials is just beyond belief.

And there's a real danger here—and I urge everyone to be really careful in what they're doing—in identifying this victim, because that is my fear in all of this now, that somehow that could happen. We must make absolutely certain that that doesn't happen. So, doing the right thing in terms of giving up a job that he may or may not have had in a few weeks' time doesn't exactly satisfy me, and I'm sure it won't satisfy all those other women. If he was going to do the right thing, Alun Cairns, for his role in this, he ought to give up his position, because he doesn't, in my opinion, qualify to represent anybody any more in public office. Can you imagine how he's going to handle cases that might come to him about injustice in the future? Can you imagine that any woman in the Vale of Glamorgan, which he represents, would want to go anywhere near him or his party at this time? So, if the Tories—and I believe what Paul Davies said and I accept it absolutely—but if the Tories want to really say that they care, and I'm talking about the Tories in the UK and their head office, about this, then he has to go. That is the only route forward, because, unfortunately, what he's doing is damaging all his colleagues as well.

Un o'r effeithiau y gallai ymddiswyddiad Alun Cairns fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol eu cael yw anfon neges glir a sylweddol at fenywod sy'n ystyried adrodd am drais y gellid defnyddio eu trawma drwy ymddangosiad llys i'w difrïo ac y gallai'r achos fethu, sef yn union yr hyn a ddigwyddodd yn yr achos hwn.

Ar adeg pan fo pob un ohonom yn gwybod bod cyfradd yr achosion trais sy'n llwyddiannus yn eithriadol o isel eisoes yn y DU ac yng Nghymru, credaf fod y niwed y gall yr achos amlwg iawn hwn ei wneud i leihau unrhyw bosibilrwydd y bydd menywod yn dymuno rhoi eu hunain drwy hyn yn fawr iawn. Hoffwn alw ar Alun Cairns i wneud y peth iawn yn yr achos hwn, oherwydd fe gefnogodd rywun gan wybod yn iawn, mae'n ymddangos, am yr hyn a wnaeth yr unigolyn hwnnw, a gwneud i'r fenyw honno ddioddef ail achos. Os nad yw un treial yn ddigon, mae dau achos yn erchyll.

Ac mae perygl gwirioneddol yma—ac rwy'n annog pawb i fod yn ofalus iawn yn yr hyn y maent yn ei wneud—o ddatgelu pwy yw'r dioddefwr, oherwydd dyna yw fy ofn yn hyn i gyd erbyn hyn, y gallai hynny ddigwydd rywsut. Rhaid i ni sicrhau'n bendant na fydd hynny'n digwydd. Felly, nid yw gwneud y peth iawn o ran ildio swydd y gallai fod wedi'i chael neu beidio mewn ychydig wythnosau yn fy modloni'n llwyr, ac rwy'n siŵr na fydd yn bodloni'r holl fenywod eraill hynny. Pe bai am wneud y peth iawn, byddai Alun Cairns, am ei rôl yn hyn, yn rhoi'r gorau i'w sedd, oherwydd yn fy marn i, nid yw'n gymwys i gynrychioli neb bellach mewn swydd gyhoeddus. A allwch chi ddychmygu sut y bydd yn ymdrin ag achosion o anghyfiawnder y gallai eu hwynebu yn y dyfodol? A allwch chi ddychmygu y byddai unrhyw fenyw ym Mro Morgannwg, a gynrychiolir ganddo, am fynd yn agos ato ef neu ei blaid ar hyn o bryd? Felly, os yw'r Torïaid—ac rwy'n credu'r hyn a ddywedodd Paul Davies ac rwy'n ei dderbyn yn llwyr—ond os yw'r Torïaid am ddweud eu bod yn malio mewn gwirionedd, ac rwy'n sôn am y Torïaid yn y DU a'u prif swyddfa, mae'n rhaid iddo fynd. Dyna'r unig ffordd ymlaen, oherwydd, yn anffodus, mae'r hyn y mae'n ei wneud yn niweidio'i holl gydweithwyr yn ogystal.

15:20

I thank Joyce Watson for those comments, and what she says really echoes the words of Christina Rees, of course, who has said that

'Alun Cairns stepping down as secretary of state is far from the end of the matter, and is a shoddy halfway house that will fool nobody.'

And she goes on to say that

'He has still not explained his behaviour and still not addressed the grave issues raised by the leaked emails yesterday.'

And he

'should do the right thing—apologise, and step down as a candidate.'

But I think the most important point that Joyce Watson has raised today is the importance of ensuring that women still have the confidence to come forward and to report things that have happened to them, to ensure that there is support available for those women, and also to ensure that the women involved can always have the confidence that their anonymity will be preserved at all times.

Diolch i Joyce Watson am y sylwadau hynny, ac mae'r hyn a ddywed yn adleisio geiriau Christina Rees, wrth gwrs, a ddywedodd

Nid yw'r ffaith bod Alun Cairns wedi camu i lawr fel Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn ddiwedd ar y mater o bell ffordd, ac mae'n gam hanner ffordd gwael na fydd yn twyllo neb.

Ac mae'n mynd yn ei blaen i ddweud

Nid yw wedi egluro ei ymddygiad o hyd ac nid yw wedi mynd i'r afael â'r materion difrifol a godwyd gan y negeseuon e-bost a ddatgelwyd ddoe.

A

dylai wneud y peth iawn—ymddiheuro, ac ymddiswyddo fel ymgeisydd.

Ond credaf mai'r pwynt pwysicaf a gododd Joyce Watson heddiw yw pwysigrwydd sicrhau bod gan fenywod hyder i adrodd ac i roi gwybod am bethau sydd wedi digwydd iddynt, er mwyn sicrhau bod cymorth ar gael i'r menywod hynny, ac i sicrhau hefyd y gall y menywod dan sylw fod yn hyderus bob amser y perchir eu cyfrinachedd bob amser.

I'm grateful to you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Can I associate myself with remarks made by Leanne Wood and by Joyce Watson in this session of questions? The whole matter, which has been the subject of public debate over the last week, has laid bare some very, very serious issues in terms of not just the behaviour of an individual, but of the role of the Secretary of State. I hope that we and the Welsh Government will be able to pursue matters, not only to protect the place of the victim in this, but also to ensure that, wherever we have the influence to do this—I'm pleased to see the Counsel General's in his place this afternoon—we protect the court system in Wales, to ensure that women do feel able to come forward in these cases.

But this also raises significant issues about the role of the Secretary of State, and I think, for some years, many of us have felt that the role of the Secretary of State is an anachronism in this current United Kingdom. Many of us have felt, and, particularly, I speak from my experience in Government, that there is no purpose to the office of the Wales Office or the office of the Secretary of State any further.

Finance Minister, you may not be aware, but a recent hearing by the external affairs committee spent an hour and a half debating relations between the Governments of the United Kingdom with Michael Gove, just before recess, and in that hour and a half, neither Michael Gove nor any member of that committee mentioned the Wales Office. I think that speaks volumes about how the Wales Office is actually recognised in today's United Kingdom. It is time for us to put in place inter-governmental machinery that ensures that all the Governments of the United Kingdom are able to work together for the benefit of all of us in the United Kingdom, and I hope that if anything comes out of this sorry business, that will at least be one thing that does come out of this, and I hope the Welsh Government can pursue that.

