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Y Cyfarfod Llawn

Plenary

17/04/2018

Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 13:30 gyda’r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair. 

The Assembly met at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.

1. Cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog
1. Questions to the First Minister

Yr eitem gyntaf ar ein hagenda ni y prynhawn yma yw cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog, a'r cwestiwn cyntaf, Lynne Neagle. 

And the first item on our agenda this afternoon is questions to the First Minister, and the first question is from Lynne Neagle. 

Tlodi Plant
Child Poverty

1. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am bolisi Llywodraeth Cymru i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant yng Nghymru? OAQ51981

1. Will the First Minister provide an update on the Welsh Government's policy to tackle child poverty in Wales? OAQ51981

Yes. We are committed to a whole-Government approach to tackling child poverty and we are taking action to ensure that every child has the best start in life, and our child poverty strategy sets out our objectives and policy.

Gwnaf. Rydym ni wedi ymrwymo i ddull Llywodraeth gyfan o fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant ac rydym ni'n cymryd camau i sicrhau bod pob plentyn yn cael y dechrau gorau mewn bywyd, ac mae ein strategaeth tlodi plant yn nodi ein hamcanion a'n polisi.

A new Equality and Human Rights Commission Wales report estimates that there could be 50,000 more Welsh children living in poverty by 2021 because of the Tory Government's welfare reforms. Given the challenges we face in tackling child poverty and the huge concern that has been expressed over the decision to end the school uniform grant in Wales, will the Welsh Government look again at this, and will the Welsh Government also take urgent action to ensure that its 2011 guidance, designed to ensure that school uniforms are affordable for families, is strengthened and properly implemented across Wales?

Mae adroddiad newydd gan Gomisiwn Cydraddoldeb a Hawliau Dynol Cymru yn amcangyfrif y gallai fod 50,000 yn fwy o blant yng Nghymru yn byw mewn tlodi erbyn 2021 oherwydd diwygiadau lles y Llywodraeth Dorïaidd. O ystyried yr heriau yr ydym yn eu hwynebu o ran mynd i'r afael â thlodi plant a'r pryder mawr a fynegwyd ynghylch y penderfyniad i roi terfyn ar y grant gwisg ysgol yng Nghymru, a wnaiff Llywodraeth Cymru ystyried hyn eto, ac a wnaiff Llywodraeth Cymru gymryd camau brys hefyd i sicrhau bod ei chanllawiau o 2011, y bwriadwyd iddynt sicrhau bod gwisgoedd ysgol yn fforddiadwy i deuluoedd, yn cael eu cryfhau a'u gweithredu'n briodol ledled Cymru?

Can I give the Member the assurance that in the next academic year there will be a scheme in place that is broader than the current school uniform grant? That will be of huge assistance to many, many parents and many, many children, and it's intended that the process of moving on to that new system will be seamless. 

A gaf i roi'r sicrwydd i'r Aelod y bydd cynllun ar waith yn y flwyddyn academaidd nesaf sy'n ehangach na'r grant gwisg ysgol presennol? Bydd hwnnw o gymorth enfawr i lawer iawn o rieni a llawer iawn o blant, a bwriedir i'r broses o symud ymlaen i'r system newydd honno fod yn ddi-dor.

First Minister, do you at least welcome the 100,000 reduction in the number of Welsh children living in absolute poverty since 2010, and do you accept that the benefit cap has impacted most in London, which had 90 per cent of housing benefit claims above £20,000 rather than in Wales, and will you credit the near doubling of the tax-free allowance since 2010 for its role in helping many less well-off families?

Prif Weinidog, a ydych chi o leiaf yn croesawu'r gostyngiad o 100,000 i nifer y plant yng Nghymru sy'n byw mewn tlodi absoliwt ers 2010, ac a ydych chi'n derbyn bod y cap ar fudd-daliadau wedi cael yr effaith fwyaf yn Llundain, a oedd â 90 y cant o hawliadau budd-dal tai yn uwch nag £20,000 yn hytrach nag yng Nghymru, ac a wnewch chi roi clod am bron i ddyblu'r lwfans di-dreth ers 2010 am ei swyddogaeth yn y broses o helpu llawer o deuluoedd llai cefnog? 

Let me tell you that I deplore the enormous cuts in public funding that we've seen since 2010 from the Conservative Government, the bung that was given to Northern Ireland of £1 billion for health and education, whereas Wales got absolutely nothing, the fact that so many children have suffered as a result of impositions such as the bedroom tax, such as the incomes of their families, their parents' incomes, not going up, not being supported. Nobody in this Chamber can seriously believe that the Tories care about child poverty or that the last eight years has seen an improvement in poverty levels in Wales. 

Gadewch i mi ddweud fy mod i'n gresynu'r toriadau enfawr i gyllid cyhoeddus yr ydym ni wedi eu gweld ers 2010 gan y Llywodraeth Geidwadol, y cil-dwrn a roddwyd i Ogledd Iwerddon o £1 biliwn ar gyfer iechyd ac addysg, er na chafodd Cymru ddim byd o gwbl, y ffaith fod cynifer o blant wedi dioddef o ganlyniad i feichiau fel y dreth ystafell wely, fel incwm eu teuluoedd, incwm eu rhieni, ddim yn mynd i fyny, ddim yn cael eu cefnogi. Ni all neb yn y Siambr hon gredu o ddifrif bod y Torïaid yn poeni am dlodi plant, na bod gwelliant wedi bod i lefelau tlodi yng Nghymru dros yr wyth mlynedd diwethaf.

I'm outraged by those figures that were relayed earlier on, and many of those contributory factors are outwith your control. But the school uniform grant is something that is within your control. Now, while the Assembly was in recess, and at the same time as your flagship anti-poverty programme, the Communities First programme was wound up, we heard that you intend to cut the school uniform grant to a tune of £700,000, which is a small amount of money in the scheme of things. It is a grant that helps some of the poorest families access education. While you're prepared to cut this amount of money, it looks petty, First Minister. What assessment have you made regarding the issue of child poverty and the impact of this change on child poverty, and will you agree to write to school heads to ask them to allow pupils to wear non-logoed uniform items in order to try and mitigate some of the impact of this cut to the school uniform grant?

Mae'r ffigurau hynny a gyhoeddwyd yn gynharach wedi fy ngwylltio'n gacwn, ac mae llawer o'r ffactorau cyfrannol hynny y tu allan i'ch rheolaeth. Ond mae'r grant gwisg ysgol yn rhywbeth sydd o fewn eich rheolaeth. Nawr, tra'r oedd y Cynulliad ar doriad, ac ar yr un pryd ag y cafodd eich rhaglen wrthdlodi flaenllaw, y rhaglen Cymunedau yn Gyntaf ei dirwyn i ben, clywsom eich bod yn bwriadu torri'r grant gwisg ysgol gan £700,000, sy'n swm cymharol fach o arian yn y cyd-destun. Mae'n grant sy'n helpu rhai o'r teuluoedd tlotaf i gael mynediad at addysg. Er eich bod yn barod i dorri'r swm hwn o arian, mae'n edrych yn bitw, Prif Weinidog. Pa asesiad ydych chi wedi ei wneud ynglŷn â'r mater o dlodi plant ac effaith y newid hwn ar dlodi plant, ac a wnewch chi gytuno i ysgrifennu at benaethiaid ysgolion i ofyn iddyn nhw ganiatáu i ddisgyblion wisgo eitemau gwisg ysgol heb logo er mwyn ceisio lliniaru rhywfaint o effaith y toriad hwn i'r grant gwisg ysgol?

Can I give the leader of Plaid Cymru an assurance that the education Secretary is in the process, as I said, of looking to introduce an improved grant that suits families' needs better, something which supports better access to curriculum activities and learning opportunities that might otherwise be denied to learners due to cost? A number of councils have already confirmed they will continue to run the year 7 school uniform scheme, or run similar schemes, in 2018-19. While the school uniform grant is certainly helpful for families, it was also inflexible because the money could only be used for school uniforms, and I know that what we are looking to introduce in September will be a scheme that is broader than that and looks to help low income families with so many of the costs of education. 

A gaf i roi sicrwydd i arweinydd Plaid Cymru bod yr Ysgrifennydd dros Addysg yn y broses, fel y dywedais, o geisio cyflwyno gwell grant a fydd yn diwallu anghenion teuluoedd yn well, rhywbeth sy'n cynorthwyo gwell mynediad at weithgareddau cwricwlwm a chyfleoedd dysgu a allai gael ei gwadu i ddysgwyr fel arall oherwydd y gost? Mae nifer o gynghorau eisoes wedi cadarnhau y byddan nhw'n parhau i redeg y cynllun gwisg ysgol blwyddyn 7, neu redeg cynlluniau tebyg, yn 2018-19. Er bod y grant gwisg ysgol yn sicr o gymorth i deuluoedd, roedd hefyd yn anhyblyg oherwydd na ellid defnyddio'r arian heblaw am ar gyfer gwisgoedd ysgol yn unig, a gwn y bydd yr hyn yr ydym yn bwriadu ei gyflwyno ym mis Medi yn gynllun sy'n ehangach na hwnnw ac yn ceisio helpu teuluoedd incwm isel gyda chymaint o gostau addysg.

Lladd-dai Annibynnol
Independant Abattoirs

2. Pa gymorth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei ddarparu i ladd-dai annibynnol yng Nghymru? OAQ51983

2. What support does the Welsh Government provide to independent abattoirs in Wales? OAQ51983

We'll shortly be launching a £1.1 million food business investment scheme package of grant aid specifically to help small and medium-sized slaughterhouses in Wales. That will enable such businesses, which are often in remote areas, to invest in competitiveness, and also to ensure their resilience and, of course, to make sure that they are sustainable in the long term. 

Yn fuan, byddwn yn lansio pecyn cynllun buddsoddi mewn busnesau bwyd gwerth £1.1 miliwn o gymorth grant yn benodol i helpu lladd-dai bach a chanolig eu maint yng Nghymru. Bydd hynny'n galluogi busnesau o'r fath, sy'n aml mewn ardaloedd anghysbell, i fuddsoddi mewn cystadleurwydd, a hefyd i sicrhau eu cydnerthedd ac, wrth gwrs, i wneud yn siŵr eu bod yn gynaliadwy yn yr hirdymor.

I thank you for your answer, First Minister. I hope we all want to see high standards of animal welfare in our slaughterhouses, and that, of course, goes for independent abattoirs as well. I know the one in my own constituency takes great pride in the respectful way in which they treat animals. I'm aware that the Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs is still looking at CCTV in slaughterhouses, and it seems that no decision has yet been made. Can I ask what specific financial support you will offer to slaughterhouses, and independent abattoirs in particular, for the installation of CCTV should the Cabinet Secretary make the decision in that regard?

Diolchaf i chi am eich ateb, Prif Weinidog. Rwy'n gobeithio ein bod ni i gyd eisiau gweld safonau uchel o les anifeiliaid yn ein lladd-dai, ac mae hynny, wrth gwrs, yn wir am ladd-dai annibynnol hefyd. Gwn fod yr un yn fy etholaeth i yn falch iawn o'r modd parchus y maen nhw'n trin anifeiliaid. Rwy'n ymwybodol bod Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros faterion gwledig yn dal i ystyried teledu cylch cyfyng mewn lladd-dai, ac mae'n ymddangos nad oes penderfyniad wedi ei wneud eto. A gaf i ofyn pa gymorth ariannol penodol y byddwch chi'n ei gynnig i ladd-dai, a lladd-dai annibynnol yn benodol, ar gyfer gosod teledu cylch cyfyng pe byddai Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn gwneud penderfyniad yn hynny o beth?

13:35

Well, that's what this grant can be used for. What we will not do is impose CCTV before abattoirs in Wales are ready. In England, of course, we know this is moving ahead on a compulsory basis. We want Wales's slaughterhouses to be fully prepared. We don't rule it out, but, at this stage, what is hugely important is that there's assistance for abattoirs to be ready, if that is the direction that we take.

Wel, dyna y gellir defnyddio'r grant hwn ar ei gyfer. Yr hyn na wnawn ni ei wneud yw gorfodi teledu cylch cyfyng cyn bod lladd-dai yng Nghymru yn barod. Yn Lloegr, wrth gwrs, rydym ni'n gwybod bod hyn yn symud ymlaen ar sail orfodol. Rydym ni eisiau i ladd-dai Cymru fod yn gwbl barod. Nid ydym yn ei ddiystyru, ond, ar hyn o bryd, yr hyn sy'n hynod bwysig yw bod cymorth i ladd-dai fod yn barod, os mai dyna'r cyfeiriad y byddwn ni'n ei ddilyn.

Cwestiynau Heb Rybudd gan Arweinwyr y Pleidiau
Questions Without Notice from the Party Leaders

Cwestiynau nawr gan arweinwyr y pleidiau. Arweinydd yr wrthblaid, Andrew R.T. Davies.

Questions now from the party leaders. The leader of the opposition, Andrew R.T. Davies.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. First Minister, when devolution came into being in 1999 we said at that time that things were going to be different, politics was going to be different. This morning, your Government, and you in particular, wrote a letter to the Presiding Officer indicating that you were minded to seek a legal judgment from the court to stop a debate in this Chamber taking place tomorrow. The only place we can find any comparable comparisons is the country of Egypt, where the executive tries to stop the legislature debating and discussing and voting on a motion that comes before it that is deemed in competence. Why are you trying to silence the Assembly?

Diolch, Llywydd. Prif Weinidog, pan ddigwyddodd datganoli ym 1999, dywedasom bryd hynny bod pethau'n mynd i fod yn wahanol, bod gwleidyddiaeth yn mynd i fod yn wahanol. Y bore yma, ysgrifennodd eich Llywodraeth, a chi yn benodol, lythyr at y Llywydd yn nodi eich bod yn bwriadu ceisio dyfarniad cyfreithiol gan y llys i atal dadl yn y Siambr hon rhag cael ei chynnal yfory. Yr unig le y gallwn ni ddod o hyd i unrhyw gymariaethau tebyg yw gwlad yr Aifft, lle mae'r weithrediaeth yn ceisio atal y ddeddfwrfa rhag dadlau a thrafod a phleidleisio ar gynnig sy'n dod ger ei bron yr ystyrir ei fod yn gymwys. Pam ydych chi'n ceisio tawelu'r Cynulliad?

Well, the leader of the opposition is wrong. There is actually no power to prevent a debate happening in this Chamber except that which resides in the hands of the Presiding Officer. That's not what the letter's about.

Wel, mae arweinydd yr wrthblaid yn anghywir. Nid oes unrhyw rym i atal dadl rhag cael ei chynnal yn y Siambr hon mewn gwirionedd, ac eithrio'r hyn sydd yn nwylo'r Llywydd. Nid dyna y mae'r llythyr yn ymwneud ag ef.

As I understand it, First Minister, from the letter that you sent to the Presiding Officer, you seem to deem yourself outside the scope of the Government of Wales provision, and therefore you do not feel that you are bound by the provisions within the Government of Wales Act, and that is what you will be seeking a judgment from the court on if you seek that route. That, in effect, places you above the law, if you take your interpretation to the extreme, because you are saying your Ministers are bound by the provisions within the Government of Wales Act but you yourself are not. Now, surely, First Minister, you should allow this debate to go ahead tomorrow, allow the debate, because it's deemed to be in competence—it's on the order paper—and I would seek confirmation from you today that you will not try and intervene and stop this debate taking place tomorrow afternoon.

Fel y deallaf, Prif Weinidog, o'r lythyr a anfonwyd gennych chi at y Llywydd, mae'n ymddangos eich bod yn ystyried eich hun y tu allan i gwmpas darpariaeth Llywodraeth Cymru, ac felly nid ydych chi'n teimlo eich bod chi wedi eich rhwymo gan y darpariaethau yn Neddf Llywodraeth Cymru, a dyna beth y byddwch chi'n gofyn am ddyfarniad gan y llys arno os byddwch yn dilyn y llwybr hwnnw. Mae hynny, i bob pwrpas, yn eich rhoi chi uwchlaw'r gyfraith, os cymerwch chi eich dehongliad i'r eithaf, gan eich bod yn dweud bod eich Gweinidogion wedi eu rhwymo gan y darpariaethau yn Neddf Llywodraeth Cymru, ond nad ydych chi eich hun. Nawr, does bosib, Prif Weinidog, na ddylech chi ganiatáu i'r ddadl hon gael ei chynnal yfory, caniatáu'r ddadl, oherwydd ystyrir ei bod yn gymwys—mae ar y papur trefn—ac rwyf yn gofyn am gadarnhad gennych chi heddiw na fyddwch chi'n ceisio ymyrryd ac atal y ddadl hon rhag cael ei chynnal brynhawn yfory.

I have no power to intervene to stop the debate taking place; that's a matter for the Presiding Officer. And also the leader of the opposition inadvertently misleads the Assembly when he claims the effect of section 37, as we interpret it, is to put the First Minister beyond the law. It is not. The interpretation that we place on section 37 is that it applies specifically to Welsh Ministers and not to the functions of the First Minister. Now, that is an issue that is hugely important in law—it's hugely important. Now, if something is in dispute in terms of the law, it's perfectly proper that clarity is sought as to how the law operates. We can't operate in a slapdash way; we have to make sure we have clarity for Government and, indeed, for the Assembly.

Nid oes gen i unrhyw rym i ymyrryd i atal y ddadl rhag cael ei chynnal; mater i'r Llywydd yw hynny. Ac mae arweinydd yr wrthblaid hefyd yn camarwain y Cynulliad yn anfwriadol pan ei fod yn honni mai effaith adran 37, fel yr ydym yn ei dehongli, yw rhoi'r Prif Weinidog y tu hwnt i'r gyfraith. Nid yw'n gwneud hynny. Y dehongliad yr ydym ni'n ei wneud o adran 37 yw ei bod yn berthnasol i Weinidogion Cymru yn benodol ac nid i swyddogaethau'r Prif Weinidog. Nawr, mae hwnnw'n fater sy'n hynod bwysig yn y gyfraith—mae'n eithriadol o bwysig. Nawr, os oes anghydfod ynghylch rhywbeth o ran y gyfraith, mae'n gwbl briodol y dylid ceisio cael eglurhad ynghylch sut y mae'r gyfraith yn gweithredu. Ni allwn weithredu mewn ffordd ffwrdd â hi; Mae'n rhaid i ni sicrhau bod gennym ni eglurder ar gyfer y Llywodraeth ac, yn wir, ar gyfer y Cynulliad.