Rwy'n ddiolchgar i chi, Ddirprwy Lywydd. A gaf fi gysylltu fy hun â sylwadau Leanne Wood a Joyce Watson yn y sesiwn gwestiynau hon? Mae'r holl fater, sydd wedi bod yn destun dadl gyhoeddus yn ystod yr wythnos ddiwethaf, wedi datgelu rhai materion difrifol iawn, nid yn unig o ran ymddygiad unigolyn, ond o ran rôl yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol. Rwy'n gobeithio y byddwn ni a Llywodraeth Cymru yn gallu mynd ar drywydd materion, nid yn unig er mwyn diogelu'r dioddefwr yn hyn, ond hefyd i sicrhau, lle bynnag y mae gennym ddylanwad i wneud hyn—rwy'n falch o weld bod y Cwnsler Cyffredinol yn ei sedd y prynhawn yma—ein bod yn diogelu'r system llysoedd yng Nghymru, er mwyn sicrhau bod menywod yn teimlo y gallant roi gwybod am yr achosion hyn.

Ond mae hyn hefyd yn codi materion arwyddocaol ynglŷn â rôl yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol, ac rwy'n credu, ers rhai blynyddoedd, fod llawer ohonom wedi teimlo bod rôl yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn anacroniaeth yn y Deyrnas Unedig fel y mae. Mae llawer ohonom wedi teimlo, ac yn benodol, rwy'n siarad o fy mhrofiad i mewn Llywodraeth, nad oes diben i Swyddfa Cymru na swydd yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol mwyach.

Weinidog Cyllid, efallai nad ydych yn ymwybodol o hyn, ond treuliodd gwrandawiad yn ddiweddar gan y pwyllgor materion allanol awr a hanner yn trafod y berthynas rhwng Llywodraethau'r Deyrnas Unedig gyda Michael Gove ychydig cyn y toriad, ac yn yr awr a hanner honno, ni soniodd Michael Gove nac unrhyw aelod o'r pwyllgor hwnnw am Swyddfa Cymru. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n dweud cyfrolau am y modd y mae Swyddfa Cymru yn cael ei chydnabod yn y Deyrnas Unedig heddiw. Mae'n bryd inni sefydlu peirianwaith rhynglywodraethol sy'n sicrhau y gall holl Lywodraethau'r Deyrnas Unedig weithio gyda'i gilydd er lles pob un ohonom yn y Deyrnas Unedig, ac rwy'n gobeithio, os daw unrhyw beth o'r busnes truenus hwn, y bydd hynny'n un peth, o leiaf, i ddod o hyn, ac rwy'n gobeithio y gall Llywodraeth Cymru fynd ar drywydd hynny.

Thank you to Alun Davies for raising that particular issue, and, of course, the First Minister recently set out his vision, if you like, for inter-governmental relationships amongst the constituent nations of the UK. I think it is really important that that system of relationships is underpinned by the machinery that will best suit our ambitions for the way in which we will relate to other parts of the UK.

Diolch i Alun Davies am godi'r mater penodol hwnnw, ac wrth gwrs, yn ddiweddar mae Prif Weinidog Cymru wedi nodi ei weledigaeth, os mynnwch, ar gyfer y berthynas rynglywodraethol rhwng gwledydd cyfansoddol y DU. Rwy'n credu ei bod yn bwysig iawn fod y system honno o gysylltiadau'n seiliedig ar y peirianwaith a fydd yn gweddu orau i'n huchelgeisiau ar gyfer y ffordd y byddwn yn ymwneud â rhannau eraill o'r DU.

6. Datganiadau 90 Eiliad
6. 90-second Statements

Item 6 on the agenda is the 90-second statements. The first this afternoon is from Vikki Howells.

Eitem 6 ar yr agenda yw'r datganiadau 90 eiliad. Daw'r cyntaf y prynhawn yma gan Vikki Howells.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. This is a 90-second statement about an ordinary teddy bear—an ordinary teddy bear thrown away, brought to life by a spotty man and given special powers by mother nature. Yes, this is a 90-second statement about SuperTed. SuperTed, the very first commission from S4C, first appeared on Welsh tv on 1 November 1982, so this month marks his thirty-seventh anniversary. An English language cartoon featuring the anthropomorphic action hero was broadcast the following year, which, from 4 October 1984, aired to the whole of the UK.

This terrific teddy was charged with taking the S4C logo worldwide. Indeed, the series was sold to over 70 countries. He was the first outside production ever bought by the Walt Disney Company, his heroics distributed on video and broadcast to the then brand-new Disney Channel.

SuperTed was the true Welsh tv star of the 1980s. The brave bear was the creation of Welsh writer and animator Mike Young. Famously, the charismatic character was created by Mike to help his son overcome his fear of darkness. Over 100 SuperTed books were published, which sold over 200,000 copies in the UK alone. He starred in educational programming. Who remembers Super Safe with SuperTed, the road-safety animation set in Cardiff? SuperTed appeared on stage, on children's vitamins, and he was even the first shirt sponsor for Cardiff City Football Club. What a legacy. Pen-blwydd hapus.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Mae hwn yn ddatganiad 90 eiliad am dedi cyffredin—tedi cyffredin a gafodd ei daflu, ei wneud yn fyw gan ddyn smotiog ac a gafodd bwerau arbennig gan fam natur. Ie, dyma ddatganiad 90 eiliad am SuperTed. Ymddangosodd SuperTed, y comisiwn cyntaf un gan S4C, ar deledu Cymraeg am y tro cyntaf ar 1 Tachwedd 1982, felly mae'r mis hwn yn nodi ei ben blwydd yn 37 oed. Darlledwyd cartŵn Saesneg yn adrodd stori'r arwr anthropomorffig y flwyddyn ganlynol, a chafodd ei ddarlledu, o 4 Hydref 1984 ymlaen i'r DU gyfan.

Roedd y tedi bendigedig hwn yn gyfrifol am ledaenu logo S4C drwy'r byd. Yn wir, gwerthwyd y gyfres i dros 70 o wledydd. Ef oedd y cynhyrchiad allanol cyntaf erioed a brynwyd gan Walt Disney Company, ac fe gafodd ei orchestion eu lledaenu ar fideo a'u darlledu ar Disney Channel a oedd yn newydd sbon ar y pryd.

SuperTed oedd gwir seren deledu Cymru'r 1980au. Crëwyd yr arth ddewr gan yr awdur a'r animeiddiwr Cymreig, Mike Young. Mae'n wybyddus i Mike greu'r cymeriad carismatig i helpu ei fab i oresgyn ei ofn o'r tywyllwch. Cyhoeddwyd dros 100 o lyfrau SuperTed, a werthodd dros 200,000 o gopïau yn y DU yn unig. Serennodd mewn rhaglenni addysgol. Pwy sy'n cofio Super Safe with SuperTed, y set animeiddio diogelwch ffyrdd yng Nghaerdydd? Ymddangosodd SuperTed ar y llwyfan, ar fitaminau i blant, ac ef oedd noddwr cyntaf crysau Clwb Pêl-Droed Dinas Caerdydd hyd yn oed. Am waddol. Pen-blwydd hapus.

15:25

I have to beat that. [Laughter.] Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. How do you beat that?

This week marks another anniversary—the seventieth anniversary of my home town, the designation of Cwmbran as a new town, the first and only mark one new town to be built in Wales under the New Towns Act 1946.