First Minister, I never thought I'd stand in this Chamber and find us debating these types of points, or discussing these types of points, where you—you—as First Minister, because it's your signature on the bottom of that letter, are trying to prevent a debate coming forward tomorrow because you want to seek a judgment of the court to prevent that happening. Now, you have said time and time again that the substance of the debate tomorrow, which is the leak inquiry report, is in the ownership of the Permanent Secretary, and it is for her to determine whether that report should come forward. Why are you intervening now to try and stop that report coming forward? Because, if that report became public and people could form an opinion, with suitable redactions, which is what we've called for in the motion tomorrow, to protect the identity of any witnesses who wish that identity to be protected, people could form an opinion on that report. Instead, today—the first day back after the Easter recess—we are looking at you as First Minister who has sent a letter to the Presiding Officer, trying to silence the Assembly. That is the wrong way to do democracy here in Wales.

Prif Weinidog, chredais i erioed y byddwn i'n sefyll yn y Siambr hon ac yn ein canfod yn dadlau'r mathau hyn o bwyntiau, neu'n trafod y mathau hyn o bwyntiau, lle'r ydych chi—chi— fel y Prif Weinidog, oherwydd eich llofnod chi sydd ar waelod y llythyr hwnnw, yn ceisio atal dadl rhag cael ei chynnal yfory gan eich bod chi eisiau ceisio dyfarniad y llys i atal hynny rhag digwydd. Nawr, rydych chi wedi dweud dro ar ôl tro mai'r Ysgrifennydd Parhaol sy'n gyfrifol am sylwedd y ddadl yfory, sef adroddiad yr ymchwiliad i ddatgeliadau answyddogol, ac mai ei chyfrifoldeb hi yw penderfynu ar ba un a ddylai'r adroddiad hwnnw gael ei gyhoeddi. Pam ydych chi'n ymyrryd nawr i geisio atal yr adroddiad hwnnw rhag cael ei gyhoeddi? Oherwydd, pe byddai'r adroddiad hwnnw yn cael ei gyhoeddi ac y gallai pobl ffurfio barn, gyda'r golygiadau priodol, sef yr hyn yr ydym wedi galw amdano yn y cynnig yfory, i guddio manylion adnabod unrhyw dystion sy'n dymuno i'r manylion hynny gael eu diogelu, gallai pobl ffurfio barn ar yr adroddiad hwnnw. Yn hytrach, heddiw—y diwrnod cyntaf yn ôl ar ôl toriad y Pasg—rydym ni'n edrych arnoch chi fel Prif Weinidog, sydd wedi anfon llythyr at y Llywydd, yn ceisio tawelu'r Cynulliad. Mae honno'r ffordd anghywir i sicrhau democratiaeth yma yng Nghymru.

It misleads the Assembly to suggest that we have the power to stop the Presiding Officer allowing a debate. That's not what the situation is here. Now, let me explain what the situation actually—. [Interruption.]

Mae'n camarwain y Cynulliad i awgrymu bod y grym gennym ni i atal y Llywydd rhag caniatáu dadl. Nid dyna'r sefyllfa yn y fan yma. Nawr, gadewch i mi egluro beth yw'r sefyllfa mewn gwirionedd—. [Torri ar draws.]

I am interested in hearing the First Minister's response.

Mae gen i ddiddordeb mewn clywed ymateb y Prif Weinidog.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. First of all, I have no fear of the leak inquiry; I ordered it. And it is something that I was under no—it was not imposed on me, it was something that I took forward and Members can see the conclusion. There are far wider legal issues here that arise as a result of the operation of section 37. It's worth me exploring that with Members in detail. Now, first of all, there have been discussions with the Presiding Officer. It's not the case that this came out of the blue. It's not something I would choose to do, I have to say, if other options were available, but we have to protect the position of a senior member of Welsh Government staff who, if the motion was passed, would be at risk of prosecution. This is a serious issue—a hugely serious legal issue—and it is incumbent on us to make sure that steps are taken to protect her. But it goes beyond that.

Section 37 is so broadly defined that, without greater clarity—[Interruption.] Well, if the Member wanted to listen carefully, he might learn something. Okay? Section 37 is so broadly defined, and it lacks such clarity, that potentially any document of any kind that is in the control of a Minister, or an employee of Welsh Government, is potentially releaseable—any document—regardless of whether it was caught by an exemption of the Freedom of Information Act 2000, regardless of whether it was caught by the Data Protection Act 1998, regardless of whether a document might be libellous, regardless of whether the document might contain details of national security. Now, I have in my posession documents that are given to me as First Minister that deal with national security. Under the interpretation at the moment that we have, that would be releaseable—that would be releaseable. [Interruption.] Well, it is; there is no clarity on it.

Secondly—[Interruption.]

Diolch, Llywydd. Yn gyntaf oll, nid wyf yn ofni'r ymchwiliad i'r datgeliadau answyddogol o gwbl; fi wnaeth ei orchymyn. Ac mae'n rhywbeth nad oeddwn i o dan unrhyw—ni chafodd ei orfodi arnaf, roedd yn rhywbeth y gwnes i fwrw ymlaen ag ef a gall yr Aelodau weld y casgliad. Ceir materion cyfreithiol llawer ehangach yn y fan yma sy'n codi o ganlyniad i weithrediad adran 37. Mae'n werth i mi archwilio hynny'n fanwl gyda'r Aelodau. Nawr, yn gyntaf oll, cafwyd trafodaethau gyda'r Llywydd. Nid yw'n wir bod hyn yn ddirybudd. Nid yw'n rhywbeth y byddwn yn dewis ei wneud, mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, pe byddai dewisiadau eraill ar gael, ond mae'n rhaid i ni ddiogelu sefyllfa uwch aelod o staff Llywodraeth Cymru a fyddai, pe byddai'r cynnig yn cael ei basio, mewn perygl o gael ei herlyn. Mae hwn yn fater difrifol—mater cyfreithiol difrifol iawn—ac mae'n ddyletswydd arnom i wneud yn siŵr bod camau yn cael eu cymryd i'w diogelu. Ond mae'n mynd y tu hwnt i hynny.

Mae adran 37 wedi ei ddiffinio mor eang, a heb fwy o eglurder—[Torri ar draws.] Wel, pe byddai'r Aelod yn dymuno gwrando'n ofalus, efallai y byddai'n dysgu rhywbeth. Iawn? Mae adran 37 wedi ei ddiffinio mor eang, a cheir cymaint o ddiffyg eglurder iddi, y gallai fod yn bosibl cyhoeddi unrhyw ddogfen o unrhyw fath sydd o dan reolaeth Gweinidog, neu gyflogai Llywodraeth Cymru—unrhyw ddogfen—ni waeth a oedd wedi ei chynnwys o dan eithriad Deddf Rhyddid Gwybodaeth 2000, ni waeth a oedd wedi ei chynnwys o dan Ddeddf Diogelu Data 1998, ni waeth a allai dogfen fod yn enllibus, ni waeth a allai'r ddogfen gynnwys manylion diogelwch cenedlaethol. Nawr, rwy'n meddu ar ddogfennau a roddir i mi fel Prif Weinidog sy'n ymdrin â diogelwch cenedlaethol. O dan y dehongliad sydd gennym ni ar hyn o bryd, byddai modd cyhoeddi'r rheini—byddai modd cyhoeddi'r rheini. [Torri ar draws.] Wel, mae'n wir; nid oes unrhyw eglurder ynglŷn â hyn.

Yn ail—[Torri ar draws.]

13:40

Allow the First Minister to be heard. 

Gadewch i'r Prif Weinidog gael ei glywed.

Secondly, documents that are commercially confidential, under the interpretation and the lack of clarity that we have now, are no longer subject to confidentiality. It means that any document—a tender bid for example, a commercially confidential document—would be potentially releasable without further clarity. That is the reality of it without further clarity. [Interruption.] If Members don't want to listen—. I'm trying to put a reasonable case here for them. If they don't want to listen, that's a matter for them.

More importantly, if a whistleblower came forward to a Minister with a serious allegation on the basis of confidentiality, and a document was created as a result of that, there is now no guarantee of confidentiality without further clarity. There is no guarantee. I cannot give, as First Minister, any guarantee of confidentiality to anybody, nor can any other Welsh Minister, until this matter is clarified—until this matter is clarified. It also means that any person who produces a document in confidence, or who gives evidence in confidence to any investigation or inquiry, is now not able to receive an absolute guarantee of confidence. That's how serious the situation is.

Now, how can this be resolved? How can this be resolved? Well, there are three ways of resolving it. First of all, a change in the law—section 37. We can't do that. Section 37 is incredibly badly drafted and nobody disputes that. We can't do anything about that. Secondly—not my first choice—is for the matter to be decided in the courts by way of a declaration. That is not the way that I would want to deal with this. We have to protect our position as a Government. The third way of doing it is for a protocol to be developed, as happens in every other Parliament—a protocol to be developed—in order for Members to understand what would be in order and what documents would be releasable in the future. This is exactly what happens at Westminster. There is no reason why this can't happen in the Assembly. 

So, I reiterate the offer we have already made to the Commission, and we make it in good faith, and that is that tomorrow's debate is not time-sensitive and I do not advocate cancelling the debate—I don't advocate withdrawing the debate—but there is an opportunity for that debate to happen in the future. What is clear here is that there are serious legal and constitutional issues that have arisen that need to be resolved, and the way to resolve them, surely, is for this to be done working with the Commission to develop a protocol to provide greater clarity to Members. I make that offer to the Commission and, indeed, to you, Presiding Officer, to deal with this issue in a way that avoids the need for legal action. 

Yn ail, nid yw dogfennau sy'n fasnachol gyfrinachol, o dan y dehongliad a'r diffyg eglurder sydd gennym ni nawr, yn destun cyfrinachedd mwyach. Mae'n golygu y gallai fod yn bosibl cyhoeddi unrhyw ddogfen— cais tender er enghraifft, dogfen fasnachol gyfrinachol—heb eglurhad pellach. Dyna wirionedd y sefyllfa heb eglurhad pellach. [Torri ar draws.] Os nad yw'r Aelodau eisiau gwrando—. Rwy'n ceisio cyflwyno achos rhesymol yma iddyn nhw. Os nad ydyn nhw eisiau gwrando, mater iddyn nhw yw hynny.

Yn bwysicach, pe byddai chwythwr chwiban yn cysylltu â Gweinidog gyda honiad difrifol ar sail cyfrinachedd, a bod dogfen yn cael ei chreu o ganlyniad i hynny, nid oes unrhyw sicrwydd o gyfrinachedd heb eglurhad pellach mwyach. Nid oes unrhyw sicrwydd. Ni allaf roi, fel Prif Weinidog, unrhyw sicrwydd o gyfrinachedd i unrhyw un, ac ni all unrhyw Weinidog Cymru arall ychwaith, tan i'r mater hwn gael ei egluro—tan i'r mater hwn gael ei egluro. Mae hefyd yn golygu nad yw unrhyw berson sy'n llunio dogfen yn gyfrinachol, neu sy'n rhoi tystiolaeth yn gyfrinachol i unrhyw ymchwiliad, yn gallu cael sicrwydd llwyr o gyfrinachedd erbyn hyn. Dyna pa mor ddifrifol yw'r sefyllfa.

Nawr, sut gellir datrys hyn? Sut gellir datrys hyn? Wel, mae tair ffordd o'i ddatrys. Yn gyntaf oll, newid i'r gyfraith—adran 37. Ni allwn wneud hynny. Mae adran 37 wedi'i drafftio yn eithriadol o wael ac nid oes neb yn gwadu hynny. Ni allwn wneud dim am hynny. Yn ail—nid fy newis cyntaf—yw'r i'r mater gael ei benderfynu yn y llysoedd trwy gyfrwng datganiad. Nid dyna'r ffordd y byddwn yn dymuno ymdrin â hyn. Mae'n rhaid i ni warchod ein sefyllfa fel Llywodraeth. Y drydedd ffordd o wneud hyn yw i brotocol gael ei ddatblygu, fel sy'n digwydd ym mhob Senedd arall—datblygu protocol—er mwyn i'r Aelodau ddeall beth fyddai'n briodol a pha ddogfennau y byddai modd eu cyhoeddi yn y dyfodol. Dyna'n union sy'n digwydd yn San Steffan. Nid oes unrhyw reswm pam na all hyn ddigwydd yn y Cynulliad.

Felly, ailadroddaf y cynnig yr ydym ni eisoes wedi ei wneud i'r Comisiwn, ac rydym ni'n ei wneud yn ddidwyll, sef nad yw dadl yfory yn sensitif o ran amser ac nid wyf yn argymell canslo'r ddadl—nid wyf yn dadlau o blaid diddymu'r ddadl—ond ceir cyfle i'r ddadl honno gael ei chynnal yn y dyfodol. Yr hyn sy'n amlwg yn y fan yma yw bod materion cyfreithiol a chyfansoddiadol difrifol sydd wedi codi y mae angen eu datrys, a'r ffordd i'w datrys, does bosib, yw i hyn gael ei wneud yn gweithio gyda'r Comisiwn i ddatblygu protocol i roi mwy o eglurder i'r Aelodau. Gwnaf y cynnig hwnnw i'r Comisiwn ac, yn wir, i chithau, Llywydd, i ymdrin â'r mater hwn mewn ffordd sy'n osgoi'r angen am gamau cyfreithiol.

Arweinydd Plaid Cymru, Leanne Wood. 

The Plaid Cymru leader, Leanne Wood. 

The problem is that sounds like a threat, First Minister, and the questions of openness and transparency are not going to go away. They cut to the very heart of democracy, and if there are so many problems with the Wales Act why have they only now been identified? These matters, we'll be coming back to them, but I want to ask you about the question of Syria. 

Does the First Minister support military intervention in Syria? 

Y broblem yw bod hynna'n swnio fel bygythiad, Prif Weinidog, ac nid yw'r cwestiynau ynghylch bod yn agored a thryloyw yn mynd i ddiflannu. Maen nhw wrth union wraidd democratiaeth, ac os oes cymaint o broblemau gyda Deddf Cymru, pam mai dim ond nawr y maen nhw wedi eu darganfod? Y materion hyn, byddwn yn dychwelyd atyn nhw, ond hoffwn eich holi am fater Syria.

A yw'r Prif Weinidog yn cefnogi ymyrraeth filwrol yn Syria?

I received a phone call at midnight on Saturday morning from Downing Street. I received a briefing from the Prime Minister. It was clear what the action was going to be. I made clear to her my concern that I feared there would be civilian casualties, given the complicated mosaic on the ground in Syria. That doesn't seem to have happened. But my concern, and it was made to her at the time—. I was very concerned that it wouldn't be possible to take any action without civilian casualties and that was something that I wanted to avoid. 

Cefais alwad ffôn am hanner nos fore Sadwrn gan Downing Street. Derbyniais friff gan y Prif Weinidog. Roedd yn eglur beth oedd y camau'n mynd i fod. Eglurais wrthi fy mhryder fy mod i'n ofni y byddai sifiliaid yn cael eu hanafu, o ystyried y mosaig cymhleth a geir ar lawr gwlad yn Syria. Nid yw'n ymddangos bod hynny wedi digwydd. Ond fy mhryder i, ac fe'i mynegwyd iddi ar y pryd—. Roeddwn i'n bryderus iawn na fyddai'n bosibl gweithredu heb anafu sifiliaid ac roedd hynny'n rhywbeth yr oeddwn i eisiau ei osgoi.

My party is committed to opposing these tokenistic, American-led air strikes, and I'd like to remind the First Minister that the road to peace is rarely paved with the weapons of war. Now, the effectiveness in terms of stopping Syrian suffering is far from clear. The Prime Minister herself has said that these strikes were not intended to change the course of the war in Syria and end the suffering of the Syrian people. Without a single vote cast in this Parliament, Westminster, or anywhere else, the First Minister was quick to show his support for those air strikes. So, can he now tell this Assembly: does he believe that Westminster should be able to start wars without any parliamentary approval?

Mae fy mhlaid i wedi ymrwymo i wrthwynebu'r cyrchoedd awyr symbolaidd hyn, dan arweiniad America, a hoffwn atgoffa'r Prif Weinidog mai anaml y bydd y ffordd i heddwch yn cael ei hadeiladu drwy arfau rhyfel. Nawr, mae'r effeithiolrwydd o ran atal dioddefaint yn Syria ymhell o fod yn eglur. Mae Prif Weinidog y DU ei hun wedi dweud na fwriadwyd i'r cyrchoedd hyn newid trywydd y rhyfel yn Syria a rhoi terfyn ar ddioddefaint pobl Syria. Heb i un bleidlais gael ei bwrw yn y Senedd hon, yn San Steffan, nac yn unrhyw le arall, roedd y Prif Weinidog yn gyflym iawn i ddangos ei gefnogaeth i'r cyrchoedd awyr hynny. Felly, a all ef ddweud wrth y Cynulliad hwn nawr: a yw e'n credu y dylai San Steffan allu dechrau rhyfeloedd heb unrhyw gymeradwyaeth seneddol?

13:45

Well, it's not a war, because that prerogative lies with the monarch. It is military action; that is true. Well, there is a precedent for it. David Cameron asked for a vote in Parliament, and it's a matter for the current Prime Minister to explain as to why there wasn't a vote this time around. There are great dangers here. Syria is complicated. There's no doubt in my mind there was a chemical attack, and anything that removes the capability of such an attack occurring in the future is something I would support. What I would be extremely sceptical of would be an acceleration or escalation of military action in Syria, which would lead, to my mind, inevitably to civilian casualties, and that, of course, would be a propaganda boost for those countries that are already in Syria and who themselves have a case to answer for what they're doing.