Growing up in the 1980s in the Llanyrafon area of the town, on the western edge of the Monmouth constituency, I was very aware that the place I called home was somehow different and became fascinated by the vision of a brighter future that had inspired the postwar urban planners. That vision had itself grown out the ideas of Ebenezer Howard, the founder of the Victorian garden city movement and author of To-morrow: a Peaceful Path to Real Reform. It espoused new communities, benefiting from clean air, open space and good-quality housing, all in short supply in postwar Britain.

In Cwmbran, it also included the innovation of a fully pedestrianised town centre, with free parking, which would eventually, upon the winding up of Cwmbran Development Corporation, become the first privately owned town centre in the UK. Originally envisaged as a community of 35,000 people, Cwmbran has actually grown to nearer 50,000 people. As a result of this expansion, there are now many more people who have made the new town their home.

It has been 70 years since the then Minister of Town and Country Planning, Lewis Silkin, said to the chair of the committee of the Cabinet, Herbert Morrison:

'I think we can build a very good new town here'.

Many would say that history has proved him right. Happy birthday, Cwmbran.

Mae'n rhaid i mi guro hynny. [Chwerthin.] Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Sut y mae rhywun yn curo hynny?

Mae'r wythnos hon yn nodi pen-blwydd arall—sef pen-blwydd fy nhref enedigol yn 70 oed, dynodiad Cwmbrân yn dref newydd, y dref gyntaf a'r unig dref newydd, ar wahân i un, i gael ei hadeiladu yng Nghymru o dan Ddeddf Trefi Newydd 1946.

Wrth dyfu i fyny yn y 1980au yn ardal Llanyrafon o'r dref, ar gyrion gorllewinol etholaeth Trefynwy, roeddwn yn ymwybodol iawn fod y lle roeddwn yn ei alw'n gartref rywsut yn wahanol ac fe'm swynwyd gan y weledigaeth o ddyfodol mwy disglair a ysbrydolodd y cynllunwyr trefol ar ôl y rhyfel. Roedd y weledigaeth honno wedi tyfu o syniadau Ebenezer Howard, sylfaenydd mudiad y gardd-ddinasoedd Fictoraidd ac awdur To-morrow: a Peaceful Path to Real Reform. Roedd yn cefnogi creu cymunedau newydd i elwa ar aer glân, mannau agored a thai o ansawdd da, pethau prin ym Mhrydain ar ôl y rhyfel.

Yng Nghwmbrân, roedd hefyd yn cynnwys gwaith arloesol i bedestreiddio canol y dref yn llwyr, gyda pharcio am ddim, ac yn y pen draw, ar ôl i Gorfforaeth Datblygu Cwmbrân ddod i ben, daeth yn ganol tref cyntaf y DU i fod mewn dwylo preifat. Fe'i rhagwelwyd yn wreiddiol fel cymuned o 35,000 o bobl, ond mae Cwmbrân wedi tyfu i fod yn agosach at 50,000 o bobl mewn gwirionedd. O ganlyniad i'r ehangu hwn, mae llawer mwy o bobl bellach wedi gwneud y dref newydd yn gartref iddynt.

Mae 70 o flynyddoedd wedi bod ers i'r Gweinidog Cynllunio Gwlad a Thref ar y pryd, Lewis Silkin, ddweud wrth gadeirydd pwyllgor y Cabinet, Herbert Morrison:

Rwy'n credu y gallwn adeiladu tref newydd dda iawn yma.

Byddai llawer yn dweud bod hanes wedi'i brofi'n gywir. Pen-blwydd hapus, Cwmbrân.

7. Cynnig i amrywio trefn ystyried gwelliannau Cyfnod 3 y Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru)
7. Motion to vary the order of consideration for amendments at Stage 3 of the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill

Item 7 on our agenda is a motion to vary the order of consideration for amendments at Stage 3 of the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill. Can I call on a Member of the Business Committee to move the motion? Darren.

Eitem 7 ar ein hagenda yw cynnig i amrywio trefn ystyried gwelliannau Cyfnod 3 y Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru). A gaf fi alw ar Aelod o'r Pwyllgor Busnes i wneud y cynnig? Darren.

Cynnig NDM7175 Elin Jones

Cynnig bod Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru, yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 26.36:

Yn cytuno i waredu’r adrannau a’r Atodlenni i’r Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru) yng Nghyfnod 3 yn y drefn ganlynol:

a) adrannau 2 i 9,

b) Atodlen 1,

c) adrannau 10 i 28,

d) Atodlen 2,

e) adran 29,

f) Atodlen 3,

g) adrannau 30 i 41,

h) adran 1,

i) Teitl hir.

Motion NDM7175 Elin Jones

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales, in accordance with Standing Order 26.36:

Agrees to dispose of sections and Schedules to the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill at Stage 3 in the following order:

a) sections 2 to 9,

b) Schedule 1,

c) sections 10 to 28,

d) Schedule 2,

e) section 29,

f) Schedule 3,

g) sections 30 to 41,

h) section 1,

i) Long title.

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Thank you very much. I have no speakers. Therefore, the proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. Nid oes gennyf unrhyw siaradwyr. Felly, y cynnig yw derbyn y cynnig. A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Na. Felly, derbynnir y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.

Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

8. Dadl ar Adroddiad y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon: Hepatitis C: Cynnydd tuag at ei ddileu yng Nghymru
8. Debate on the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee Report: Hepatitis C: Progress towards achieving elimination in Wales

Item 8 on our agenda this afternoon is a debate on the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee Report: 'Hepatitis C: Progress towards achieving elimination in Wales'. And I call on Helen Mary Jones to move the motion on behalf of the committee. Helen Mary.

Eitem 8 ar ein hagenda y prynhawn yma yw dadl ar adroddiad y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon: 'Hepatitis C: Cynnydd tuag at ei ddileu yng Nghymru'. A galwaf ar Helen Mary Jones i gyflwyno'r cynnig ar ran y pwyllgor. Helen Mary.

Cynnig NDM7174 Dai Lloyd

Cynnig bod Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru:

Yn nodi adroddiad y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon ar Hepatitis C: Cynnydd tuag at ei ddileu yng Nghymru, a osodwyd yn y Swyddfa Gyflwyno ar 27 Mehefin 2019.

Motion NDM7174 Dai Lloyd

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales:

Notes the report of the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee:  Hepatitis C: Progress towards achieving elimination in Wales, which was laid in the Table Office on 27 June 2019.

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd. Thank you very much indeed, Deputy Presiding Officer. I stand here, of course, in place of our much-beloved colleague, Dr Dai Lloyd, who is currently not very well. I certainly can't hope to imitate his inimitable style. I'm sure that all Members in this Chamber will join me in wishing Dai a swift and speedy recovery, and all I can do is attempt to fill his shoes on behalf of the committee, knowing, of course, that this is completely beyond me.

I'm very pleased to take part in this debate today, on behalf of the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee, on our report on the progress towards achieving the elimination of hepatitis C in Wales. This is the third of a series of short, focused spotlight inquiries that have been undertaken by the committee, and we're all very grateful to all of those who gave evidence and, as always, to the excellent team that supports our committee's work.

The committee agreed to undertake this one-day inquiry to investigate the work currently being undertaken to eliminate hepatitis C in Wales by the target date of 2030. The World Health Organization estimates that 71 million people in the world have chronic hepatitis C infections, and of the 21,000 who live in the UK, 12,000 to 14,000 live in Wales. That's a great number of our fellow citizens affected by this condition.