Wel, nid yw'n rhyfel, oherwydd mae'r uchelfraint hwnnw'n perthyn i'r Frenhines. Mae yn weithredu milwrol; mae hynny'n wir. Wel, mae cynsail ar ei gyfer. Gofynnodd David Cameron am bleidlais yn y Senedd, a mater i'r Prif Weinidog presennol yw esbonio i ni pam nad oedd pleidlais y tro hwn. Ceir peryglon mawr yma. Mae Syria yn gymhleth. Nid oes unrhyw amheuaeth yn fy meddwl i y bu ymosodiad cemegol, ac mae unrhyw beth sy'n cael gwared ar y gallu i gynnal ymosodiad o'r fath yn y dyfodol yn rhywbeth y byddwn i'n ei gefnogi. Yr hyn y byddwn yn amheus iawn yn ei gylch fyddai cyflymu neu gynyddu gweithredu milwrol yn Syria, a fyddai'n arwain, yn fy marn i, yn anochel at anafiadau i sifiliaid, ac, wrth gwrs, a fyddai'n hwb i bropaganda'r gwledydd hynny sydd eisoes yn Syria ac sydd ag achos i'w ateb eu hunain am yr hyn y maen nhw'n ei wneud.

But that risk is there now, isn't it?

'So for me it’s not a question of bombing in Iraq and then bombing in Syria—I don’t see much of a difference.'

Those were the complacent words of the First Minister when the prospect of British bombs being dropped on Syria first arose back in 2015. He supported bombing campaigns in Syria then, and he supports them now. Yesterday, the First Minister's London Labour boss questioned the legality, the morality and the effectiveness of the strikes. Does the First Minister harbour the same concerns, or does he stand by his comments in support for the Prime Minister and her air strikes in the British national interest?

Ond mae'r risg honno yno nawr, onid yw?

Felly i mi nid yw'n gwestiwn o fomio yn Irac ac yna bomio yn Syria—nid wyf i'n gweld llawer o wahaniaeth.

Dyna oedd geiriau hunanfodlon y Prif Weinidog pan gododd y posibilrwydd o ollwng bomiau Prydeinig ar Syria gyntaf yn ôl yn 2015. Cefnogodd ymgyrchoedd bomio yn Syria bryd hynny, ac mae'n eu cefnogi nhw nawr. Ddoe, cwestiynwyd cyfreithlondeb, moesoldeb ac effeithiolrwydd y cyrchoedd gan fos Llafur y Prif Weinidog yn Llundain. A oes gan y Prif Weinidog yr un pryderon, neu a yw'n cadw at ei sylwadau yn cefnogi Prif Weinidog y DU a'i chyrchoedd awyr er budd cenedlaethol Prydain?

Well, firstly, I have no reason to doubt the soundness of the legal advice. On the issue of morality—well, we are talking here about a chemical attack that occurred on defenceless civilians, and if an attack means that the capability of repeating that is no longer there, then, yes, I would support that. Yes, I would support that.

Wel, yn gyntaf, nid oes gen i unrhyw reswm i amau cadernid y cyngor cyfreithiol. O ran moesoldeb—wel, rydym ni'n sôn yma am ymosodiad cemegol a ddigwyddodd ar sifiliaid diamddiffyn, ac os yw ymosodiad yn golygu nad yw'r gallu i ailadrodd hynny yn bodoli mwyach, yna, byddwn, byddwn yn cefnogi hynny. Byddwn, mi fyddwn yn cefnogi hynny.

The third point, then, is effectiveness—well, time will tell. Time will tell. What I would not support is any military action that would put the lives of civilians at risk. That's a propaganda boon to other countries—a propaganda boost.

But there was a chemical attack by the Assad regime; of that, I am convinced. Secondly, I believe that these missile launches were designed to reduce or remove the capacity for a chemical attack in the future. That surely must be something that should be welcomed in order to avoid those attacks happening in the future. But in terms of escalation, no, there are no great dangers of that. 

Y trydydd pwynt, felly, yw effeithiolrwydd—wel, amser a ddengys. Amser a ddengys. Yr hyn na fyddwn yn ei gefnogi fyddai unrhyw gamau milwrol a fyddai'n peryglu bywydau sifiliaid. Mae hynny'n fantais propaganda i wledydd eraill—hwb propaganda.

Ond bu ymosodiad cemegol gan weithrediaeth Assad; rwyf wedi fy argyhoeddi o hynny. Yn ail, rwy'n credu mai bwriad lansio'r taflegrau hyn oedd lleihau neu gael gwared ar y gallu i gynnal ymosodiad cemegol yn y dyfodol. Does bosib nad yw hynny'n rhywbeth y dylid ei groesawu er mwyn atal yr ymosodiadau hynny rhag digwydd yn y dyfodol. Ond o ran cynyddu gweithredu milwrol, na, nid oes unrhyw beryglon mawr o hynny.

Arweinydd grŵp UKIP, Neil Hamilton.

Leader of the UKIP group, Neil Hamilton.

As I listened to the First Minister's tortuous, legalistic response to the leader of the opposition earlier on, I was reminded of Denis Healy's first law of holes, that when in one, the best thing to do is to stop digging. Another international comparison of the position that the First Minister seems to find himself in today is the Watergate affair. He'll remember that it wasn't the break-in that actually brought down Richard Nixon, but the attempted cover-up. The President in that case said that when the President does it, it's not illegal. Does the First Minister really want to go down in history as the 'Tricky Dicky' of Welsh politics?

Wrth i mi wrando ar ar ymateb troellog, mewn iaith gyfreithiol y Prif Weinidog i arweinydd yr wrthblaid yn gynharach, cefais fy atgoffa o reol gyntaf Denis Healy am dyllau, sef pan eich bod chi mewn un, y peth gorau i'w wneud yw rhoi'r gorau i balu. Mae mater Watergate yn gymhariaeth ryngwladol arall â'r sefyllfa yr ymddengys bod y Prif Weinidog yn canfod ei hun ynddi heddiw. Bydd yn cofio nad y lladrad oedd pen y daith i Richard Nixon, ond yr ymgais i'w gelu. Yn yr achos hwnnw, dywedodd yr Arlywydd nad yw'n anghyfreithlon pan fo'r Arlywydd yn ei wneud. A yw'r Prif Weinidog wir eisiau cael ei gofio mewn hanes fel 'Tricky Dicky' gwleidyddiaeth Cymru?

Well, this is the man who defends Enoch Powell. This is the man who defends Enoch Powell, and he seeks to lecture us on morality. 'Have a good look at yourself' is my response to that. No-one suggests that anybody is above the law, but I'd be interested to know whether there's anything that I said with which he disagrees.

Wel, dyma'r gŵr sy'n amddiffyn Enoch Powell. Dyma'r gŵr sy'n amddiffyn Enoch Powell, ac mae'n ceisio pregethu i ni am foesoldeb. 'Edrychwch yn ofalus arnoch chi eich hun' yw fy ymateb i hynny. Nid oes unrhyw un yn awgrymu bod unrhyw un uwchlaw'r gyfraith, ond byddai gen i ddiddordeb mewn cael gwybod a oes unrhyw beth a ddywedais y mae e'n anghytuno ag ef.

Well, if I were counsel, Llywydd, in any legal action that might be brought, I would provide a legal argument for it, but the subsection that the First Minister refers to states, in relation to Ministers' functions—or, rather, the letter states that section 37, in relation to Ministers' functions, must identify a function that is exercisable by the First Minister and Welsh Ministers collectively. If the function in question is exercisable by the First Minister alone, section 37 has no application. So, what he's effectively saying is that if it's Welsh Ministers together, they are scrutinisable, in the way that section 37 provides, but if it's the First Minister alone, he isn't. That seems to be a very perverse interpretation of a very clear section. 

Wel, pe bawn i'n gwnsler, Llywydd, mewn unrhyw achos cyfreithiol a allai gael ei ddwyn, byddwn i'n darparu dadl gyfreithiol drosto, ond mae'r is-adran y mae'r Prif Weinidog yn cyfeirio ati yn datgan, o ran swyddogaethau Gweinidogion—neu, yn hytrach, mae'r llythyr yn datgan bod yn rhaid i adran 37, o ran swyddogaethau Gweinidogion, nodi swyddogaeth sy'n arferadwy gan y Prif Weinidog a Gweinidogion Cymru ar y cyd. Os yw'r swyddogaeth dan sylw yn arferadwy gan y Prif Weinidog yn unig, nid yw adran 37 yn berthnasol. Felly, yr hyn y mae'n ei ddweud i bob pwrpas yw os mai Gweinidogion Cymru gyda'i gilydd sydd dan sylw, gellir craffu arnynt, yn y modd y mae adran 37 yn ei ddarparu, ond os mai'r Prif Weinidog ar ei ben ei hun sydd dan sylw, ni ellir gwneud hynny. Mae'n ymddangos bod hwnna'n ddehongliad rhyfedd iawn o adran eglur iawn.

13:50

Well, I find it very strange that somebody who stands here in First Minister's questions every week, and has missed very few, suggests that somehow I'm afraid of scrutiny. But the law is the law, and the law has to be applied. Now, there is a difference of interpretation. There are two ways of resolving that interpretation, one of which would be my preferred way, which I have already outlined, and the other one is more formal, but I believe that there is a way of resolving this in order to provide Members with more transparency and to provide Government with the kind of comfort that it needs. I ask Members in this Chamber, and I ask the different parties in this Chamber: if you were in a position where you had been given documents in confidence and you found yourself with a vote demanding those documents should be produced, what would your response be? You want to be in Government; put yourself in the position of somebody who is leading a Government. It's hugely important that there is clarity in this regard, and that clarity I hope can be developed, working with the Commission and the Presiding Officer in the future.

Wel, mae'n rhyfedd iawn bod rhywun sy'n sefyll yn y fan yma yn ystod cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog bob wythnos, ac wedi methu ychydig iawn ohonynt, yn awgrymu fy mod i'n ofn craffu rywsut. Ond y gyfraith yw'r gyfraith, ac mae'n rhaid cymhwyso'r gyfraith. Nawr, ceir gwahaniaeth o ran dehongliad. Ceir dwy ffordd o ddatrys y dehongliad hwnnw, un ohonynt fyddai'r ffordd y byddwn i'n ei ffafrio, ac yr wyf i eisoes wedi ei hamlinellu, ac mae'r llall yn fwy ffurfiol, ond rwy'n credu bod ffordd o ddatrys hyn er mwyn rhoi mwy o dryloywder i'r Aelodau ac i roi i'r Llywodraeth y math o gysur sydd ei angen arni. Gofynnaf i Aelodau yn y Siambr hon, a gofynnaf i'r gwahanol bleidiau yn y Siambr hon: pe byddech chi mewn sefyllfa lle rhoddwyd dogfennau i chi yn gyfrinachol cyn canfod eich hun yn wynebu pleidlais yn mynnu y dylid cyflwyno'r dogfennau hynny, beth fyddai eich ymateb? Rydych chi eisiau bod mewn Llywodraeth; rhowch eich hun yn sefyllfa rhywun sy'n arwain Llywodraeth. Mae'n bwysig dros ben bod eglurder yn hyn o beth, a gellir datblygu'r eglurder hwnnw rwy'n gobeithio, gan weithio gyda'r Comisiwn a'r Llywydd yn y dyfodol.

Well, I'm sure the First Minister is also aware of subsection (6) of section 37, which says that, if the Assembly does pass a motion requiring the production of a document, a direction may be issued by the First Minister or the Government to direct the person at which that requirement is pointed not to comply with it. That, of course, would place the Government in a very embarrassing position, but it would protect against the legal consequences, which the First Minister was adumbrating earlier on. It would seem a very perverse outcome again, in relation to what he said about how this would breach commercial confidentiality, potentially, and the wider implications of what this is supposed to risk, if anything that the First Minister was dealing with would be gaggable or could be prevented from publication, but anything that any other Minister does is perfectly open to scrutiny, whether it would be in a court of law, in the court of public opinion or in this democratic Assembly, which represents the whole of the Welsh people.

Wel, rwy'n siŵr bod y Prif Weinidog hefyd yn ymwybodol o is-adran (6) o adran 37, sy'n dweud, os bydd y Cynulliad yn pasio cynnig yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol i gyflwyno dogfen, caiff y Prif Weinidog neu'r Llywodraeth roi cyfarwyddyd i gyfarwyddo'r person y mae'r gofyniad hwnnw'n berthnasol iddo i beidio â chydymffurfio ag ef. Byddai hynny, wrth gwrs, yn rhoi'r Llywodraeth mewn sefyllfa annifyr iawn, ond byddai'n amddiffyn rhag y canlyniadau cyfreithiol, yr oedd y Prif Weinidog yn eu hamlinellu yn gynharach. Byddai'n ymddangos yn ganlyniad rhyfedd iawn unwaith eto, o ran yr hyn a ddywedodd am sut y byddai hyn yn torri cyfrinachedd masnachol, o bosibl, a goblygiadau ehangach yr hyn y mae hyn i fod i'w beryglu, pe byddai modd celu unrhyw beth yr oedd y Prif Weinidog yn ymdrin ag ef neu y gellid atal ei gyhoeddiad, ond bod unrhyw beth y mae unrhyw Weinidog arall yn ei wneud yn hollol agored i graffu, pa un a fyddai hynny mewn llys, yn llys barn y cyhoedd neu yn y Cynulliad democrataidd hwn, sy'n cynrychioli holl bobl Cymru.

There are two issues: firstly, whether the First Minister's functions are actually part of the operation of section 37, and, secondly, the broader Pandora's box that has now been opened, which is what documents are releasable under section 37. If all documents are releasable, I can't see how Government can continue, bluntly. It's that bad. There has to be some limit, surely. The operation of the Data Protection Act, the operation of the Freedom of Information Act—. I know the Tories haven't thought this far, but the operation of the Freedom of Information Act—they would not apply. They would not apply in these—. There has to be some limit to this.

At this moment in time, the Government cannot give a guarantee of confidentiality to anybody, and that is an interpretation that we can't clearly accept. It's in everyone's interests to get that clarity. Secondly, he only read out the first part of the subsection—subsection (6). Yes, it is possible for a direction to be issued that the person need not comply with the notice, but then another person has to be specified who has to comply with the notice. It's not an absolute discretion. So, have a look at the second part of the section, and it will give you a good idea of how the subsection operates. Yes, it is possible to direct that the person should not comply, but someone else has to be put in their place. So, actually, the discretion is not as absolute as the Member describes.

Ceir dau fater: yn gyntaf, pa un a yw swyddogaethau'r Prif Weinidog yn rhan o weithrediad adran 37 mewn gwirionedd, ac, yn ail, y bocs Pandora ehangach sydd wedi ei agor erbyn hyn, sef pa ddogfennau y mae modd eu cyhoeddi o dan adran 37. Os oes modd cyhoeddi'r holl ddogfennau, ni allaf weld sut y gall Llywodraeth barhau, yn blwmp ac yn blaen. Mae cynddrwg â hynny. Mae'n rhaid cael rhyw derfyn, siawns. Mae gweithrediad y Ddeddf Diogelu Data, gweithrediad y Ddeddf Rhyddid Gwybodaeth—. Gwn nad yw'r Torïaid wedi meddwl mor bell â hyn, ond gweithrediad y Ddeddf Rhyddid Gwybodaeth—ni fyddent yn berthnasol. Ni fyddent yn berthnasol yn yr—. Mae'n rhaid cael rhyw derfyn i hyn.

Ar hyn o bryd, ni all y Llywodraeth roi sicrwydd o gyfrinachedd i neb, ac mae hwnnw'n ddehongliad na allwn ni ei dderbyn, yn amlwg. Mae o fudd i bawb gael yr eglurder hwnnw. Yn ail, darllenodd ran gyntaf yr is-adran yn unig—is-adran (6). Ydy, mae'n bosibl rhoi cyfarwyddyd nad oes angen i'r person hwnnw gydymffurfio â'r hysbysiad, ond mae'n rhaid nodi unigolyn arall wedyn y mae'n rhaid iddo gydymffurfio â'r hysbysiad. Nid yw'n ddisgresiwn absoliwt. Felly, cymerwch olwg ar ail ran yr adran, a bydd yn rhoi syniad da i chi o sut y mae'r is-adran yn gweithio. Ydy, mae'n bosibl cyfarwyddo'r person hwnnw i beidio â chydymffurfio, ond mae'n rhaid rhoi rhywun arall yn ei le. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, nid yw'r disgresiwn mor absoliwt ag y mae'r Aelod yn ei ddisgrifio.

Plant a Phobl Ifanc yng Ngorllewin Clwyd
Children and Young People in Clwyd West

3. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad am gefnogaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer plant a phobl ifanc yng Ngorllewin Clwyd? OAQ51967

3. Will the First Minister make a statement on Welsh Government support for children and young people in Clwyd West? OAQ51967

Yes. We provide universal and targeted support for children and young people across Wales, enabling them to achieve their full potential. This includes enhanced social care, childcare, education, play, youth services and support for additional learning needs and disabilities.

Gwnaf. Rydym ni'n darparu cymorth cyffredinol a phenodol i blant a phobl ifanc ledled Cymru, gan eu galluogi i wireddu eu llawn botensial. Mae hyn yn cynnwys gwell gofal cymdeithasol, gofal plant, addysg, chwarae, gwasanaethau ieuenctid a chymorth ar gyfer anghenion dysgu ychwanegol ac anableddau.

First Minister, in common with other parts of Wales, children in my constituency have also been affected by the withdrawal of the school uniform grant. I listened carefully to what you suggested was going to take place, i.e. that there's going to be a successor grant, but, of course, this existing grant, which has now been withdrawn was withdrawn without any consultation whatsoever with key stakeholders, including parent groups, nor was there a consultation, as I understand it, with our Children, Young People and Education Committee. Given that that was the case, can I also ask how that demonstrates compliance with the children's rights impact assessments that you as a Government must undertake when taking decisions of this nature?