We know, of course, that hepatitis C affects disadvantaged and marginalised communities, including homeless people and migrant communities particularly, with almost half of the people who attend hospital with this virus coming from the poorest fifth of society.

Diolch yn fawr, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Diolch yn fawr iawn, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Rwy'n sefyll yma, wrth gwrs, yn lle ein cyd-Aelod annwyl, Dr Dai Lloyd, oherwydd nid yw'n dda iawn ar hyn o bryd. Yn sicr, ni allaf obeithio dynwared ei arddull unigryw. Rwy'n siŵr y bydd yr holl Aelodau yn y Siambr hon yn ymuno â mi i ddymuno gwellhad buan a chyflym i Dai, a'r cyfan y gallaf ei wneud yw ceisio llenwi ei esgidiau ar ran y pwyllgor, gan wybod, wrth gwrs, fod hyn y tu hwnt i mi yn llwyr.

Rwy'n falch iawn o gymryd rhan yn y ddadl hon heddiw ar ran y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon, ar ein hadroddiad ar y cynnydd a wnaed tuag at ddileu hepatitis C yng Nghymru. Dyma'r drydedd mewn cyfres o ymchwiliadau sbotolau byr a phenodol a gynhaliwyd gan y pwyllgor, ac rydym i gyd yn ddiolchgar iawn i bawb a roddodd dystiolaeth ac fel bob amser, i'r tîm rhagorol sy'n cefnogi gwaith ein pwyllgor.

Cytunodd y pwyllgor i gynnal yr ymchwiliad undydd hwn i ymchwilio i'r gwaith sy'n cael ei wneud ar hyn o bryd i ddileu hepatitis C yng Nghymru erbyn y dyddiad targed, sef 2030. Mae Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd yn amcangyfrif bod gan 71 miliwn o bobl yn y byd heintiau hepatitis C cronig, ac o'r 21,000 sy'n byw yn y DU, mae 12,000 i 14,000 yn byw yng Nghymru. Felly mae'r cyflwr hwn yn effeithio ar nifer fawr o'n cyd-ddinasyddion.

Rydym yn gwybod, wrth gwrs, fod hepatitis C yn effeithio ar gymunedau difreintiedig ac ymylol, gan gynnwys pobl ddigartref a chymunedau mudol yn enwedig, gyda bron i hanner y bobl sy'n mynd i'r ysbyty gyda'r feirws yn dod o'r bumed ran dlotaf o'r gymdeithas.

Key things emerged in our inquiry. We know, of course, that Wales is signed up to the World Health Organization's global health sector strategy, which aims to eliminate hepatitis C by 2030. One of the tragedies, of course, of the large number of people living with this condition is that it is now completely curable. Whilst this is welcome—the signing up is welcome—a number of witnesses to our inquiry expressed concerns about whether we will meet those targets. The committee heard that not all local health boards are meeting the targets, and that both diagnosis and treatment rates will have to increase significantly in Wales if we are to achieve the 2030 target. We heard anecdotal evidence of local health board finance directors discouraging hepatology teams from exceeding the treatment targets because of financial concerns. This approach will only result in greater financial cost in the long run, and is not compatible with Wales achieving the elimination target. It is vital that caps are not placed on local treatment targets by health boards. National treatment targets should be seen as a basic minimum floor, which health boards should be aiming to exceed. 

The message from witnesses is clear—that knowledge and awareness of hepatitis C amongst the public remains low, reflected in roughly 50 per cent of patients being undiagnosed. A UK-wide poll commissioned by the Hepatitis C Trust highlighted that, of the 80 per cent who were aware of hepatitis C, less than 40 per cent knew that it affects the liver, and less than 30 per cent knew that the virus is now curable.

The committee heard that outdated information is still prevalent amongst at-risk groups, and, as such, some patients are fearful about coming forward to access healthcare, because of the difficult nature of the previous treatments. Increasing public awareness and knowledge of the virus through the development of a Government-backed awareness campaign, targeted to specialist at-risk groups, may help to reduce the effects on those who are affected by the virus. Public Health Wales told the committee that, since the Welsh Government introduced a formal policy of opt-out testing for blood-borne viruses for all those on admission to prison in 2016, the uptake of testing has increased from 8 per cent to 34 per cent. This is encouraging, and it has been a big improvement, and, in time, hopefully, Public Health Wales will reach the target of 100 per cent. However, witnesses highlighted a lack of resources for testing in prisons, and stated that, in order to make prisons HCV-free, additional resourcing and staffing is required. Recruitment and retention were also issues that were highlighted by witnesses, with some stating that lack of staff was preventing prisoners from being tested promptly.

Knowledge and awareness amongst some health professionals is an ongoing issue that must be addressed. The committee heard that patients reported less positive experiences with health professionals, such as GP and non-specialist nurses, with many saying that they had not, in fact, been offered tests. Others stated that they'd encountered low levels of knowledge of the virus from health professionals, often being given inaccurate or outdated information and advice. The Hepatitis C Trust recognises that initiatives that have been introduced to provide educational support to healthcare professionals are valuable, but says that more needs to be done. Witnesses called for protected learning time for such health professionals, and for more awareness raising. We heard that such training does not need to be time-consuming and much of it can be delivered online.

The message from witnesses was that Wales has an excellent opportunity to become the first country in the UK to eliminate this disease. However, without urgent additional action to address the uncertainty relating to the strategy and funding post 2021, the fear is that the opportunity may be lost.

So, these were our four recommendations—that the Welsh Government should produce a comprehensive, national elimination strategy for hepatitis C, with clear and ambitious targets and workforce planning built in, and provide substantial funding until the elimination is achieved. This must be done as a matter of urgency, given that the current plan ends this year, and funding for dedicated posts is only available until 2021.

Our second recommendation is that the strategy must include a targeted awareness-raising campaign to reach out to at-risk communities, and to provide additional education and training for health professionals. The Welsh Government, for our third recommendation, must write to local health board finance directors and chief executives to emphasise that the national targets for treatment for hepatitis C must be considered as a minimum and be exceeded where possible. And the Welsh Government, for our fourth recommendation, should provide additional investment to improve hepatitis testing in prisons.

We are somewhat disappointed that the Welsh Government has only chosen to fully accept one of these recommendations. We're grateful that the other recommendations have been accepted in principle. But, in fact, the Government has only agreed to write to the finance directors and the chief executives, and their response says that there are other ways to address the issues that our report raises. I will be interested to hear what the Minister has to say today, but I would urge him to look once again at our recommendations, which are strongly evidence based, and the need for a strong central lead on this is vital.