Prif Weinidog, yn gyffredin â rhannau eraill o Gymru, mae plant yn fy etholaeth i hefyd wedi cael eu heffeithio gan ddiddymiad y grant gwisg ysgol. Gwrandewais yn ofalus ar yr hyn a awgrymwyd gennych oedd yn mynd i ddigwydd, h.y. y bydd grant olynol, ond, wrth gwrs, diddymwyd y grant presennol hwn, sydd wedi ei ddiddymu erbyn hyn, heb unrhyw ymgynghori o gwbl â rhanddeiliaid allweddol, gan gynnwys grwpiau rhieni, ac ni fu ymgynghori ychwaith, fel y deallaf, gyda'r Pwyllgor Plant, Pobl Ifanc ac Addysg. O dderbyn bod hynny'n wir, a gaf i hefyd ofyn sut y mae hynny'n dangos cydymffurfiad â'r asesiadau effaith hawliau plant y mae'n rhaid i chi fel Llywodraeth ei cynnal wrth wneud penderfyniadau o'r math hwn?

Where was the consultation on the bedroom tax? Where was the consultation on the personal independence payment? Where was the consultation on the mess of the universal credit? Nothing at all. I don't take lectures from the Conservative Party about consultation. They are the most secretive party in Government that has ever been produced. But he asked the question about what has happened with the school uniform grant. I've already said to him that there will be something better in place in good time for September.

Ble oedd yr ymgynghoriad ar y dreth ystafell wely? Ble oedd yr ymgynghoriad ar y taliad annibyniaeth personol? Ble oedd yr ymgynghoriad ar lanastr y credyd cynhwysol? Dim byd o gwbl. Nid wyf yn fodlon cymryd pregeth gan y Blaid Geidwadol ynglŷn ag ymgynghori. Nhw yw'r blaid fwyaf gyfrinachgar mewn Llywodraeth a gynhyrchwyd erioed. Ond gofynnodd y cwestiwn am yr hyn sydd wedi digwydd gyda'r grant gwisg ysgol. Rwyf i eisoes wedi dweud wrtho y bydd rhywbeth gwell ar waith mewn da bryd ar gyfer mis Medi.

13:55

Was that it? They may be bad. They may be very, very bad. But you haven't answered the question, First Minister, so maybe I could ask whether the First Minister would answer the question.

Ai dyna'r cwbl? Efallai eu bod nhw'n wael dros ben. Ond nid ydych chi wedi ateb y cwestiwn, Prif Weinidog, felly efallai y gallwn i ofyn a wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ateb y cwestiwn.

I answered it in the supplementary to question 1—I thought very clearly.

Fe wnes i ei ateb yn y cwestiwn atodol i gwestiwn 1—yn eglur iawn yn fy marn i.

Diolch, Llywydd. [Interruption.]

Diolch, Llywydd. [Torri ar draws.]

Cwestiwn 4, Gareth Bennett.

Question 4, Gareth Bennett.

Please allow the question to be asked.

Gadewch i'r cwestiwn gael ei ofyn.

Darparu Gorsaf Bws yng Nghanol Dinas Caerdydd
The Provision of a Bus Station in Cardiff City Centre

4. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad am ddarparu gorsaf bws yng nghanol dinas Caerdydd? OAQ52011

4. Will the First Minister make a statement on the provision of a bus station in Cardiff city centre? OAQ52011

Yes. The new bus station will be one of the first infrastructure—[Interruption.]

Gwnaf. Yr orsaf fysiau newydd fydd un o'r prosiectau seilwaith cyntaf—[Torri ar draws.]

The new bus station will be one of the first infrastructure projects operated by the Welsh Government's subsidiary, Transport for Wales. Construction will start this year, and the project will pave the way for a fully integrated and multimodal transport hub at the core of the new metro system.

Yr orsaf fysiau newydd fydd un o'r prosiectau seilwaith cyntaf a weithredir gan is-gwmni Llywodraeth Cymru, Trafnidiaeth Cymru. Bydd y gwaith adeiladu yn dechrau eleni, a bydd y prosiect yn paratoi'r ffordd ar gyfer canolfan drafnidiaeth gwbl integredig ac amlfodd wrth graidd y system fetro newydd.

Yes, thanks for the answer. I think a transport hub is what we do need, and I think a crucial part of that will be the provision of a coach station as part of the overall plans for Central Square. Do we currently have any guarantees that a new coach station will be part of the finalised project?

Ie, diolch am yr ateb yna. Rwy'n credu mai canolfan drafnidiaeth yw'r hyn sydd ei angen arnom ni, ac rwy'n credu mai rhan hanfodol o hynny fydd darparu gorsaf goetsys yn rhan o'r cynlluniau cyffredinol ar gyfer y Sgwâr Canolog. A oes gennym ni unrhyw sicrwydd ar hyn o bryd y bydd gorsaf goetsys newydd yn rhan o'r prosiect terfynol?

That will be something that will have to be examined as part of the project itself. At the moment, the coaches come into Sophia Gardens, if I remember rightly. But, clearly, we would want to move to a situation where the transport hub is fully integrated in terms of all forms of transport.

Bydd hynny'n rhywbeth y bydd yn rhaid ei archwilio yn rhan o'r prosiect ei hun. Ar hyn o bryd, mae'r coetsys yn dod i mewn i Erddi Sophia, os cofiaf yn iawn. Ond, yn amlwg, byddem yn dymuno symud i sefyllfa lle mae'r ganolfan drafnidiaeth yn gwbl integredig o ran pob math o drafnidiaeth.

I think many of us are very confused if this is the coach station, or does it include local buses as well? Because, as I understand it, the need for local transport being centred at the train station is really important, where the central station used to be, and it was part of the scheme that the bus station would be redesigned and be part of this new, exciting project. Indeed, the architects Foster and Partners were chosen to design that last phase to incorporate a bus station for Cardiff Bus. So, what is happening? Is this part of what we're talking about at the moment, or is this drifting into another project completely?

Rwy'n credu bod llawer ohonom ni'n ddryslyd iawn ynghylch pa un ai dyma'r orsaf goetsys, neu a yw'n cynnwys bysiau lleol hefyd? Oherwydd, fel y deallaf, mae'r angen i drafnidiaeth leol gael ei chanoli yn yr orsaf drenau yn wirioneddol bwysig, lle'r oedd yr orsaf ganolog yn arfer bod, ac roedd yn rhan o'r cynllun y byddai'r orsaf fysiau yn cael ei hailgynllunio ac yn rhan o'r prosiect newydd, cyffrous hwn. Yn wir, dewiswyd y penseiri Foster and Partners i ddylunio'r cam diwethaf hwnnw i gynnwys gorsaf fysiau ar gyfer Bws Caerdydd. Felly, beth sy'n digwydd? A yw hyn yn rhan o'r hyn yr ydym ni'n sôn amdano ar hyn o bryd, neu a yw hyn yn llithro i brosiect arall yn llwyr?

No. What we are seeking to provide is seamless integration between trains, buses, coaches and the metro, and to provide easy access for cyclists and pedestrians. That is important—I know that the Member for Llanelli is looking at me when I say that—so the intention is to provide a hub that is as integrated as possible.

Na. Yr hyn yr ydym ni'n ceisio ei ddarparu yw integreiddio di-dor rhwng trenau, bysiau, coetsys a'r metro, a darparu mynediad hawdd i feicwyr a cherddwyr. Mae hynny'n bwysig—gwn fod yr Aelod dros Lanelli yn edrych arnaf wrth i mi ddweud hynny—felly'r bwriad yw darparu canolfan sydd mor integredig â phosibl.

Cardiff residents have been waiting over a decade for a new station and this is becoming an issue that is really making people feel very aggrieved. Last year, I was told by Rightacres that the development of the bus station would happen in January this year. Obviously, nothing yet has happened. I hear you say it's now going to happen this year. I'm just really concerned about the constant delays and the way in which this makes people cynical about our desire to provide a bus station that is crucial to the future health and well-being of all the shopping facilities in the city centre. We absolutely do not want people arriving by car because of the air pollution problem. We had an excellent Foster design. The Welsh Government is now the leaseholder, and you're going to be deciding on the design. What's wrong with the Foster design? Is it not possible to go ahead with the first part of it while you're waiting for your new tenants of the area above the bus station? But we definitely need a bus station, because people at the moment do not know where they have to get their bus, and it's over a decade. So, I'd be grateful for any clarification of what's going to happen.

Mae trigolion Caerdydd wedi bod yn aros am dros ddegawd am orsaf newydd ac mae hwn yn dod yn fater sydd wir yn gwneud i bobl deimlo'n ddig iawn. Y llynedd, fe'm hysbyswyd gan Rightacres y byddai datblygiad yr orsaf fysiau yn digwydd ym mis Ionawr eleni. Yn amlwg, nid oes unrhyw beth wedi digwydd eto. Rwy'n eich clywed chi'n dweud ei fod yn mynd i ddigwydd eleni nawr. Rwy'n pryderu'n fawr am yr oedi cyson a'r ffordd y mae hyn yn gwneud pobl yn sinigaidd ynghylch ein hawydd i ddarparu gorsaf fysiau sy'n hanfodol i iechyd a llesiant yr holl gyfleusterau siopa yng nghanol y ddinas yn y dyfodol. Yn sicr nid ydym eisiau i bobl gyrraedd mewn ceir oherwydd y broblem llygredd aer. Cawsom ni ddyluniad Foster rhagorol. Llywodraeth Cymru yw'r lesddeiliad erbyn hyn, ac rydych chi'n mynd i fod yn penderfynu ar y dyluniad. Beth sydd o'i le ar y dyluniad Foster? Onid yw'n bosibl bwrw ymlaen â'r rhan gyntaf ohono tra eich bod chi'n aros am eich tenantiaid newydd yn y man uwchben yr orsaf fysiau? Ond mae angen gorsaf fysiau arnom yn sicr, oherwydd nid yw pobl yn gwybod ar hyn o bryd ble mae'n rhaid iddyn nhw fynd i ddal eu bws, ac mae mwy na degawd wedi mynd heibio. Felly, byddwn yn ddiolchgar am unrhyw eglurhad o'r hyn sy'n mynd i ddigwydd.

I can give the Member the assurance that spades will be in the ground in June. That is the plan in order to move this forward, and completion is scheduled for the middle of 2021.

Gallaf sicrhau'r Aelod y bydd rhawiau yn y ddaear ym mis Mehefin. Dyna'r cynllun er mwyn symud hyn ymlaen, a disgwylir i'r gwaith gael ei gwblhau erbyn canol 2021.

Y Grant Gwisg Ysgol
The School Uniform Grant

5. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad am ddyfodol y grant gwisg ysgol? OAQ52013

5. Will the First Minister make a statement on the future of the school uniform grant? OAQ52013

Wel, dyna'r un cwestiwn ag o'r blaen. Dyna fe. Rŷm ni'n edrych ar opsiynau i gyflwyno gwell grant sy'n fwy addas i anghenion teuluoedd, gan gynnwys cyfleoedd na fyddai dysgwyr o bosib yn eu cael fel arall o achos y gost.

Well, he’s asking the same question as he asked previously. We are looking at options to provide a more appropriate grant that better suits families, including opportunities that might be otherwise be denied to learners due to cost.

Ond a allech chi felly gadarnhau na fydd yna doriad yn y gyllideb sydd ar gael—yr elfen o arian sydd ar gael—i gefnogi prynu dillad ysgol? Oherwydd ymateb y llefarydd o ran y Llywodraeth i'r cerydd yn dilyn y cyhoeddiad oedd bod gwisg ysgol yn rhatach erbyn hyn. Wel, mae gen i brofiad—mae o leiaf ddwy ysgol uwchradd yn fy rhanbarth i wedi symud i wisgoedd ysgol newydd na allwch chi eu prynu mewn archfarchnadoedd. Maen nhw'n mynnu eich bod chi'n eu prynu nhw drwy ddarparwyr penodol, sydd fawr rhatach o gymharu â gwisgoedd ysgol dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf, felly mae hynny'n ddadl ffals. Yr hyn sydd ei angen nawr yw sicrwydd na fydd yna grebachu yn y swm ariannol a fydd ar gael yn benodol ar gyfer gwisgoedd ysgol wrth symud ymlaen.

But can you confirm that there will be no cut in the budget available—the funding available—to support the purchasing of school uniforms? The response of a spokesperson on behalf of your Government to the censure following the announcement was that school uniforms are now cheaper. Well, I have personal experience—at least two secondary schools in my area have moved to new school uniforms that you can’t buy in supermarkets. They insist that you buy them through specific providers, which aren’t much cheaper than they have been in the past, so that’s a false argument. What we need now is an assurance that there will be no reduction in the sum of funding specifically available for school uniforms from here on in.

14:00

Nid hynny yw'r nod. Y nod yw sicrhau mwy o hyblygrwydd er mwyn sicrhau bod system grantiau gyda ni sydd yn fwy hyblyg er mwyn delio â phethau fel rhoi cyfleon i blant sydd yn dysgu, rhoi cyfleon iddyn nhw efallai i fynd ar dripiau ysgol, ac edrych ar system grantiau sydd yn llai cul na'r system sydd yna ar hyn o bryd. 

That is not the aim. The aim is to secure greater flexibility in order to ensure that we have a more flexible grant system that can deal with things such as giving children and learners more opportunities to go on trips, et cetera, and to look at a grant system that is less restrictive than the present one.

Let's have another go. After this announcement was made, the Welsh Government said that the cost of uniforms had reduced. The Bevan Foundation called this a mealy-mouthed justification for a cut that will save a small sum. A headteacher in Bangor said uniform is a way of avoiding social stigma because pupils all look the same. He blasted what he called the bonfire of the grants affecting some of the most vulnerable school children. A Conservative Bridgend councillor described the move as heartless and said it would hit the poorest families the hardest. You were just asked clearly whether you would protect the funding, so can I ask you, yes or no, even if you won't answer whether you'll protect the funding, will all year 7 pupils in receipt of free school meals still be eligible for a school uniform grant?

Gadewch i ni roi cynnig arall arni. Ar ôl gwneud y cyhoeddiad hwn, dywedodd Llywodraeth Cymru bod prisiau gwisg ysgol wedi gostwng. Galwodd Sefydliad Bevan hyn yn gyfiawnhad wenieithus o doriad a fydd yn arbed swm bach. Dywedodd pennaeth ysgol ym Mangor fod gwisg ysgol yn ffordd o osgoi stigma cymdeithasol gan fod yr holl ddisgyblion yn edrych yr un fath. Roedd yn feirniadol iawn o'r hyn a alwodd yn goelcerth y grantiau sy'n effeithio ar rai o'r plant ysgol mwyaf agored i niwed. Dywedodd cynghorydd Ceidwadol ym Mhen-y-bont ar Ogwr fod y cam yn ddideimlad ac y byddai'n taro'r teuluoedd tlotaf galetaf. Gofynnwyd i chi'n eglur nawr a fyddech chi'n diogelu'r cyllid, felly a gaf i ofyn i chi, bydd neu na fydd, hyd yn oed os na wnewch chi ateb a wnewch chi ddiogelu'r cyllid, a fydd pob disgybl blwyddyn 7 sy'n cael prydau ysgol am ddim yn dal i fod yn gymwys ar gyfer grant gwisg ysgol?

Well, what we're looking to do is to do that and beyond. Our commitment to the most disadvantaged pupils is there for all to see. We've increased it to £93.7 million through the PDG spend. We are looking at not just school uniform items, but possibly the cost of school trips, stationery, extra curricular activities, school photographs, cost of equipment or resources. But I know that the Cabinet Secretary for Education is mindful that while, for the majority of schools, uniform costs are now lower, there are still certain schools that aren't doing enough to keep costs down. She is looking at whether there is merit in placing current guidance for school uniforms on a statutory footing.

Wel, yr hyn yr ydym ni'n bwriadu ei wneud yw gwneud hynny a mwy. Mae ein hymrwymiad i'r disgyblion mwyaf difreintiedig yno i bawb ei weld. Rydym ni wedi ei gynyddu i £93.7 miliwn trwy wariant y grant amddifadedd disgyblion. Yn ogystal ag eitemau gwisg ysgol, rydym ni hefyd yn edrych o bosibl ar gost teithiau ysgol, deunydd ysgrifennu, gweithgareddau allgyrsiol, lluniau ysgol, costau cyfarpar neu adnoddau. Ond gwn fod Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros addysg yn ymwybodol er bod costau gwisg ysgol yn is, i'r mwyafrif o ysgolion, erbyn hyn, ceir ysgolion penodol nad ydynt yn gwneud digon i gadw costau i lawr o hyd. Mae hi'n ystyried a oes rhinwedd i roi canllawiau cyfredol ar gyfer gwisg ysgol ar sail statudol.

Thank you. The First Minister has already answered.

Diolch. Mae'r Prif Weinidog wedi ateb eisoes.

Gwybodaeth a Gedwir gan Lywodraeth Cymru
Information Held by the Welsh Government

6. Sut y mae'r Prif Weinidog yn sicrhau tryloywder ac atebolrwydd gwybodaeth a gedwir gan Lywodraeth Cymru? OAQ51975

6. How is the First Minister ensuring the transparency and accountability of information held by the Welsh Government? OAQ51975

The Welsh Government has followed the principles of openness in Government for many years. We comply with relevant legislation such as the Public Records Act 1958, data protection and freedom of information. We're also active in terms of both the open data agenda and the wider open Government agenda.

Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dilyn yr egwyddorion o fod yn agored mewn Llywodraeth ers blynyddoedd lawer. Rydym ni'n cydymffurfio â deddfwriaeth berthnasol fel Deddf Cofnodion Cyhoeddus 1958, diogelu data a rhyddid gwybodaeth. Rydym ni hefyd yn weithgar o ran yr agenda data agored a'r agenda Llywodraeth agored ehangach.

As a result of your altercation with Adam Price during FMQs on 30 January, I realised that if your Government was seeking correspondence details between Adam Price and Hywel Dda university health board, then you may have asked the same questions about me. Indeed, for all I know, you may be collating information about all opposition Members' correspondence with public sector bodies. And so, I put a subject access request into your Government on 31 January; 37 days later, I was asked for clarification, which I gave; and on 15 March, I was asked for further clarification—to what is essentially a very simple question, First Minister—and this I gave. I have heard nothing. Meanwhile, a local journalist put an FOI into the health board and got this answer:

'Hywel Dda university health board confirms that the information request from the Welsh Government made on 26 January 2018 was initially regarding Adam Price AM. However, upon acknowledgement of the information sent by the UHB on the same date, Welsh Government requested further information about the engagement activities regarding other MPs and AMs.'

So, a local journalist finds out from the health board that my communications have been shared with the Welsh Government, but the Welsh Government seem unable to give that information to me themselves, despite me being entitled to ask this. [Interruption.]

O ganlyniad i'ch ffrae gydag Adam Price yn ystod CPW ar 30 Ionawr, sylweddolais os oedd eich Llywodraeth yn ceisio manylion gohebiaeth rhwng Adam Price a bwrdd iechyd prifysgol Hywel Dda, yna efallai y byddech chi wedi gofyn yr un cwestiynau amdanaf i. Yn wir, hyd y gwn i, efallai eich bod chi'n casglu gwybodaeth am ohebiaeth holl Aelodau'r gwrthbleidiau gyda chyrff sector cyhoeddus. Ac felly, cyflwynais gais mynediad i'ch Llywodraeth ar 31 Ionawr; 37 diwrnod yn ddiweddarach, gofynnwyd i mi am eglurhad, ac fe'i rhoddais; ac ar 15 Mawrth, gofynnwyd i mi am eglurhad pellach—i'r hyn sy'n gwestiwn syml iawn yn y bôn, Prif Weinidog—ac fe'i rhoddais.  Nid wyf i wedi clywed dim. Yn y cyfamser, cyflwynodd newyddiadurwr lleol gais rhyddid gwybodaeth i'r Bwrdd Iechyd gan dderbyn yr ateb hwn:

Mae bwrdd iechyd prifysgol Hywel Dda yn cadarnhau bod y cais am wybodaeth gan Lywodraeth Cymru a wnaed ar 26 Ionawr 2018 yn ymwneud ag Adam Price AC yn wreiddiol. Fodd bynnag, wrth gydnabod y wybodaeth a anfonwyd gan y BIP ar yr un dyddiad, gofynnodd Llywodraeth Cymru am ragor o wybodaeth am weithgareddau ymgysylltu yn ymwneud ag ASau ac ACau eraill.

Felly, mae newyddiadurwr lleol yn darganfod gan y bwrdd iechyd bod fy ngohebiaeth i wedi cael ei rannu gyda Llywodraeth Cymru, ond mae'n ymddangos nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn gallu rhoi'r wybodaeth honno i mi eu hunan, er gwaethaf fy hawl i ofyn hyn. [Torri ar draws.]

I can't hear Angela Burns because her fellow Members are shouting across her. Angela Burns.

Ni allaf glywed Angela Burns gan fod ei chyd-Aelodau yn gweiddi ar ei thraws. Angela Burns.

Thank you. My point, Presiding Officer, is a local journalist can do an FOI on the health board and get the exact same information that I put a subject access request into your Government for at the end of January, and I still have absolutely nothing. So, an Assembly Member can't get their information from you, a journo can from the health board. Your Government is not transparent, is not accountable, and it makes me ask, 'What are you hiding?'

Diolch. Fy mhwynt, Llywydd, yw y gall newyddiadurwr lleol wneud cais rhyddid gwybodaeth i'r bwrdd iechyd a chael yn union yr un wybodaeth a gyflwynais gais mynediad pwnc i'ch Llywodraeth amdano ddiwedd mis Ionawr, ac nid wyf wedi derbyn dim byd o gwbl o hyd. Felly, ni all Aelod Cynulliad gael yr wybodaeth gennych chi, y gall newyddiadurwr ei chael gan y bwrdd iechyd. Nid yw eich Llywodraeth yn dryloyw, nid yw'n atebol, ac mae'n gwneud i mi ofyn, 'Beth ydych chi'n ei guddio?'

First of all, an FOI request is entirely separate to a Data Protection Act 1998 application, because subject access requests are far broader. They're bound to be. I have to say, Darren Millar sits there pompously, shouting 'disgrace', what does he think happens in Westminster? This is exactly what happens in Westminster. Theresa May, when she receives briefings, is—[Interruption.]

Yn gyntaf oll, mae cais rhyddid gwybodaeth yn gwbl ar wahân i gais Deddf Diogelu Data 1998, gan fod y ceisiadau mynediad pwnc yn llawer ehangach. Maen nhw'n siŵr o fod. Mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, mae Darren Millar yn eistedd yn y fan yna yn llond ei esgidiau, yn gweiddi 'gwarthus', beth mae e'n ei feddwl sy'n digwydd yn San Steffan? Dyma'n union sy'n digwydd yn San Steffan. Mae Theresa May, pan fydd hi'n derbyn briffiau, yn—[Torri ar draws.]

14:05

Please allow the First Minister to respond to the question. 

Gadewch i'r Prif Weinidog ymateb i'r cwestiwn.

Theresa May and other Ministers—. Theresa May and other Ministers receive briefing on a Member's interest in a question. That's normal. Plaid Cymru Ministers, as Simon Thomas will be able to tell you, did exactly the same when they were in Government. There's nothing sinister about it. When a Member asks a question, it is quite normal for research to be done on what the Member has said about it, and perhaps what correspondence there is in order for Ministers to answer the question properly. That's all that ever happens. It's exactly the same situation that has existed for many years—all the time since 1999, including for members of Plaid Cymru. There's nothing wrong with it, and this is the way things are done in Westminster. What are the Conservatives—? I know they haven't been in Government, but what do they think happens when an MP asks a question of a Minister? It is standard briefing for a Minister to be told what the MP has said in the past about it, and what correspondence there might be in order for the Minister to be fully informed. That's the way things have always operated both here and in Westminster. There's nothing sinister about it; in fact, it shows respect for the Members.

Theresa May a Gweinidogion eraill—. Mae Theresa May a Gweinidogion eraill yn derbyn briffiau ar fuddiant Aelod mewn cwestiwn. Mae hynny'n arferol. Gwnaeth Gweinidogion Plaid Cymru, fel y bydd Simon Thomas yn gallu dweud wrthych chi, yn union yr un fath pan oedden nhw mewn Llywodraeth. Nid oes dim byd sinistr amdano. Pan fydd Aelod yn gofyn cwestiwn, mae'n eithaf arferol i waith ymchwil gael ei wneud ar yr hyn y mae'r Aelod wedi ei ddweud amdano, ac efallai pa ohebiaeth a fu er mwyn i'r Gweinidogion ateb y cwestiwn yn briodol. Dyna'r cyfan sy'n digwydd fyth. Mae'n union yr un sefyllfa ag sydd wedi bodoli ers blynyddoedd lawer—yr holl amser ers 1999, gan gynnwys i aelodau Plaid Cymru. Nid oes dim o'i le â hyn, a dyma'r ffordd y caiff pethau eu gwneud yn San Steffan. Beth mae'r Ceidwadwyr—? Gwn nad ydyn nhw wedi bod mewn Llywodraeth, ond beth maen nhw'n ei feddwl sy'n digwydd pan fydd AS yn gofyn cwestiwn i Weinidog? Mae'n friffio safonol i Weinidog gael ei hysbysu am yr hyn y mae AS wedi ei ddweud am y peth yn y gorffennol, a pha ohebiaeth a allai fod ar gael er mwyn i'r Gweinidog gael ei hysbysu'n llawn. Dyna'r ffordd y mae pethau wedi gweithredu erioed yma ac yn San Steffan. Nid oes dim byd sinistr amdano; a dweud y gwir, mae'n dangos parch at yr Aelodau.

Comments by a former Cabinet Minister in your own Government today clearly suggest that what happened in my case was not a one-off aberration, as you previously argued, but part of a wider pattern—a smear machine whereby Government resources are being systematically misused to silence and intimidate critics, including people within your own party. And I have to say that, together with the news today of an attempt to intimidate this Parliament with legal action, clearly suggests a picture of a leadership culture within Welsh Government that is dedicated to crushing opposition, whatever the personal cost, and whatever the political cost in terms of public trust in our democratic institutions. My question is a very simple one, but perhaps it's best directed to the people behind you: at what point do we say enough is enough?  

Mae sylwadau gan gyn-Weinidog Cabinet yn eich Llywodraeth eich hun heddiw yn awgrymu'n eglur nad oedd yr hyn a ddigwyddodd yn fy achos i yn gamgymeriad untro, fel y gwnaethoch chi ddadlau yn flaenorol, ond yn rhan o batrwm ehangach—peiriant difenwi lle mae adnoddau Llywodraeth yn cael eu camddefnyddio'n systematig i dawelu a dychryn beirniaid, gan gynnwys pobl o fewn eich plaid eich hun. Ac mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud bod hynny, ynghyd â'r newyddion heddiw o ymdrech i geisio bygwth y Senedd hon gyda chamau cyfreithiol, yn amlwg yn awgrymu darlun o ddiwylliant arweinyddiaeth o fewn Llywodraeth Cymru sy'n ymroddedig i sathru gwrthwynebiad, beth bynnag fo'r gost bersonol, a beth bynnag fo'r gost wleidyddol o ran ymddiriedaeth y cyhoedd yn ein sefydliadau democrataidd. Mae fy nghwestiwn yn un syml iawn, ond efallai y dylid ei gyfeirio at y bobl y tu ôl i chi: pa bryd ydym ni'n dweud mai digon yw digon?

Well, I prefer to stay with the people of Wales. I didn't disappear to America; I stayed and I fought my case with the people of Wales. Why doesn't he speak to Simon Thomas, who will tell him—? [Interruption.] 

Wel, mae'n well gen i aros gyda pobl Cymru. Ni wnes i ddiflannu i America; arhosais i a brwydrais fy achos gyda phobl Cymru. Pam na wnaiff ef siarad â Simon Thomas, a wnaiff ddweud wrtho—? [Torri ar draws.]

You attack me personally on a question about personal attacks. 

Rydych chi'n ymosod arnaf i'n bersonol ar gwestiwn am ymosodiadau personol.

You're attacking me again.

Rydych chi'n ymosod arnaf i eto.

The First Minister is attempting to answer the question.

Mae'r Prif Weinidog yn ceisio ateb y cwestiwn.

The First Minister is attempting to answer the question. Please allow him to finish. [Interruption.] Allow him to finish, please. 

Mae'r Prif Weinidog yn ceisio ateb y cwestiwn. Gadewch iddo orffen. [Torri ar draws.] Gadewch iddo orffen, os gwelwch yn dda.

Adam Price stood in this Chamber and just attacked me personally; he complains when he gets it back, but it's not one law for one and one law for the other. If he speaks to Simon Thomas, he will explain to him that this is quite normal—. [Interruption.] There is no control, Llywydd.

Safodd Adam Price yn y Siambr hon ac ymosododd arnaf i'n bersonol; mae'n cwyno pan ei fod yn ei ei chael hi yn ôl, ond nid yw'n un rheol i un a rheol arall i'r llall. Os gwnaiff ef siarad â Simon Thomas, fe wnaiff ef egluro iddo fod hyn yn gwbl arferol—. [Torri ar draws.] Nid oes unrhyw reolaeth, Llywydd.

There is at least one party in this room that is being very quiet and listening to the First Minister. I want all political parties to allow the First Minister to finish his questions and answers. 

Mae o leiaf un blaid yn yr ystafell hon sy'n bod yn dawel iawn ac yn gwrando ar y Prif Weinidog. Hoffwn i'r holl bleidiau gwleidyddol ganiatáu i'r Prif Weinidog orffen ei gwestiynau a'i atebion.

The idea that Members are subject to a smear machine is complete and utter nonsense. [Interruption.] Well, look, if a Member stands up in the Chamber and attacks the First Minister, surely—. 

Mae'r syniad bod yr Aelodau yn destun peiriant difenwi yn lol llwyr. [Torri ar draws.] Wel, edrychwch, os yw Aelod yn sefyll i fyny yn y Siambr ac yn ymosod ar y Prif Weinidog, does bosib—.

Just let's get through this. Allow the First Minister to finish. 

Gadewch i ni gael trwy hyn. Gadewch i'r Prif Weinidog orffen.

If a Member stands up in the Chamber and questions and attacks another Member, that Member is entitled to respond. There are no special cases in this Chamber. Surely, it's part of the debate within this Chamber. What I can assure Members on is that there's no smear machine—that is absolute nonsense, wholly untrue and has no basis in fact.

It is true to say, as I've said before, that where Members ask a question, then requests are made in terms of what a Member has said and what correspondence might be available in order to be able to assist the Minister with an answer. Plaid Cymru Ministers did exactly the same thing when they were in Government, and why? Well, it shows respects to Members. Surely, Ministers shouldn't go into questions without knowing anything about what the Member has said about a particular issue.

Os bydd Aelod yn sefyll ar ei draed yn y Siambr ac yn cwestiynu ac yn ymosod ar Aelod arall, mae gan yr Aelod hwnnw hawl i ymateb. Nid oes unrhyw achosion arbennig yn y Siambr hon. Does bosib nad yw hynny yn rhan o'r ddadl yn y Siambr hon. Yr hyn y gallaf sicrhau’r Aelodau ynglŷn ag ef yw nad oes unrhyw beiriant difenwi—mae hynny'n lol llwyr, yn gwbl anwir ac nid oes unrhyw sail iddo mewn gwirionedd.

Mae'n wir i ddweud, fel yr wyf i wedi ei ddweud o'r blaen, pan fydd Aelodau yn gofyn cwestiwn, yna bydd ceisiadau yn cael eu gwneud o ran yr hyn y mae Aelod wedi ei ddweud a pha ohebiaeth a allai fod ar gael er mwyn cynorthwyo'r Gweinidog gydag ateb. Gwnaeth Gweinidogion Plaid Cymru yn union yr un peth pan oedden nhw mewn Llywodraeth, a pham? Wel, mae'n dangos parch at Aelodau. Does bosib na ddylai Gweinidogion ateb cwestiynau heb wybod dim am yr hyn y mae'r Aelod wedi ei ddweud am fater penodol.

Cynlluniau Strategol Cymraeg mewn Addysg
Welsh in Education Strategic Plans

7. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad am ddatblygu cynlluniau strategol Cymraeg mewn addysg? OAQ51969

7. Will the First Minister make a statement on the development of Welsh in education strategic plans? OAQ51969

Penodwyd Aled Roberts ym mis Chwefror 2018 am gyfnod o 12 mis i weithredu argymhellion yr adolygiad cyflym o gynlluniau strategol Cymraeg mewn addysg. Mae 15 cynllun wedi cael eu cymeradwyo ac mae’r gwaith yn parhau gyda’r saith awdurdod sydd ar ôl. Rydym ni wedi ymrwymo i wella’r gwaith o gynllunio darpariaeth cyfrwng Cymraeg, fel y gwelir yn 'Cymraeg 2050'.

Aled Roberts was appointed in February 2018 for a 12-month period to implement the recommendations of the rapid review of the Welsh in education strategic plans. Fifteen plans have been approved and work is ongoing with the remaining seven authorities. We are committed to improving the planning of Welsh-medium provision, as outlined in 'Cymraeg 2050'.

Yn bellach i'r ateb yna ac, yn naturiol, fel rydych chi wedi crybwyll eisoes, yn dilyn datganiad Gweinidog y Gymraeg a Dysgu Gydol Oes ar 15 Mawrth, mae yna saith awdurdod lleol yn dal heb gael eu cynlluniau strategol Cymraeg mewn addysg wedi eu cymeradwyo gan eich Llywodraeth chi. Mae tri o'r awdurdodau hynny, sef Abertawe, Castell Nedd Port Talbot a Phen-y-bont, yn fy rhanbarth i. Yn wir, roedd eu cynlluniau drafft cyntaf yn warthus ac yn embaras llwyr wrth feddwl am darged eich Llywodraeth chi i gyrraedd 1 miliwn o siaradwyr Cymraeg. A ydych chi felly yn siomedig gan ddiffyg gweledigaeth a diffyg uchelgais y cynghorau Llafur yma yn y de-orllewin, a beth ydych chi'n ei wneud fel Llywodraeth i symud pethau ymlaen? 

Further to that answer, and naturally, as you’ve already mentioned, following the statement made by the Minister for Welsh Language and Lifelong Learning on 15 March, there are now seven local authorities that have yet to have their WESPs approved by your Government. Three of those authorities—Swansea, Neath Port Talbot and Bridgend—are in my region. Indeed, their first-draft plans were a disgrace and an utter embarrassment, given your Government’s target of 1 million Welsh speakers. Are you, therefore, disappointed by the lack of vision and ambition of these Labour councils in the south-west, and what are you doing, as a Government, to progress matters?

14:10

A gaf fi ddweud, yn hanesyddol wrth gwrs, mai cynghorau Llafur oedd ar flaen y gad i sefydlu ysgolion Cymraeg, yn enwedig yn ne Cymru, felly mae yna record dda ynglŷn â hynny? Mae'n wir i ddweud, wrth gwrs, nad yw rhai awdurdodau wedi dod lan i'r safon y byddem ni'n ei herfyn. Rŷm ni wedi gofyn iddyn nhw sicrhau bod y cynlluniau eu hunain yn cael eu hail-wneud er mwyn inni allu symud ymlaen gyda'r targed uchelgeisiol sydd gyda ni. Mae'r Gweinidog yn mynd i siarad ag arweinwyr yr awdurdodau hynny sydd ddim wedi cael eu WESPs wedi'u caniatáu ar hyn o bryd. Rŷm ni'n moyn sicrhau bod pob WESP newydd yn cael ei roi i'r Llywodraeth erbyn diwedd mis Mai. 