Daeth pethau allweddol i'r amlwg yn ein hymchwiliad. Gwyddom, wrth gwrs, fod Cymru wedi ymrwymo i strategaeth sector iechyd byd-eang Sefydliad Iechyd y byd, sy'n anelu at ddileu hepatitis C erbyn 2030. Un o'r trasiedïau, wrth gwrs, o ystyried y nifer fawr o bobl sy'n byw gyda'r cyflwr hwn, yw fod modd ei wella'n llwyr bellach. Er bod hyn i'w groesawu—mae'r ymrwymiad i'w groesawu—mynegodd nifer o dystion i'n hymchwiliad bryderon ynglŷn ag a fyddwn yn cyrraedd y targedau hynny. Clywodd y pwyllgor nad yw pob bwrdd iechyd lleol yn cyrraedd y targedau, ac y bydd yn rhaid i gyfraddau diagnosis a thriniaeth gynyddu'n sylweddol yng Nghymru os ydym am gyrraedd y targed 2030. Clywsom dystiolaeth anecdotaidd fod cyfarwyddwyr cyllid byrddau iechyd lleol yn atal timau hepatoleg rhag rhagori ar y targedau triniaeth oherwydd pryderon ariannol. Ni fydd y dull hwn o weithredu ond yn arwain at fwy o gost ariannol yn y tymor hir, ac nid yw'n gydnaws â sicrhau bod Cymru'n cyrraedd y targed dileu. Mae'n hanfodol nad yw byrddau iechyd yn gosod capiau ar dargedau triniaeth lleol. Dylid ystyried targedau triniaeth cenedlaethol fel lleiafswm sylfaenol, a dylai byrddau iechyd anelu at ragori arno.  

Mae'r neges gan y tystion yn glir—fod gwybodaeth ac ymwybyddiaeth o hepatitis C ymhlith y cyhoedd yn parhau i fod yn isel, ac adlewyrchir hynny yn y ffaith bod tua 50 y cant o gleifion heb gael diagnosis. Mewn arolwg DU gyfan a gomisiynwyd gan yr Ymddiriedolaeth Hepatitis C, nodwyd bod llai na 40 y cant o'r 80 y cant a oedd yn ymwybodol o hepatitis C yn gwybod ei fod yn effeithio ar yr afu, a bod llai na 30 y cant yn gwybod bod modd gwella'r feirws bellach.

Clywodd y pwyllgor fod gwybodaeth sydd wedi dyddio yn amlwg o hyd ymhlith grwpiau sydd mewn perygl, ac o'r herwydd, mae rhai cleifion yn ofnus ynglŷn â gofyn am ofal iechyd, oherwydd natur anodd y triniaethau blaenorol. Gall cynyddu ymwybyddiaeth a gwybodaeth y cyhoedd am y feirws drwy ddatblygu ymgyrch ymwybyddiaeth wedi'i chefnogi gan y Llywodraeth, ac wedi'i thargedu at grwpiau penodol sydd mewn perygl, helpu i leihau'r effeithiau ar y rhai yr effeithiwyd arnynt gan y feirws. Dywedodd Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru wrth y pwyllgor, ers i Lywodraeth Cymru gyflwyno polisi ffurfiol o gynnig prawf optio allan ar gyfer feirysau a gludir yn y gwaed i bawb sy'n cael eu derbyn i'r carchar yn 2016, fod y nifer sy'n cael eu profi wedi cynyddu o 8 y cant i 34 y cant. Mae hyn yn galonogol, ac mae wedi bod yn welliant mawr, ac ymhen amser, gobeithio, bydd Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru yn cyrraedd y targed o 100 y cant. Fodd bynnag, tynnodd y tystion sylw at ddiffyg adnoddau ar gyfer cynnal profion mewn carchardai, ac er mwyn cael gwared ar feirws hepatitis C mewn carchardai, roeddent yn dweud bod angen adnoddau a staff ychwanegol. Roedd recriwtio a chadw staff hefyd yn faterion a gafodd sylw gan dystion, gyda rhai'n nodi bod diffyg staff yn atal carcharorion rhag cael profion prydlon.

Mae gwybodaeth ac ymwybyddiaeth ymhlith rhai gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol yn broblem barhaus sy'n rhaid ei datrys. Clywodd y pwyllgor fod cleifion yn cael profiadau llai cadarnhaol gyda gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol, megis meddygon teulu a nyrsys anarbenigol, gyda llawer yn dweud nad oeddent wedi cael cynnig profion mewn gwirionedd. Dywedodd eraill eu bod wedi dod ar draws lefelau isel o wybodaeth am y feirws gan weithwyr iechyd proffesiynol, a'u bod yn aml yn cael gwybodaeth a chyngor a oedd yn wallus neu wedi dyddio. Mae Ymddiriedolaeth Hepatitis C yn cydnabod bod mentrau a gyflwynwyd i ddarparu cymorth addysgol i weithwyr gofal iechyd proffesiynol yn werthfawr, ond mae'n dweud bod angen gwneud rhagor. Galwodd tystion am amser dysgu wedi'i ddiogelu ar gyfer gweithwyr iechyd proffesiynol o'r fath, ac am fwy o godi ymwybyddiaeth. Clywsom nad oes angen i hyfforddiant o'r fath gymryd llawer o amser a bod modd cyflwyno llawer ohono ar-lein.

Y neges gan dystion oedd fod gan Gymru gyfle gwych i ddod yn wlad gyntaf y DU i gael gwared ar y clefyd hwn. Fodd bynnag, heb gamau ychwanegol ar frys i fynd i'r afael â'r ansicrwydd sy'n ymwneud â'r strategaeth a chyllido ar ôl 2021, ofnir y gallai'r cyfle gael ei golli.

Felly, dyma oedd ein pedwar argymhelliad—y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru greu strategaeth ddileu genedlaethol, gynhwysfawr ar gyfer hepatitis C, yn cynnwys targedau uchelgeisiol clir a chynllunio ar gyfer y gweithlu, a dylai ddarparu cyllid sylweddol hyd nes y caiff yr haint ei ddileu. Rhaid gwneud hyn yn ddiymdroi, o gofio y bydd y cynllun presennol yn dod i ben eleni, ac mai dim ond tan 2021 y mae cyllid wedi’i gadarnhau ar gyfer swyddi penodol. 

Ein hail argymhelliad yw fod yn rhaid i’r strategaeth gynnwys ymgyrch codi ymwybyddiaeth wedi’i thargedu er mwyn cyrraedd cymunedau sy’n wynebu risg, ynghyd â darparu addysg a hyfforddiant ychwanegol i weithwyr iechyd proffesiynol. Ein trydydd argymhelliad yw fod yn rhaid i Lywodraeth Cymru ysgrifennu at gyfarwyddwyr cyllid a phrif weithredwyr y byrddau iechyd lleol i bwysleisio bod yn rhaid ystyried y targedau triniaeth cenedlaethol ar gyfer hepatitis C fel y targedau mwyaf sylfaenol, gyda’r nod o ragori arnynt lle bynnag y bo modd. Ein pedwerydd argymhelliad yw y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru wneud buddsoddiad ychwanegol er mwyn gwella’r profion am hepatitis C mewn carchardai yng Nghymru.

Rydym braidd yn siomedig mai dim ond un o'r argymhellion hyn y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dewis ei dderbyn yn llawn. Rydym yn ddiolchgar fod yr argymhellion eraill wedi'u derbyn mewn egwyddor. Ond mewn gwirionedd, nid yw'r Llywodraeth ond wedi cytuno i ysgrifennu at y cyfarwyddwyr cyllid a'r prif weithredwyr, ac mae eu hymateb yn dweud bod ffyrdd eraill o fynd i'r afael â'r materion y mae ein hadroddiad yn tynnu sylw atynt. Rwy'n awyddus i glywed yr hyn sydd gan y Gweinidog i'w ddweud heddiw, ond buaswn yn ei annog i edrych unwaith eto ar ein hargymhellion, sy'n seiliedig ar dystiolaeth gref, ac mae'r angen am arweiniad canolog cryf ar hyn yn hanfodol.

15:35

In many ways, the hepatitis C story in Wales is incredibly optimistic. We have a disease before us, or a condition before us, that is almost entirely curable, and we are within striking distance—if we apply ourselves—to being able to wipe this out. And I think that any illness or condition that we can wipe out—polio being one of them—is something that we should all celebrate, and we can do this with hep C if we all bend our minds to the task. And, Minister, I absolutely recognise that there have been some amazing strides forward in trying to eradicate hep C, or reverse hep C, in individuals. I think there have been some good strides forward in tackling certain members of our population, certain target groups, certain ethnic groups, where there's a prevalence. There have been strides forward in reducing people who use drugs and in their contamination with hepatitis C. But, of course, it's one of those things where, as you bash down one dragon's head, up comes another.

And I found one of the very interesting things that came forward from this report is how we are beginning to see more instances of people developing hepatitis C from some of the more modern things today, like having Botox fillers, about going to sports clubs and having steroid injections. And so, Minister, what I'd like to do is ask you a couple of questions first of all around what else you're going to put in place in terms of things like syringe programmes, steroid clinics. There are 270 needle and syringe programmes throughout Wales—do we need more, how will we fund it? What about the idea of having steroid clinics, so that people can understand that there's no stigma to being able to go forward and to get that treatment? Because, of course, like all these things, it's about taking away the stigma. So, very, very positive news, but we had to do this report because it is only a job half done. And I was very concerned to see that, in this report, some of our recommendations were just to be accepted in principle. And I've kind of come to the conclusion, after my years here as an Assembly Member, that, when a Government says 'accept in principle', it is always a euphemism for kicking something out to the long grass. So, I'd just like to go through some of these 'accept in principle' comments that you have.

Now, Helen Mary has already talked about recommendation 3, which you've accepted totally, which was the one about accepting the World Health Organization 2030 target. I would like to understand why you haven't followed the Scottish one of 2024, or the UK one of 2025. I just find it very interesting—we're a small country, we can get to people quickly, and I'd like to understand your reasons here. I would like to understand how the health boards will actually deliver the hep C treatment targets that are due to be introduced in April. Can we add these targets to the NHS activity and performance summary dashboard, as a way of formally monitoring progress towards elimination? You spoke in a previous set of questions about the need to have robust data, and how you felt that data was good, and I agree with you—I think that data helps us to drive our public health policy. Are we able to add that to the dashboard? Will you commit to the production of a new Welsh health circular?

I'd also like to talk about recommendation 2, and the targeted awareness-raising campaign. Now, I know from slightly bitter experience that the Government is actually quite reluctant to undertake targeted awareness raising campaigns—I've talked to you in the past about sepsis—because you feel that national campaigns sometimes do not achieve their aims. But we've hit this barrier before, and I'd like to really understand why you will not go forward with a targeted awareness-raising campaign. It's been recommended by all the players in this area—the people who go out there and actually have to deliver these services on the ground, they believe that this is a good way forward, the committee believe it's a good way forward, professionals believe it's a good way forward, but the Welsh Government doesn't. I need to really understand and would appreciate an explanation on that. 

Additional investment into prisons—now, Helen Mary has already touched upon it, but we've done quite a number of reports recently about care for prisoners, about reintegrating people into the community, about ensuring that we have minimal reoffending rates. Letting someone come out of prison feeling in good health, with a good future, a roof over their head, and a pathway forward is one of the key ways of stopping reoffending. And I simply would like to ask you to revisit your investment in prisons, because we need to get prisoner health up so that when they leave those prisons they have a better chance of staying out and a lesser chance of recidivism. Thank you.

Mewn sawl ffordd, mae stori hepatitis C yng Nghymru yn hynod optimistaidd. Mae gennym glefyd o'n blaenau, neu gyflwr o'n blaenau, sydd bron yn gwbl welladwy, ac rydym o fewn cyrraedd—os ymrown i hyn—i allu ei ddileu. A chredaf fod unrhyw salwch neu gyflwr y gallwn ei ddileu—mae polio yn un ohonynt—yn rhywbeth y dylai pawb ohonom ei ddathlu, a gallwn wneud hyn gyda hep C os bydd pob un ohonom yn ymroi i'r dasg. Weinidog, rwy'n cydnabod yn llwyr fod camau breision wedi'u cymryd i geisio dileu hep C, neu wrthdroi hep C, mewn unigolion. Rwy'n credu bod camau da wedi'u cymryd i fynd i'r afael â rhai aelodau o'n poblogaeth, grwpiau targed penodol, grwpiau ethnig penodol, lle ceir nifer uwch o achosion. Mae camau breision wedi'u cymryd i leihau nifer y bobl sy'n defnyddio cyffuriau ac yn cael eu heintio â hepatitis C. Ond wrth gwrs, mae'n un o'r pethau hynny lle, wrth i chi dorri pen un ddraig, mae draig arall yn codi.

Un peth diddorol iawn sydd wedi deillio o'r adroddiad hwn yw sut rydym yn dechrau gweld mwy o achosion o bobl yn datblygu hepatitis C o ganlyniad i bethau mwy modern heddiw, fel llenwyr Botox, mynd i glybiau chwaraeon i gael pigiadau steroid. Ac felly, Weinidog, yr hyn yr hoffwn ei wneud yw gofyn cwestiwn neu ddau i chi yn gyntaf ynglŷn â beth arall y bwriadwch ei roi ar waith o ran pethau fel rhaglenni chwistrellau, clinigau steroid. Mae 270 o raglenni nodwyddau a chwistrellau ledled Cymru—a oes angen mwy, sut y byddwn yn eu hariannu? Beth am y syniad o gael clinigau steroid, er mwyn i bobl allu deall nad oes stigma i allu mynd i gael y driniaeth honno? Oherwydd, wrth gwrs, fel yr holl bethau hyn, mae'n ymwneud â dileu'r stigma. Felly mae hwnnw'n newyddion cadarnhaol iawn, ond roedd yn rhaid inni wneud yr adroddiad hwn oherwydd mai hanner y gwaith yn unig sydd wedi'i wneud. Ac roeddwn yn bryderus iawn i weld, yn yr adroddiad hwn, mai mewn egwyddor yn unig y cafodd rhai o'n hargymhellion eu derbyn. Ac rwyf wedi dod i'r casgliad, ar ôl treulio blynyddoedd yma fel Aelod Cynulliad, pan fo Llywodraeth yn dweud 'derbyn mewn egwyddor', mai ffordd arall o ddweud eu bod am wthio rhywbeth i'r naill ochr ydyw. Felly, hoffwn grybwyll rhai o'r sylwadau sydd gennych ynglŷn â 'derbyn mewn egwyddor'.

Nawr, mae Helen Mary eisoes wedi sôn am argymhelliad 3 a dderbyniwyd yn llwyr gennych, sef yr un am dderbyn targed Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd ar gyfer 2030. Hoffwn ddeall pam nad ydych wedi dilyn targed yr Alban, sef 2024, neu darged y DU, sef 2025. Mae'n ddiddorol iawn i mi—mae Cymru'n wlad fach, gallwn gyrraedd pobl yn gyflym, a hoffwn ddeall eich rhesymau yma. Hoffwn ddeall sut y bydd y byrddau iechyd yn cyflawni'r targedau triniaeth hep C y disgwylir iddynt gael eu cyflwyno ym mis Ebrill. A allwn ni ychwanegu'r targedau hyn at ddangosfwrdd cryno'r GIG ar gyfer gweithgaredd a pherfformiad fel ffordd o fonitro'r cynnydd tuag at ddileu hepatitis c yn ffurfiol? Fe sonioch chi mewn cyfres flaenorol o gwestiynau am yr angen i gael data cadarn, a sut y teimlech fod data'n dda, ac rwy'n cytuno â chi—credaf fod data'n ein helpu i yrru ein polisi iechyd cyhoeddus. A allwn ychwanegu hwnnw at y dangosfwrdd? A wnewch chi ymrwymo i gynhyrchu cylchlythyr iechyd newydd i Gymru?