May I say, historically, that it was the Labour councils that were in the vanguard of establishing Welsh-medium schools, particularly in south Wales, so they have a very good record on that? It’s true to say that some authorities haven’t come up to the standard we expect, and we have asked them to ensure that the plans are rewritten and redrafted in order to attain the ambitious target that we have. The Minister will speak with the leaders of those authorities that haven’t had their WESPs approved at present, and we wish to ensure that every new WESP is submitted to the Government by the end of May.

Datblygu Economaidd yng Nghasnewydd
Economic Development in Newport

8. Pa gynlluniau sydd gan Lywodraeth Cymru i gefnogi datblygu economaidd yng Nghasnewydd? OAQ52012

8. What plans does the Welsh Government have to support economic development in Newport? OAQ52012

The 'Prosperity for All' national strategy and economic action plan set out the actions we are taking to improve economic development across Wales, including Newport.

Cyflwynodd strategaeth genedlaethol 'Ffyniant i Bawb' a'r cynllun gweithredu economaidd y camau yr ydym ni'n eu cymryd i wella datblygu economaidd ledled Cymru, gan gynnwys Casnewydd.

Thank you, First Minister. A regular, reliable service on the Ebbw Vale to Newport rail link would ease congestion on our very busy roads and improve economic prosperity throughout the region. There is deep frustration as people have been waiting a long time for this to happen. One extra train per hour on the line, running from Ebbw Vale to Newport via Rogerstone and Pye Corner and on to Cardiff, would connect the Valleys and two of the largest cities in south-east Wales and vice versa. 

While I welcome the Welsh Government's commitment to increasing the frequency of the service on the Ebbw Vale line, with the up and coming decision on the award of the rail franchise, can the First Minister provide reassurances that the Ebbw Vale to Newport rail link will be a priority? 

Diolch, Prif Weinidog. Byddai gwasanaeth rheolaidd a dibynadwy ar gyswllt rheilffordd Glynebwy i Gasnewydd yn lliniaru tagfeydd ar ein ffyrdd prysur iawn ac yn gwella ffyniant economaidd ar draws y rhanbarth. Ceir rhwystredigaeth dwfn gan fod pobl wedi bod yn aros am amser maith i hyn ddigwydd. Byddai un trên ychwanegol bob awr ar y rheilffordd, yn rhedeg o Lynebwy i Gasnewydd drwy Tŷ-du a Pye Corner ac ymlaen i Gaerdydd, yn cysylltu'r Cymoedd a dwy o'r dinasoedd mwyaf yn y de-ddwyrain ac i'r gwrthwyneb.

Er fy mod i'n croesawu ymrwymiad Llywodraeth Cymru i gynyddu amlder y gwasanaeth ar reilffordd Glynebwy, gyda'r penderfyniad sydd ar fin cael ei wneud ar ddyfarniad y fasnachfraint rheilffyrdd, a all y Prif Weinidog roi sicrwydd y bydd cyswllt rheilffordd Glynebwy i Gasnewydd yn flaenoriaeth?

We do remain committed to increasing frequency of services along the Ebbw Vale line and the options being considered do include services calling at Newport. It is important that the Ebbw line is consistent with our metro aspirations, so we will work with the winning bidder to identify the technical solution that's required to complete the infrastructure that's needed to enhance the number of services along the line. 

Rydym ni'n dal i fod wedi ymrwymo i gynyddu amlder gwasanaethau ar hyd rheilffordd Glynebwy ac mae'r dewisiadau sy'n cael eu hystyried yn cynnwys gwasanaethau sy'n galw yng Nghasnewydd. Mae'n bwysig bod rheilffordd Glynebwy yn cyd-fynd â'n dyheadau ar gyfer y metro, felly byddwn yn gweithio gyda'r cynigydd buddugol i ganfod yr ateb technegol sydd ei angen i gwblhau'r seilwaith sydd ei angen i wella nifer y gwasanaethau ar hyd y rheilffordd.

First Minister, Newport council recently unveiled their master plan for the future of Newport city centre, but unfortunately it contained so little detail and so little in the way of firm proposals that it only attracted 24 responses. Would he join me in encouraging Newport City Council to step up to the opportunities that the scrapping of the Severn tolls gives and put real investment into the centre of Newport so we really, really benefit from those opportunities? 

Prif Weinidog, cyhoeddodd Cyngor Casnewydd ei gynllun meistr ar gyfer dyfodol canol dinas Casnewydd yn ddiweddar, ond yn anffodus roedd yn cynnwys cyn lleied o fanylion a chyn lleied o ran cynigion pendant fel mai dim ond 24 o ymatebion a ddenwyd. A wnaiff ef ymuno â mi i annog Cyngor Dinas Casnewydd i fanteisio ar y cyfleoedd y mae cael gwared ar dollau Pont Hafren yn eu cynnig a buddsoddi'n wirioneddol yng nghanol Casnewydd fel ein bod ni wir yn elwa ar y cyfleoedd hynny?

I have to say, Newport council has an excellent record in terms of investment. We see the development along the river, the university campus and the opening of Friars Walk, which I was pleased to open some years ago now. So, there has been significant development in the centre of Newport and I expect the council's good record to continue. 

Mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, mae gan Gyngor Casnewydd hanes rhagorol o ran buddsoddi. Rydym ni'n gweld y datblygiad ar hyd yr afon, campws y brifysgol ac agor Friars Walk, yr oeddwn i'n falch o'i agor rai blynyddoedd yn ôl bellach. Felly, bu datblygiad sylweddol yng nghanol Casnewydd ac rwy'n disgwyl i hanes da y Cyngor barhau.

This week, we saw the unprecedented step of a joint statement between the UK National Cyber Security Centre, the FBI and the US Department of Homeland Security, warning of heightened risks to our internet infrastructure and hardware from Russian state-sponsored hackers. Newport is at the forefront of cyber security expertise, with the excellent National Cyber Security Academy located in that city. What discussions is the First Minister planning to ensure that—as we need to increase capacity in the UK to face this very real threat, with economic and political implications for us all—what discussions is he planning with the UK Government to ensure that it's not centralised in London, and that the UK response is actually shared between the different cities of the UK where expertise exists and, indeed, to go even further and to say that the expertise and the remit of the UK National Cyber Security Centre should be shared to the areas where there is already existing expertise, in places such as Newport? 

Yr wythnos hon, gwelsom y cam digynsail o ddatganiad ar y cyd rhwng Canolfan Diogelwch Seibr Cenedlaethol y DU, yr FBI ac Adran Diogelwch Cartref yr Unol Daleithiau, yn rhybuddio am risgiau cynyddol i'n seilwaith rhyngrwyd a'n caledwedd gan hacwyr a noddir gan wladwriaeth Rwsia. Mae Casnewydd ar flaen y gad o ran arbenigedd seiberddiogelwch, ac mae'r Academi Seiberddiogelwch Genedlaethol ragorol wedi ei lleoli yn y ddinas honno. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Prif Weinidog yn bwriadu eu cael i sicrhau—gan fod angen i ni gynyddu capasiti yn y DU i wynebu'r bygythiad gwirioneddol hwn, sydd â goblygiadau economaidd a gwleidyddol i bob un ohonom—pa drafodaethau y mae'n bwriadu eu cael gyda Llywodraeth y DU i sicrhau nad yw hyn wedi'i ganoli yn Llundain, a bod ymateb y DU yn cael ei rannu rhwng gwahanol ddinasoedd y DU lle mae arbenigedd yn bodoli ac, yn wir, i fynd hyd yn oed ymhellach a dweud y dylid rhannu arbenigedd a chylch gwaith Canolfan Diogelwch Seibr Cenedlaethol y DU i'r ardaloedd lle ceir arbenigedd presennol eisoes, mewn lleoedd fel Casnewydd?

I agree, and I know that the Cabinet Secretary is speaking at an event on Thursday that deals with this exact point. We are supporting a number of initiatives to assist the region's technology credentials. We have the UK's first National Software Academy, a National Cyber Security Academy and innovation point. The Member's quite right to say that this work cannot be centralised in London, not just economically, but I would suspect from a security perspective as well. 

Rwy'n cytuno, a gwn fod Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn annerch digwyddiad ddydd Iau sy'n ymdrin â'r union bwynt hwn. Rydym ni'n cefnogi nifer o fentrau i gynorthwyo enw da technolegol y rhanbarth. Mae gennym ni Academi Meddalwedd Genedlaethol gyntaf y DU, Academi Seiberddiogelwch Genedlaethol a phwynt arloesi. Mae'r Aelod yn hollol iawn i ddweud na ellir canoli'r gwaith hwn yn Llundain, nid yn unig yn economaidd, ond o safbwynt diogelwch hefyd byddwn yn amau.

Ffermwyr a Pherchnogion Anifeiliaid
Farmers and Livestock Owners

9. Pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i helpu ffermwyr a pherchnogion anfeiliaid yr effeithir arnynt gan y prinder presennol mewn porthiant yng Nghymru? OAQ52005

9. What steps is the Welsh Government taking to help farmers and livestock owners affected by the current fodder shortage in Wales? OAQ52005

The Cabinet Secretary for Energy, Planning and Rural Affairs is meeting the unions later this week and will discuss the current fodder situation. I understand that the National Farmers Union has opened its fodder bank.

Mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros Ynni, Cynllunio a Materion Gwledig yn cyfarfod yr undebau yn ddiweddarach yr wythnos hon a bydd yn trafod y sefyllfa bresennol o ran porthiant. Rwy'n deall bod Undeb Cenedlaethol yr Amaethwyr wedi agor ei gronfa porthiant.

14:15

Thank you, First Minister. Of course, straw last year was £42 a tonne bale. Now, it's as much as £70. Hay is £90 a tonne, clamp silage has gone up £15 a tonne to £40, and round bale silage has increased by over 230 per cent. Now, on top of this is the price of transportation, adding an extra £10 per bale. The situation, as you quite rightly point out, has led NFU Cymru and Forage Aid to set up a fodder bank to allow their members to post listings to find much needed feed. This is affecting a lot of farmers in Aberconwy, and I ask you, First Minister: what are you doing to support our farmers? And will you confirm whether the Welsh Government is prepared to follow Ireland by helping farmers through subsidising some of the costs of this transportation?

Diolch, Prif Weinidog. Wrth gwrs, pris bêl gwellt y llynedd oedd £42 y dunnell. Erbyn hyn, mae'n gymaint â £70. Mae gwair yn £90 y dunnell, mae silwair cladd wedi cynyddu £15 y dunnell i £40, ac mae pris silwair bêls crwn wedi cynyddu dros 230 y cant. Nawr, ar ben hyn mae pris cludiant, sy'n ychwanegu £10 fesul bêl. Mae'r sefyllfa, fel y dywedwch yn ddigon teg, wedi arwain at NFU Cymru a Forage Aid yn sefydlu banc porthiant i ganiatáu i'w haelodau ofyn am fwyd anifeiliaid sydd ei angen yn daer. Mae hyn yn effeithio ar lawer o ffermwyr yn Aberconwy, a gofynnaf i chi, Prif Weinidog: Beth ydych chi'n ei wneud i gefnogi ein ffermwyr? A wnewch chi gadarnhau a yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn barod i ddilyn Iwerddon drwy helpu ffermwyr gan roi cymhorthdal ar gyfer rhai o'r costau cludo hyn?

Well, first of all, Farming Connect's locally based team of development officers are on hand to provide advice and guidance. We expect the weather to improve, of course, over the next few days, which may provide some relief. We are in contact with the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and the other devolved administrations, which are all monitoring the impact of persistent wet weather on farm businesses. And, of course, as part of that monitoring, we'll continue to see what can be done to help farmers.

Wel, yn gyntaf oll, mae swyddogion datblygu tîm lleol Cyswllt Ffermio wrth law i roi cyngor ac arweiniad. Rydym ni'n disgwyl i'r tywydd wella, wrth gwrs, dros yr ychydig ddyddiau nesaf, a gallai hynny ddarparu rhywfaint o ryddhad. Rydym mewn cysylltiad ag Adran yr Amgylchedd, Bwyd a Materion Gwledig a'r gweinyddiaethau datganoledig eraill, y mae pob un ohonyn nhw yn monitro effaith y tywydd gwlyb parhaus ar fusnesau fferm. Ac, wrth gwrs, fel rhan o'r gwaith monitro hwnnw, byddwn ni'n parhau i ystyried yr hyn y gellir ei wneud i helpu ffermwyr.

Diolch, Llywydd. Mae’r ffaith bod Llywodraeth Iwerddon yn fodlon talu i helpu i gludo a thalu am fwyd anifeiliaid yn cael effaith ar y farchnad dros ynysoedd Prydain, wrth gwrs. Mae’n gwyrdroi’r farchnad o ran prisoedd, ac yn rhoi prisoedd i fyny ar gyfer ffermwyr yng Nghymru. Dyna, rwy’n credu, yw’r ddadl, a’r peth sydd wedi dod yn glir oherwydd y gwanwyn gwlyb. Beth sy’n dod yn sgil hynny, wrth gwrs, yw’r cwestiwn ehangach o sut rŷm ni’n rheoli’r farchnad dros ynysoedd Prydain wrth inni ymadael â’r Undeb Ewropeaidd. Mae’n codi’r holl gwestiynau ynglŷn â’r undeb tollau ac ynglŷn â’r ffaith bod y farchnad gig yn un gyffredin rhwng Gweriniaeth Iwerddon a Chymru a gweddill ynysoedd Prydain. Yn ogystal â helpu’r ffermwyr dros y problemau y tymor yma, a fedrwch chi ddweud ychydig yn fwy am beth fydd y cynllun i sicrhau cymhorthdal parhaus i ffermwyr i sicrhau eu bod nhw’n gallu bod yn weithredol yn economaidd wrth inni ymadael?

Thank you, Llywydd. The fact that the Irish Government is willing to pay and to transport animal fodder is having an impact on the market across the British isles, and it is having an impact on the markets and putting prices up for farmers in Wales. I think that is the argument, and the thing that's become clear because of the wet spring that we've had. What happens as a result of that, of course, is the broader question as to how we manage the market across the British isles as we leave the European Union. It raises all sorts of questions on the customs union and on the fact that the meat market is a common market between the Republic of Ireland, Wales and the rest of the British isles. In addition to assisting farmers over this season's problems, can you tell us a little more about what the plan will be in order to ensure ongoing subsidy to farmers to ensure that they can be economically active as we leave the European Union?

Mae Undeb Amaethwyr Cymru, wrth gwrs, wedi codi pryderon ynglŷn â beth mae Llywodraeth yr Iwerddon wedi ei wneud, ai yw'n gyfreithlon neu beidio, ac mae hynny’n rhywbeth, efallai, y bydd yn gorfod cael ei ystyried yn y pen draw. Rŷm ni'n deall bod ffermwyr yn dechrau gweld gwair yn tyfu achos y ffordd mae’r tywydd wedi newid. A gaf i ddweud hefyd fod yna elusen o’r enw Forage Aid sy’n cefnogi ffermwyr lle maen nhw wedi cael eu heffeithio gan achlysur o dywydd eithafol? Wrth gwrs, maen nhw’n gallu sicrhau bod yna bethau ar gael i ffermwyr hefyd yn y pen draw. So, felly, os oes yna rai ffermwyr sydd â phroblem fawr, efallai mai Forage Aid yw’r lle i fynd iddo yn y dechrau.

Well, the Farmers Union of Wales, of course, has raised concerns about what the Irish Government has done, whether it's legal or not, and that is something, perhaps, that ultimately we must consider. We understand that the farmers are now seeing the grass growing because the weather has changed. But can I say that there is a charity called Forage Aid, which supports farmers where they have been impacted by extreme weather conditions? They can ensure that there are things available to farmers. So, if some farmers have a major problem then they should perhaps approach Forage Aid in the first place.

2. Datganiad a Chyhoeddiad Busnes
2. Business Statement and Announcement

Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw’r datganiad a chyhoeddiad busnes, ac rydw i’n galw ar arweinydd y tŷ, Julie James.

The next item, therefore, is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the leader of the house, Julie James.

Diolch, Llywydd. I've one change to this week's business. Tomorrow, the Counsel General will make an oral statement on the Law Derived from the European Union (Wales) Bill. Business for the next three weeks is as shown on the business statement and announcement found among the meeting papers, which are available to Members electronically.

Diolch, Llywydd. Mae gennyf i un newid i fusnes yr wythnos hon. Yfory, bydd y Cwnsler Cyffredinol yn gwneud datganiad llafar ar y Gyfraith sy'n deillio o Fil yr Undeb Ewropeaidd (Cymru). Mae busnes ar gyfer y tair wythnos nesaf fel y'i dangosir ar y datganiad a chyhoeddiad busnes ymhlith papurau'r cyfarfod, sydd ar gael i Aelodau yn electronig.

Leader of the house, I wonder if we might have a Government statement or debate on road safety in Wales, in the context of the new powers devolved under the Wales Act 2017 giving the Executive and the legislature powers to set speed limits and the recent Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development report, which called for a 20 mph default speed limit for built-up areas, something supported by the campaign 20's Plenty for Us, which is calling on Welsh Government to introduce such a policy. It's also supported by numerous organisations, including Public Health Wales and Sport Wales. In Scotland, there's a proposed Bill to introduce such a 20 mph default speed limit, and I think it's timely, leader of the house, given the ongoing accidents, fatalities and serious injuries on our roads in Wales in built-up areas, that we debate and consider what further steps might be taken to make our roads safer for all our communities.

Arweinydd y tŷ, tybed a gawn ni ddatganiad gan y Llywodraeth neu ddadl ar ddiogelwch ffyrdd yng Nghymru, yng nghyd-destun y pwerau newydd sydd wedi'u datganoli o dan Ddeddf Cymru 2017, sy'n rhoi pwerau i'r Weithrediaeth a'r ddeddfwrfa i bennu terfynau cyflymder, a'r adroddiad diweddar gan y Sefydliad ar gyfer Cydweithrediad a Datblygiad Economaidd, a alwodd am y terfyn cyflymder diofyn o 20mya mewn ardaloedd adeiledig, rhywbeth a gefnogir gan yr ymgyrch 20's Plenty for Us, sy'n galw ar Lywodraeth Cymru i gyflwyno polisi o'r fath. Cefnogir hyn hefyd gan nifer o sefydliadau, gan gynnwys Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru a Chwaraeon Cymru. Yn yr Alban, mae Bil arfaethedig i gyflwyno terfyn cyflymder diofyn 20mya o'r math hwn, ac rwy'n credu ei fod yn amserol, arweinydd y tŷ, o ystyried y damweiniau parhaus, a'r marwolaethau ac anafiadau difrifol ar ein ffyrdd yng Nghymru mewn ardaloedd adeiledig, ein bod yn trafod ac ystyried pa gamau pellach y gellir eu cymryd i wneud ein ffyrdd yn fwy diogel i'n holl gymunedau.

Yes, thank you. The Wales Act 2017 does of course give the National Assembly the ability to legislate on national speed limits from 1 April this year, as long as the legislation does not create or modify road offences or affect exemptions from speed limits, so it does have some limitations.

The Department for Transport has commissioned a three-year study into 20 mph limits, which aims to consider road safety and the wider impacts, and the results of that are being reported this summer. So, we're taking a very active interest in monitoring that and other relevant research with a view to seeing what we can do in Wales. Of course, the 20 mph zones would need to be signed, because there is an issue about the national speed limit and what happens in unsigned roads. So, there are a number of things to look at, but it's something that the Government is actively considering at the moment.

Ie, diolch. Mae Deddf Cymru 2017 wrth gwrs yn rhoi'r gallu i'r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol i ddeddfu ar y terfynau cyflymder cenedlaethol o 1 Ebrill eleni, ar yr amod nad yw'r ddeddfwriaeth yn creu nac yn addasu troseddau ffyrdd, nac yn effeithio ar eithriadau i derfynau cyflymder, felly mae yna rai cyfyngiadau.

Mae'r Adran Drafnidiaeth wedi comisiynu astudiaeth tair blynedd i'r terfynau 20mya, sydd â'r nod o ystyried diogelwch y ffyrdd a'r effeithiau ehangach, a bydd adroddiad ar y canlyniadau hynny yn yr haf. Felly, mae gennym ddiddordeb mawr wrth fonitro hynny a gwaith ymchwil perthnasol arall gyda golwg ar yr hyn y gallwn ei wneud yng Nghymru. Wrth gwrs, byddai angen arwyddbyst i'r parthau 20mya, oherwydd bod problem yn codi ynghylch y terfyn cyflymder cenedlaethol a beth sy'n digwydd ar ffyrdd heb arwyddion. Felly, mae yna nifer o bethau i'w hystyried, ond mae'n rhywbeth y mae'r Llywodraeth wrthi'n ei ystyried ar hyn o bryd.

14:20

Could I call for two statements, the first ahead of World Curlew Day, next Saturday 21 April, and Curlew Crisis Month, which will be running throughout May—an oral statement in the Chamber on the curlew crisis in Wales? The population in Wales has fallen by 81 per cent and continues to fall by over 6 per cent annually, with country-level extinction expected by 2030. Now, 21 April was chosen as World Curlew Day because of a traditional Welsh tale identifying the first curlew conservationist as St Beuno, a sixth century abbot from Wales and, of course, his feast day is 21 April.

Because of the seriousness of this crisis, there was a major conference in Builth Wells on 24 January, attended by 120 participants from across conservation, farming, game and rural policy sectors in Wales. That's led to regional workshops—I attended one in north Wales on 23 February—and local meetings. There was one in Loggerheads, Denbighshire only two weeks ago. I met the chair of the Welsh Ornithological Society who said, 'Given the plight of the curlew, we can't wait. We must work with the Assembly and Welsh Government to bring in a special curlew prescription as soon as possible.'

Well, as Wales species champion for the curlew, I'll now be joining a panel at the Hay Festival to discuss this crisis, our most endangered species. Clearly, there are many calls from species champions because there are many species champions here, but this bird is the most endangered species. It's on the red list in Wales and UK. Agencies across Wales are working on this crisis. Please can we have a statement in the Chamber so that we can find out further from the Welsh Government how it is working with Natural Resources Wales and the other sectors to address this?

Secondly, and finally, could I call for a statement on the recently tendered Welsh Government Warm Homes all-Wales area-based fuel poverty scheme Arbed 3 scheme manager contract via the National Procurement Service? The north Wales housing association, Grŵp Cynefin, has been working hard in partnership with south Wales based Melin Homes to develop a bid for this contract, but they heard earlier this month that the National Procurement Service for Wales has instead awarded the contract to a Scottish company, Everwarm, part of a much bigger group, which I'm told is called Lakehouse.

I'm told that due diligence appears not to have been fully met, that Melin Homes, which have run Arbed in south Wales for five years, have reality-checked their prices, 100 per cent of their spend goes into the local economy, they employed a team of local people, they support local SMEs, and that's all at risk. But I've been given a letter that says that the Lakehouse group, the parent company, has operated a loss for the last two years and are named in an ongoing fraud investigation by the Metropolitan police resulting from work on fire alarms undertaken in Hackney and linked to Grenfell Tower, and have agreed an £8.75 million payment in respect of a fire that destroyed a school where they were the principal contractor. These are serious matters, and an important procurement contract on behalf of Welsh Government in a key area, fuel poverty—something very close to my heart and many others. This does merit a statement, and these two Welsh-based housing providers need an answer.

A gaf i alw am ddau ddatganiad, y cyntaf cyn Diwrnod y Gylfinir ledled y byd, ddydd Sadwrn nesaf 21 Ebrill, a Mis Argyfwng y Gylfinir, a fydd yn rhedeg drwy gydol mis Mai—datganiad llafar yn y Siambr ar argyfwng y gylfinir yng Nghymru? Mae'r boblogaeth yng Nghymru wedi gostwng 81 y cant ac yn parhau i ostwng mwy na 6 y cant bob blwyddyn, a disgwylir iddyn nhw ddiflannu'n gyfan gwbl ar draws y wlad erbyn 2030. Nawr, dewiswyd 21 Ebrill yn Ddiwrnod y Gylfinir ledled y byd oherwydd y stori draddodiadol Gymreig sy'n nodi mai Sant Beuno, abad o Gymru yn y chweched ganrif, oedd cadwriaethwr cyntaf y gylfinir, ac, wrth gwrs, ei ddydd gŵyl yw 21 Ebrill.

Oherwydd difrifoldeb yr argyfwng hwn, cynhaliwyd cynhadledd fawr yn Llanfair ym Muallt ar 24 Ionawr. Daeth 120 o gyfranogwyr ynghyd o feysydd cadwraeth, ffermio, sectorau polisi helfeydd a chefn gwlad yng Nghymru. Mae hynny wedi arwain at weithdai rhanbarthol—euthum i un yn y gogledd ar 23 Chwefror—a chyfarfodydd lleol. Roedd un yn Loggerheads, Sir Ddinbych dim ond bythefnos yn ôl. Cyfarfûm â Chadeirydd Cymdeithas Adaryddol Cymru a ddywedodd, ' O ystyried trafferthion y gylfinir, allwn ni ddim aros. Mae'n rhaid inni weithio gyda'r Cynulliad a Llywodraeth Cymru i wneud trefniadau arbennig ar gyfer y gylfinir cyn gynted â phosibl.'

Wel, fel hyrwyddwr rhywogaethau Cymru ar gyfer y gylfinir, byddaf nawr yn ymuno â phanel yng Ngŵyl y Gelli i drafod yr argyfwng hwn, sef y rhywogaeth sydd mewn perygl mawr. Yn amlwg, mae llawer o alwadau gan hyrwyddwyr rhywogaethau gan fod llawer o hyrwyddwyr rhywogaethau yma, ond yr aderyn hwn yw'r rhywogaeth sydd yn y perygl mwyaf. Mae ar y rhestr goch yng Nghymru a'r DU. Mae asiantaethau ledled Cymru yn gweithio ar yr argyfwng hwn. A gawn ni ddatganiad yn y Siambr fel y gallwn gael gwybod mwy gan Lywodraeth Cymru o ran sut y mae'n gweithio gyda Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru a sectorau eraill i fynd i'r afael â hyn?

Yn ail, ac yn olaf, a gaf i alw am ddatganiad ar gontract rheolwr cynllun Arbed 3, a gafodd ei dendro yn ddiweddar drwy'r Gwasanaeth Caffael Cenedlaethol, ar gyfer Cynllun rhanbarthol Cymru gyfan, sef Cartrefi Clyd Llywodraeth Cymru, sy'n mynd i'r afael â thlodi tanwydd? Mae Cymdeithas Tai Gogledd Cymru, Grŵp Cynefin, wedi bod yn gweithio'n galed mewn partneriaeth â Cartrefi Melin yn y de i ddatblygu cais ar gyfer y contract hwn. Ond clywodd yn gynharach y mis hwn fod Gwasanaeth Caffael Cenedlaethol Cymru wedi dyfarnu'r contract i gwmni o'r Alban, Everwarm, sy'n rhan o grŵp llawer mwy, o'r enw Lakehouse yn ôl yr hyn a ddeallaf.

Rwyf ar ddeall nad yw'n ymddangos bod diwydrwydd dyladwy wedi'i fodloni'n llawn, a bod Cartrefi Melin, sydd wedi gweithredu Arbed yn yn y de am bum mlynedd, wedi sicrhau bod ei brisiau yn realistig, bod 100 y cant o'u gwariant yn mynd i mewn i'r economi lleol, maen nhw'n cyflogi tîm o bobl leol ac yn cefnogi busnesau bach a chanolig lleol, ac mae hyn i gyd mewn perygl. Ond rwyf wedi cael llythyr sy'n dweud bod grŵp Lakehouse, y rhiant-gwmni, wedi bod yn gweithredu ar golled yn y ddwy flynedd ddiwethaf a chafodd ei enwi mewn ymchwiliad parhaus i dwyll gan yr heddlu Metropolitan o ganlyniad i waith a wnaed ar larymau tân a gynhaliwyd yn Hackney ac sy'n gysylltiedig â Thŵr Grenfell. Mae hefyd wedi cytuno i dalu £8.75 miliwn mewn cysylltiad â thân sydd wedi dinistrio'r ysgol lle'r oedd y grŵp yn brif gontractwr. Mae'r rhain yn faterion difrifol, ac yn gontract caffael pwysig ar ran Llywodraeth Cymru mewn maes allweddol, sef tlodi tanwydd—rhywbeth sy'n agos at fy nghalon i ac at galon llawer eraill. Mae hyn yn haeddu datganiad, ac mae angen i'r ddau ddarparwr tai hyn o Gymru gael ateb.

The Member raises two very important points. I wasn't aware it was World Curlew Day—that's very difficult to say, World Curlew Day—so, I'm very grateful to the Member for raising awareness on that matter. The Minister's indicating to me that she'd welcome a meeting with you to better understand some of the issues you'd raised, and so I'd suggest that we arrange such a meeting and then see what happens as a result of that. The Member also mentioned that he was species champion for the curlew. I can't resist, therefore, the open invitation to say that I am the species champion for the native oyster, which I hope will flourish and therefore assist the curlew in its nutrition as it does so. But it's a very important point that the Member raises, and it's a very important issue that we need to address. So, I would urge the Member to meet with the Minister and see what can be done about it in that way.

In terms of the second matter, procurement, there are a range of legal issues surrounding the award of particular procurements and the process to be followed after that. If the Member has such letters in his possession, I suggest he writes to the Minister responsible quickly and puts those in front of her so that the process can be followed through to its proper conclusion.

Mae'r Aelod yn codi dau bwynt pwysig iawn. Nid oeddwn yn ymwybodol ei bod yn Ddiwrnod y Gylfinir ledled y byd—felly, rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn i'r Aelod am godi ymwybyddiaeth am y mater hwnnw. Mae'r Gweinidog yn dangos i mi y byddai hi'n croesawu cyfarfod â chi i ddeall rhai o'r materion yr ydych wedi eu codi, ac felly byddwn i'n awgrymu ein bod yn trefnu cyfarfod o'r fath a gweld wedyn beth sy'n digwydd o ganlyniad i hynny. Crybwyllodd yr Aelod hefyd ei fod yn hyrwyddwr rhywogaethau ar gyfer y gylfinir. O glywed hyn, mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud hefyd fy mod i'n hyrwyddwr rhywogaethau ar gyfer yr wystrys brodorol, yr wyf yn gobeithio a fydd yn ffynnu ac felly'n cynorthwyo'r gylfinir yn ei faeth wrth wneud hynny. Ond mae'n bwynt pwysig iawn y mae'r Aelod yn ei godi, ac mae'n fater pwysig iawn y mae angen inni roi sylw iddo. Felly, byddwn i'n annog yr Aelod i gyfarfod â'r Gweinidog a gweld beth y gellir ei wneud am y peth yn y ffordd honno.

O ran yr ail fater, caffael, mae amrywiaeth o faterion cyfreithiol yn ymwneud â dyfarnu caffaeliadau penodol a'r broses sydd i'w dilyn ar ôl hynny. Os oes llythyrau o'r fath ym meddiant yr Aelod, rwy'n awgrymu ei fod yn ysgrifennu at y Gweinidog dan sylw yn gyflym a chyflwyno'r llythyrau hynny iddi fel y gellir dilyn y broses a dod i'r casgliad priodol.

14:25

I think we're certainly in for some interesting days in the business for the Assembly, but I'll concentrate on a couple of issues that have emerged over Easter, if I may, and ask first of all if it's possible to have a statement from the Government on the issue of Caribbean and Commonwealth immigrants here in Wales? We've seen over Easter stories emerge of what's been described as the Windrush, empire generation, who have been, through no fault of their own—the children and grandchildren, or children, mainly, of immigrants who have not had British passports, or haven't needed to prove who they are, now being turned away from NHS services—that may not be happening in Wales because we have a different approach in the NHS in Wales, to be fair—but certainly being turned away from job opportunities, landlord checks and so forth. These things do apply in Wales, unfortunately, and we have—certainly with the communities we have in Wales, we have communities of people who will fall into this category.

Now, under severe pressure, the Westminster Government yesterday did a u-turn and is now meeting the heads of Caribbean Governments at the Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting, CHOGM, and so forth to discuss this. But I think it would be useful to have a statement from the Welsh Government as to how you are liaising with the UK Government on ensuring that our citizens, particularly of Caribbean and other Commonwealth origin, are not being penalised by this failure by the Home Office to have a considered, if you like, understanding of some 0.5 million people. It makes you wonder how they're going to cope with 3 million EU citizens when we leave the EU, mind you, but let's concentrate on what we have at the moment. Many of them will be in Wales, many of them will be citizens who will feel, even if they haven't experienced any difficulties yet, concerned about their future, and I think a statement from the Welsh Government setting out how you intend to liaise with the UK Government on this would be extremely useful.

The second thing I'd like to ask you to consider is whether you would give Welsh Government time to a debate on the activities of the Crown Estate in Wales. This is a very important body. We've had discussions about naming bridges and things like this, but let's concentrate on big, important bodies like the Crown Estate. I think it makes something like £300 million a year from its estate in Wales—mainly, of course, renewable energy is the link there, with its ownership of the shoreline and many Crown estates. It doesn't have an office in Wales, it doesn't produce its reports to the Assembly, we don't debate what the Crown Estate does, and yet it's a big economic driver. We have to ask the question as to whether it's doing the best for Wales—I can't answer that question because we don't get those debates. So, in the context of the new powers that you now have as a Welsh Government over energy and the National Grid, or over fracking coming down the line, these are questions that will relate to the Crown Estate and their activities. I think it would be opportune to have an opportunity to debate those and perhaps to examine how we as an Assembly and the Assembly committees can get better interaction with the Crown Estate and better reports back from them on their activity in Wales and the economic benefit that they bear and what ways they seek to work with the Welsh Government in ensuring that that is for the maximum benefit of all the people of Wales.

Rwy'n credu ein bod ni'n sicr o gael rhai diwrnodau diddorol ym musnes y Cynulliad, ond byddaf yn canolbwyntio ar rai materion sydd wedi codi dros y Pasg, os caf i, a gofyn yn gyntaf a oes modd cael datganiad gan y Llywodraeth ar fater mewnfudwyr o'r Caribî a'r Gymanwlad yma yng Nghymru? Rydym ni wedi gweld dros y Pasg bod straeon yn dod i'r amlwg o'r hyn a ddisgrifiwyd fel y Windrush, cenhedlaeth yr ymerodraeth, sydd wedi bod, heb unrhyw fai arnyn nhw eu hunain—yn blant ac yn wyrion, neu'n blant, yn bennaf, i fewnfudwyr nad oedd ganddyn nhw basbort Prydeinig, neu heb fod angen profi pwy ydyn nhw. Erbyn hyn maen nhw'n cael eu gwrthod gan wasanaethau'r GIG—nid yw hynny'n digwydd efallai yng Nghymru oherwydd bod gennym agwedd wahanol yn GIG Cymru, i fod yn deg—ond yn sicr maen nhw'n cael eu gwrthod ar gyfer cyfleoedd am swyddi, gwiriadau gan landordiaid ac ati. Mae'r pethau hyn yn berthnasol yng Nghymru, gwaetha'r modd, ac mae gennym ni—yn sicr gyda'r cymunedau sydd gennym ni yng Nghymru, mae gennym gymunedau o bobl sydd yn disgyn i'r categori hwn.