Hoffwn siarad am argymhelliad 2 hefyd, a'r ymgyrch codi ymwybyddiaeth wedi'i thargedu. Nawr, rwy'n gwybod o brofiad ychydig yn chwerw fod y Llywodraeth yn eithaf amharod i gynnal ymgyrchoedd codi ymwybyddiaeth wedi'u targedu mewn gwirionedd—rwyf wedi siarad â chi yn y gorffennol am sepsis—oherwydd eich bod yn teimlo weithiau nad yw ymgyrchoedd cenedlaethol yn cyflawni eu nodau. Ond rydym wedi wynebu'r rhwystr hwn o'r blaen, a hoffwn ddeall yn iawn pam na fyddwch yn bwrw ymlaen ag ymgyrch codi ymwybyddiaeth wedi'i thargedu. Mae wedi cael ei argymell gan bawb sy'n rhan o'r maes hwn—y bobl sy'n gorfod darparu'r gwasanaethau hyn ar lawr gwlad, maent yn credu bod hon yn ffordd dda ymlaen, mae'r pwyllgor yn credu ei bod yn ffordd dda ymlaen, mae gweithwyr proffesiynol yn credu ei bod yn ffordd dda ymlaen, ond nid yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn credu hynny. Mae angen imi ddeall hyn yn iawn a buaswn yn gwerthfawrogi esboniad ar hynny.  

O ran buddsoddiad ychwanegol mewn carchardai—nawr, mae Helen Mary eisoes wedi crybwyll hyn, ond rydym wedi gwneud cryn dipyn o adroddiadau yn ddiweddar am ofal i garcharorion, am ailintegreiddio pobl i'r gymuned, am sicrhau bod gennym gyfraddau aildroseddu isel. Gadael i rywun ddod allan o'r carchar yn teimlo'n iach, gyda dyfodol da, to dros eu pennau, a llwybr ymlaen yw un o'r ffyrdd allweddol o atal aildroseddu. Ac yn syml, hoffwn ofyn ichi ailystyried eich buddsoddiad mewn carchardai, oherwydd mae angen inni wella iechyd carcharorion fel bod gwell gobaith, pan fyddant yn gadael y carchar, y byddant yn aros allan, a llai o berygl y byddant yn aildroseddu. Diolch.

15:40

Dwi'n falch iawn o allu cyfrannu at y ddadl yma, er nad oeddwn yn aelod o'r pwyllgor iechyd yn ystod yr ymchwiliad ei hun. Mi oedd hwn yn bwnc roeddwn i'n awyddus iawn i'r pwyllgor ymchwilio iddo fo pan oeddwn i yn aelod, ac roeddwn i'n croesawu'n fawr cyhoeddi'r adroddiad ar y pwnc pwysig iawn yma. 

Mae cyfle gwirioneddol gennym ni yma yng Nghymru i gyrraedd y nod syml ond hynod, hynod gyffrous o ddileu hepatitis C yn gyfan gwbl. Oes, mae yna ymrwymiad gan Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd i'w waredu erbyn 2030, ond mi allen ni yng Nghymru symud ar amserlen dynnach na hynny. Mae Lloegr a'r Alban eisoes wedi gosod targedau llymach iddyn nhw eu hunain, ac mae Ymddiriedolaeth Hepatitis C wedi dweud, fel dywedon nhw wrth y pwyllgor, am fod Cymru â nifer cymharol fach o bobl i ddod o hyd iddyn nhw a'u trin, mi all Cymru fod y wlad gyntaf yn y Deyrnas Unedig i ddileu'r haint. Ond, wrth gwrs, mae angen strategaeth gref iawn er mwyn gwneud hynny, ac mae'n siomedig iawn darllen casgliad y pwyllgor nad ydym ni ar y trywydd iawn i gyrraedd targed dileu erbyn 2030 hyd yn oed, ar hyn o bryd. 

Y gred ydy bod o bosib hanner y rheini yng Nghymru sydd â hepatitis C ddim wedi cael diagnosis eto, yn rhannol oherwydd natur asymptomatic hep C, felly mae pobl weithau yn cael cam ddiagnosis. Efallai nad yw pobl yn ymwybodol eu bod nhw mewn categori risg—pobl, o bosib, sydd wedi defnyddio cyffuriau yn y gorffennol a heb wneud hynny ers degawdau o bosib ac yn meddwl bod y perig wedi pasio; o bosib defnyddwyr cyffuriau neu chwistrellu i wella delwedd neu berfformiad mewn chwaraeon, hyd yn oed—pobl sydd ddim yn ystyried eu bod nhw yn defnyddio chwistrellion mewn ffordd fudr mewn rhyw ffordd, ac felly nad ydynt â mynediad chwaith at wasanaethau camddefnyddio sylweddau ac yn colli allan ar y negeseuon pwysig sy'n cael eu rhannu yn y cyd-destunau hynny.

Felly, dwi'n croesawu argymhelliad y pwyllgor am i'r strategaeth gynnwys ymgyrch codi ymwybyddiaeth wedi'i thargedu er mwyn cyrraedd pobl sydd yn wynebu risg, yn ogystal hefyd â darparu addysg a hyfforddiant i weithwyr iechyd proffesiynol. Mi ddaeth yn glir iawn i fi dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf mai'r her fawr ydy nid i wella pobl sydd â'r haint ond i ddod o hyd i'r bobl sydd â'r haint sydd ddim yn gwybod hynny. Mae'r Llywodraeth ei hunan yn cyfaddef yn ei hymateb i argymhelliad y pwyllgor fod cleifion yn anodd iawn i'w cyrraedd. Felly, gadewch inni ddefnyddio pob modd i geisio'u cyrraedd nhw, p'un ai drwy adael i bobl wybod pwy allai fod mewn perig; defnyddio pob cyfle i brofi; gwella profion am hepatitis C mewn carchardai yng Nghymru, er enghraifft, fel mae'r adroddiad yn ei argymhell; hefyd efallai edrych ar gyfleoedd eraill—profi pawb wrth iddyn nhw gofrestru efo meddyg teulu, ac yn y blaen. Mae yna bob mathau o ffyrdd i estyn allan at bobl, ac mi ddylai ymgyrch ymwybyddiaeth hefyd adael i bobl wybod pa mor hawdd ydy trin—a pha mor hawdd ydy gwneud y prawf yn y lle cyntaf, ond pa mor hawdd ydy trin hefyd o ganfod hepatitis C yn ddigon cynnar.

Mae yna waith da a sylfeini cryf wedi cael eu gosod yn barod mewn llawer ffordd, a dwi'n diolch i'r rheini o fewn y gyfundrefn iechyd ag elusennau ac yn y blaen am y camau bras maen nhw wedi eu sicrhau sydd wedi digwydd yn barod o ran hyn. Ond mae'n rhaid inni wneud yn siŵr bod ymrwymiad gan y byrddau iechyd i gyd a Llywodraeth Cymru i symud tuag at ddileu, ac y dylid ystyried targedau fel isafswm hefyd, nid fel uchafswm, efo'r nod o allu trin cymaint o bobl â phosibl a chanfod cymaint o'r rhai sydd â hepatitis C â phosibl, a hynny er mwyn arbed arian, wrth gwrs, yn y pen draw. Felly, fel y dywedais i, mae yna gyfle go iawn i ni yma yng Nghymru. Plis, allwn ni wneud yn siŵr bod popeth posibl yn cael ei wneud fel nad ydym ni'n colli'r cyfle euraid yma?

I’m very pleased to be able to contribute to this debate, even though I wasn’t a member of the health committee during the inquiry itself. This was a subject that I was very eager for the committee to look into when I was a member of it, and I very much welcome the publication of the report on this very important subject.

Now, there is a genuine opportunity for us here in Wales to achieve this simple but very exciting aim of eliminating hepatitis C in its entirety. Yes, there’s a target from the World Health Organization to eliminate it by 2030, but we could move according to a tighter timescale. Scotland and England have already set themselves a stricter target, and the Hepatitis C Trust have said to the committee that, because Wales has a relatively low number of people living in it to find and to treat, we could be the first nation in the UK to eliminate this disease. But, of course, we need a very strong strategy in order to do that and it’s very disappointing to read the conclusions of the committee that we’re not on the right course to reach the target of elimination by 2030 even, at the moment.

The belief is that potentially half of those in Wales who have hepatitis C haven’t received a diagnosis yet, partly because of the asymptomatic nature of hep C, so people sometimes receive a misdiagnosis. Perhaps people aren't aware that they're in a risk category—people who perhaps have used drugs in the past and haven't done so for decades and think that the risk has passed; potentially, users of drugs or injections to improve their image or performance in sport, even—people who don't consider that they're using injections in a dirty way, as it were, and so who don't have access to substance abuse services and are losing out on the important messages that are shared in those contexts as well.

So, I do welcome the recommendation to have an awareness raising campaign—a targeted campaign—to target those at-risk groups as well as providing training to professional health workers. It became very clear to me over the past few years that the challenge is not to treat those who already have the disease but to find those who have the disease but don’t know it. And the Government itself admits in its response to the committee's recommendations that patients are very hard to reach. So, do let us use every means at our disposal to reach them, whether by letting people know who could be at risk; using every opportunity to test; improving the testing for hepatitis C in prisons in Wales, as the report recommends; also looking at other opportunities—testing when people register with a GP, and so on. There are many ways of reaching out to people, and an awareness-raising campaign should also let people know how easy it is to treat— and how easy it is to have the test in the first place, but also how easy it is to treat hepatitis C on early diagnosis.

There is good work being done and firm foundations laid already in many ways, and I thank those within the health system and charities and so on for the major steps forward that they have taken in this regard. But we do have to ensure that there is a commitment by the health boards and the Welsh Government to move towards elimination and we should consider targets as a minimum as well, not as a maximum, so that we can treat as many people as possible and identify as many of those as possible who have hepatitis C, and that’s to save money in the long term, as well. So, as I said, there is a genuine opportunity here for us in Wales. Please do let us ensure that everything possible is done so that we don't lose out on this golden opportunity.

15:45

I'm grateful to the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee for their report into hepatitis C elimination in Wales. As the report highlights, around 14,000 people in Wales are chronically infected with this blood-borne virus that can lead to liver failure and cancer of the liver. It is also estimated that around 12,000 people in Wales have the disease but are unaware of it or are not actively seeking treatment.

I am pleased to see the Welsh Government actively working to achieve the World Health Organisation's target of eliminating both hepatitis B and C by the end of this decade. As the Hepatitis C Trust told the committee, Wales has the opportunity to become the first UK nation to eliminate the disease, but in order to achieve this we need a more strategic approach. The trust called for a comprehensive national elimination strategy, and the health committee agrees.

The committee’s first recommendation calls for such a strategy backed up by clear targets, workforce planning and sufficient funding. While the Minister has accepted this in principle, his response states that Welsh Government policy does not favour disease strategies because of the administrative burden. We need this strategy; guidance notes simply won't cut it. Only one health board met their treatment target in 2017-18.

Public Health Wales said that the WHO target can still be met if we have an all-Wales strategy that encompasses key interventions, relevant stakeholders and local delivery plans. This is clearly the kind of strategy envisioned by the health committee and endorsed by the Hepatitis C Trust. Therefore, I urge Members to send a clear message to the Welsh Government: Wales needs a comprehensive national elimination strategy, backed by hard targets and the money to deliver it, and nothing else will do.

Rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon am ei adroddiad ar ddileu hepatitis C yng Nghymru. Fel y mae'r adroddiad yn nodi, mae tua 14,000 o bobl yng Nghymru wedi'u heintio'n gronig gan y feirws hwn a gludir yn y gwaed ac mae'n gallu arwain at fethiant yr afu a chanser yr afu. Amcangyfrifir hefyd fod y clefyd ar oddeutu 12,000 o bobl yng Nghymru ond nad ydynt yn ymwybodol o hynny neu nad ydynt yn mynd ati i gael triniaeth.

Rwy'n falch o weld Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio'n ddiwyd i gyflawni targed Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd i gael gwared â hepatitis B ac C erbyn diwedd y degawd hwn. Fel y dywedodd Ymddiriedolaeth Hepatitis C wrth y pwyllgor, mae gan Gymru gyfle i ddod yn wlad gyntaf y DU i gael gwared ar y clefyd, ond er mwyn cyflawni hyn rydym angen dull gweithredu mwy strategol. Galwodd yr ymddiriedolaeth am strategaeth ddileu genedlaethol gynhwysfawr, ac mae'r pwyllgor iechyd yn cytuno.

Mae argymhelliad cyntaf y pwyllgor yn galw am strategaeth o'r fath wedi'i chefnogi gan dargedau clir, cynllunio ar gyfer y gweithlu a chyllid digonol. Er bod y Gweinidog wedi derbyn hyn mewn egwyddor, mae ei ymateb yn datgan nad yw polisi Llywodraeth Cymru yn ffafrio strategaethau ar gyfer clefydau oherwydd y baich gweinyddol. Rydym angen y strategaeth hon; ni fydd nodiadau cyfarwyddyd yn ddigon. Un bwrdd iechyd yn unig a lwyddodd i gyrraedd ei darged ar gyfer triniaeth yn 2017-18.

Dywedodd Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru y gellid cyrraedd targed Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd o hyd pe bai gennym strategaeth Cymru gyfan sy'n cwmpasu ymyriadau allweddol, rhanddeiliaid perthnasol a chynlluniau cyflawni lleol. Mae'n amlwg mai dyma'r math o strategaeth a ragwelwyd gan y pwyllgor iechyd ac a gymeradwywyd gan Ymddiriedolaeth Hepatitis C. Felly, rwy'n annog yr Aelodau i anfon neges glir i Lywodraeth Cymru: mae Cymru angen strategaeth ddileu genedlaethol, wedi'i hategu gan dargedau caled a'r arian i'w chyflwyno, ac ni fydd unrhyw beth arall yn gwneud y tro.

Can I now call the the Minister for Health and Social Services, Vaughan Gething?

A gaf fi alw yn awr ar y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol, Vaughan Gething?