Nawr, o dan bwysau difrifol, gwnaeth Llywodraeth San Steffan dro pedol ddoe ac mae bellach yn cwrdd â phenaethiaid llywodraethau'r Caribî yng Nghyfarfod Penaethiaid Llywodraethau'r Gymanwlad, CHOGM, ac ati i drafod hyn. Ond rwy'n credu y byddai o gymorth cael datganiad gan Lywodraeth Cymru ynghylch sut yr ydych chi'n cysylltu â Llywodraeth y DU i sicrhau na chaiff ein dinasyddion ni, yn enwedig o dras Caribïaidd ac o wledydd eraill y Gymanwlad, eu cosbi gan y methiant hwn gan y Swyddfa Gartref i gael dealltwriaeth ystyrlon, os mynnwch, o oddeutu 0.5 miliwn o bobl. Mae'n gwneud ichi feddwl tybed sut maen nhw'n mynd i ymdopi â 3 miliwn o ddinasyddion yr UE pan fyddwn ni'n gadael yr UE. Ond gadewch inni ganolbwyntio ar yr hyn sydd gennym ni ar hyn o bryd. Bydd llawer ohonyn nhw wedi eu lleoli yng Nghymru, bydd llawer ohonyn nhw yn ddinasyddion a fydd, hyd yn oed os nad ydyn nhw wedi profi unrhyw anawsterau eto, yn teimlo'n bryderus am eu dyfodol, ac rwy'n credu y byddai'n ddefnyddiol iawn cael datganiad gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn nodi sut y bwriadwch gydgysylltu â Llywodraeth y DU ar hyn.

Yr ail beth yr hoffwn i ofyn ichi ei ystyried yw a fyddech chi'n rhoi amser i Lywodraeth Cymru i gael dadl ar weithgareddau Ystad y Goron yng Nghymru. Mae hwn yn gorff pwysig iawn. Rwyf wedi cael trafodaethau am enwi pontydd a phethau fel hynny, ond gadewch inni ganolbwyntio ar gyrff mawr a phwysig fel Ystad y Goron. Rwy'n credu ei bod yn gwneud rhywbeth fel £300 miliwn y flwyddyn o'i hystad yng Nghymru—yn bennaf, wrth gwrs, ynni adnewyddadwy, gyda'i pherchenogaeth o'r traethlin a llawer o Ystadau'r Goron. Nid oes ganddi swyddfa yng Nghymru, nid yw'n cynhyrchu ei hadroddiadau i'r Cynulliad, dydyn ni ddim yn trafod beth mae Ystad y Goron yn ei wneud, ac eto i gyd mae'n sbardun economaidd mawr. Rhaid inni ofyn y cwestiwn a yw'n gwneud y gorau dros Gymru—alla i ddim ateb y cwestiwn hwnnw oherwydd nid ydym yn cael y dadleuon hynny. Felly, yng nghyd-destun y pwerau newydd sydd gennych chi erbyn hyn fel Llywodraeth Cymru dros ynni a'r Grid Cenedlaethol, neu dros ffracio, sydd ar fin dod, mae'r rhain yn gwestiynau a fydd yn berthnasol i Ystad y Goron a'i gweithgareddau. Rwy'n credu y byddai'n dda cael cyfle i gynnal dadl ar hynny ac efallai ystyried sut y gallwn ni fel Cynulliad a Phwyllgorau'r Cynulliad gael gwell rhyngweithio gydag Ystad y Goron ac adroddiadau gwell oddi wrthyn nhw am eu gweithgarwch yng Nghymru ac am yr elw economaidd y maen nhw'n ei sicrhau ac ym mha ffyrdd y maen nhw'n ceisio gweithio gyda Llywodraeth Cymru i sicrhau bod hynny er lles gorau pobl Cymru.

Yes, well, the Member raises two very important issues. In terms of the Windrush generation, the First Minister wrote to the Prime Minister yesterday, and I think—. Presiding Officer, I will have to check the legality of this, but I'm not aware that there's any reason why we can't copy all Members in to that letter, but just with the caveat that I haven't checked. So, unless there's some reason why I can't do that, I will make sure that we do. But I can say that, amongst the things he says in that letter, he says that:

'This situation requires urgent action to resolve the unjust and injurious circumstances which are leading to the children of the Windrush generation being made vulnerable to homelessness, unemployment or deportation due to Home Office mistakes over the past half century.'

I'm actually the lead Minister for that. We are doing a piece of work about how it's affecting the generations here in Wales, and I'm very happy to commit to bringing a statement forward when we've got that piece of work complete, which is very much at the top of our agenda, because I think we've all been truly horrified by the treatment of people who came here, after all, to rescue Britain after the war and who contributed enormously to the success of Britain and its rise from the ashes of the second world war. For them to be treated in this way is nothing short of shameful, embarrassing and disgusting. So, I'm more than happy to commit to such a statement.

In terms of the Crown Estate's activities, I think the Member makes a very good point. I haven't had a chance to discuss that with the relevant Cabinet Secretary, but I think he does make a good point, and I will have that discussion with the Cabinet Secretary, and I will commit, Llywydd, to bringing forward a statement or a debate once I've had that discussion with the Cabinet Secretary because I think he's raised a very important issue. 

Ie, wel, mae'r Aelod yn codi dau fater pwysig iawn. O ran y genhedlaeth Windrush, ysgrifennodd Prif Weinidog Cymru at y Prif Weinidog ddoe, ac rwy'n credu—. Llywydd, bydd yn rhaid imi wirio cyfreithlondeb hyn, ond dydw i ddim yn ymwybodol o unrhyw reswm pam na allem ni anfon copi o'r llythyr hwnnw at yr holl Aelodau, ond dim ond gyda'r cafeat nad wyf wedi'i wirio. Felly, oni bai bod rheswm pam na allaf wneud hynny, byddaf yn gwneud yn siŵr ein bod yn gwneud hyn. Ond gallaf ddweud, ymhlith y pethau a ddywed yn y llythyr hwnnw, ei fod yn dweud hyn:

'Mae'r sefyllfa hon yn gofyn am gamau brys i ddatrys amgylchiadau annheg a niweidiol sy'n arwain at sefyllfa a all roi plant y genhedlaeth Windrush mewn peryg o ddigartrefedd, diweithdra neu allgludo oherwydd camgymeriadau'r Swyddfa Gartref dros yr hanner canrif ddiwethaf.'

Fi yw'r Gweinidog sy'n arwain ar hynny. Rydym yn gwneud darn o waith ynghylch sut mae hyn yn effeithio ar y cenedlaethau yma yng Nghymru. Rwy'n hapus iawn i ymrwymo i gyflwyno datganiad pan fydd gennym ni'r darn o waith cyflawn, ac mae hynny ar frig ein hagenda. Credaf ein bod ni i gyd yn wir wedi ein brawychu gan y driniaeth o bobl a ddaeth yma, wedi'r cyfan, i achub Prydain ar ôl y rhyfel ac sydd yn cyfrannu'n aruthrol at lwyddiant Prydain a'i hadferiad o ludw'r ail ryfel byd. Ac mae eu trin nhw yn y modd hwn yn gywilyddus, yn embaras ac yn ffiaidd. Felly, rwy'n fwy na pharod i ymrwymo i ddatganiad o'r fath.

O ran gweithgareddau Ystad y Goron, credaf fod yr Aelod yn gwneud pwynt da iawn. Dydw i ddim wedi cael cyfle i drafod hynny gyda'r Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet perthnasol. Ond rwy'n credu ei fod yn gwneud pwynt da, a byddaf yn cael y drafodaeth honno gydag Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet, a byddaf yn ymrwymo, Llywydd, i gyflwyno datganiad neu ddadl ar ôl i mi gael y drafodaeth honno gydag Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet oherwydd rwy'n credu ei fod wedi codi mater pwysig iawn.

14:30

As the Westminster Government rolls out universal credit, which will make many people in Wales poorer, the number of people getting a personal independence payment has decreased from the number who previously received disability benefits, and last year the Welsh Government ended the Communities First scheme. And whilst I welcome what the First Minister said today regarding the pupils clothing allowance, I was very concerned, as were many other people here, when we heard that it was being cut. Can I ask for the Minister to make an oral statement on action being taken to alleviate poverty in Wales by the Welsh Government?

Wrth i Lywodraeth San Steffan gyflwyno'r credyd cynhwysol, a fydd yn gwneud llawer o bobl yng Nghymru yn dlotach, mae nifer y bobl sy'n cael taliad annibyniaeth bersonol wedi gostwng o'i gymharu â'r nifer sydd wedi bod yn derbyn budd-daliadau anabledd yn flaenorol, a'r llynedd, daeth Llywodraeth Cymru â'r cynllun Cymunedau yn Gyntaf i ben. Ac er fy mod yn croesawu'r hyn a gafodd ei ddweud gan y Prif Weinidog heddiw ynghylch y lwfans dillad i ddisgyblion, roeddwn yn bryderus iawn, fel nifer o bobl eraill yma, pan glywsom fod y lwfans yn cael ei dorri. A gaf i ofyn i'r Gweinidog wneud datganiad llafar ar y camau a gymerir i liniaru tlodi yng Nghymru gan Lywodraeth Cymru?

Yes. I think I'm going to be discussing, with my personal equalities hat on in my portfolio, with the Minister for Children and Social Care, the Minister for Housing and Regeneration and the Cabinet Secretary, bringing together a number of poverty programmes around some of the equalities issues, and as part of the rapid review of gender-focused policies, which the First Minister has also asked us to look at. And some parts of that will highlight some of the things the Member has just raised in terms of the effect in particular areas of specific Government policies and, more importantly actually, some of the unintended effects of the juxtaposition of several policies at once on some people. So, we are having a piece of work done amongst a range of us at the moment, and I'm happy to commit to bringing forward—. I'm not too sure which one of us will do it, but one of the Government Ministers who has responsibility for this in their portfolio will bring forward a statement in due course. 

Ie. Gan fod cydraddoldebau yn fy mhortffolio i, rwy'n credu fy mod yn mynd i drafod gyda'r Gweinidog dros Blant a Gofal Cymdeithasol, y Gweinidog Tai ac Adfywio ac Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet, gan ddwyn ynghyd nifer o raglenni tlodi sy'n ymwneud â rhai o'r problemau ynghylch cydraddoldeb, ac fel rhan o adolygiad cyflym o bolisïau sy'n ymdrin â rhywedd yn benodol, y mae'r Prif Weinidog hefyd wedi gofyn inni eu hystyried. Bydd rhannau o hynny yn tynnu sylw at rai o'r pethau y mae'r Aelod newydd eu codi o ran yr effaith ar feysydd penodol o bolisïau'r Llywodraeth ac, yn bwysicach, rai o effeithiau anfwriadol cyfosod sawl polisi ar y tro ar rai pobl. Felly, mae sawl un ohonom yn cydweithio ar ddarn o waith ar hyn o bryd, ac rwy'n fodlon i ymrwymo i gyflwyno—. Dydw i ddim yn rhy siŵr pa un ohonom fydd yn ei wneud, ond bydd un o Weinidogion y Llywodraeth sy'n gyfrifol am hyn yn ei bortffolio yn cyflwyno datganiad maes o law.

Leader of the house, can I make two requests, if I can? The first is in relation to Natural Resources Wales's consultation on salmon and sea trout fishing controls. There have been a number of concerns raised with me, and I know with other Members as well, that NRW's proposals are neither fair nor proportionate, and that applying a blanket restriction could be unenforceable and also do nothing to reverse the decline in fish stocks. And there's certainly a concern that there'll be a negative impact on the rural economy, forcing many angling clubs to potentially close. Now, as I understand it, the Cabinet Secretary has said that once she receives the formal application from NRW, she will consider the issue before making a determination. But can I please request that, before the Cabinet Secretary makes a determination, there is a debate on this matter in Government time to allow AMs to express a range of views on behalf of their constituents?

And secondly, and briefly, it has come to my attention that there has been some delay in receiving some Government responses to committee reports and papers, and I would appreciate it if the leader of the house could just investigate this, as I'm sure we'd all agree that responses from the Government should be received in a timely way and within the agreed timescale. I'd be grateful if you could just look into that matter. Thank you.

Arweinydd y tŷ, a gaf i wneud dau gais, os oes modd? Yn gyntaf, o ran ymgynghoriad Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru ar reolaethau pysgota eogiaid a sewin. Codwyd nifer o bryderon o fy mlaen i, a gwn o flaen aelodau eraill hefyd, nad yw cynigion Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru yn deg nac yn gymesur, ac y gallai fod yn amhosibl gorfodi cyfyngiad cyffredinol a hefyd nad ydyn nhw'n gwneud dim i wrthdroi'r dirywiad mewn stociau pysgod. Ac yn sicr mae yna bryder y bydd effaith negyddol ar yr economi wledig, yn gorfodi llawer o glybiau pysgota i gau o bosib. Nawr, fel y deallaf, mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wedi dweud y bydd hi'n ystyried y mater cyn gwneud penderfyniad ar ôl iddi dderbyn y cais ffurfiol gan Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru. Ond a gaf i ofyn os gwelwch yn dda, cyn i Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wneud penderfyniad, am gael dadl ar y mater hwn yn amser y Llywodraeth i ganiatáu i Aelodau'r Cynulliad fynegi barn ar ran eu hetholwyr?

Yn ail, ac yn fyr, mae wedi dod i'm sylw bod rhywfaint o oedi wedi bod o ran cael ymatebion y Llywodraeth i adroddiadau pwyllgorau a phapurau, a byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe gallai arweinydd y tŷ yn ymchwilio i hyn. Rwy'n siŵr y byddem i gyd yn cytuno y dylai ymatebion y Llywodraeth fod yn amserol ac o fewn yr amserlen y cytunwyd arni. Byddwn i'n ddiolchgar pe gallech edrych ar y mater hwnnw. Diolch.

On that second one, I'd be more than happy to meet with you, and if you could give me some specifics to look at I'm obviously very happy to do that. I'm not sure if you were asking me for a more general report on response times, but I'm more than happy to meet and clarify what you meant with that. 

On the NRW point, the Cabinet Secretary will be making a decision in due course and, of course, it's open to all Members to put forward their own views and those of their constituents on those proposals, and that's part of the Cabinet Secretary's responsibility as she makes a decision once NRW has come forward with that. So, I don't think it would be appropriate to have a debate as part of that process. But I'm sure she would welcome representations from all AMs on behalf of their constituents as regards those proposals. 

Ar yr ail un, byddwn yn fwy na pharod i gwrdd â chi, a phe gallech roi rhai manylion penodol i'w hystyried i mi, byddwn yn amlwg yn hapus iawn i wneud hynny. Dydw i ddim yn siŵr a oeddech chi'n gofyn imi am adroddiad mwy cyffredinol ar amseroedd ymateb, ond rwy'n fwy na pharod i gwrdd a chael eglurhad o'r hyn yr oeddech yn ei olygu gan hynny.

O ran y pwynt ynghylch Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, bydd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn gwneud penderfyniad maes o law ac, wrth gwrs, mae'n agored i'r holl Aelodau roi eu barn eu hunain a barn eu hetholwyr ar y cynigion hynny, ac mae hynny'n rhan o gyfrifoldeb Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wrth iddi wneud penderfyniad ar ôl i Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru fod wedi dod â hynny yn ei flaen. Felly, dydw i ddim yn credu y byddai'n briodol cael dadl fel rhan o'r broses honno. Ond rwy'n siŵr y byddai hi'n croesawu sylwadau gan holl Aelodau'r Cynulliad ar ran eu hetholwyr o ran y cynigion hynny.

The leader of the house will be aware that Caerphilly council will be spending another £193,000 to cover the ongoing costs of the ongoing, never-ending senior officer pay scandal, a cost, of course, which is being borne by local people themselves through no fault of their own. The total cost of this entire fiasco now is well over £5 million—incidentally, £5 million that could be put to use for local services, perhaps to keep a local leisure centre that is currently under threat open. Can we have a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for local government on what a local authority has to do, how incompetent it has to be, before it is put into special measures?

Bydd arweinydd y tŷ yn ymwybodol y bydd Cyngor Caerffili yn gwario £193,000 arall i dalu am gostau parhaus y sefyllfa warthus barhaus gyda chyflog yr uwch swyddog, cost a ysgwyddir, wrth gwrs, gan y bobl leol eu hunain heb fod unrhyw fai arnyn nhw. Mae cyfanswm y gost o'r ffiasgo cyfan hwn bellach ymhell dros £5 miliwn—gyda llaw, £5 miliwn y gellid ei ddefnyddio ar gyfer gwasanaethau lleol, o bosib i gadw canolfan hamdden leol ar agor sydd o dan fygythiad ar hyn o bryd. A gawn ni ddatganiad gan Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros lywodraeth leol ar yr hyn y mae angen i'r awdurdod lleol ei wneud, pa mor ddi-glem sydd angen iddo fod, cyn iddo gael ei roi mewn mesurau arbennig?

14:35

Well, I know that the Cabinet Secretary is aware of the situation with Caerphilly council, which has been highlighted just very recently, in terms of the ongoing matter with regard to the senior staff there. I'm not too sure what the status of that is in terms of where it is in process, so I don't think it's appropriate for me to comment further. But I'll certainly raise it with him and ask what his view as to where we are at the moment is.

Wel, gwn fod Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn ymwybodol o'r sefyllfa gyda Chyngor Caerffili, sydd wedi cael ei amlygu dim ond yn ddiweddar iawn, o ran y mater parhaus gyda'r uwch aelodau staff  yno. Dydw ddim yn rhy siŵr beth yw’r sefyllfa gyda hynny o ran lle mae yn y broses, felly dydw i ddim yn credu ei bod yn briodol i mi roi sylwadau pellach. Ond yn sicr byddaf yn codi'r mater gydag ef ac yn gofyn iddo am ei farn ar y sefyllfa ar hyn o bryd.

I'd like to ask for a statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Services about the impact of the proposed 6.5 per cent pay increase for NHS staff and its effect on clinical staff who are working in the voluntary sector. I know that the hospices are very concerned about how it will impact on their funding. I declare an interest as vice-president of City Hospice in Cardiff. And this concern has been expressed to me, and I believe they may have already written to the Cabinet Secretary about this issue. But, obviously, it is causing a lot of concern to hospices throughout Wales because it will be an additional amount of money onto their funding, and they are uncertain about whether that will automatically come from the health boards, who fund them. So, it would be helpful if we could have some clarification of that.

Hoffwn i ofyn am ddatganiad gan Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ar effaith y cynnydd arfaethedig o 6.5 y cant i gyflog staff y GIG a a'i effaith ar staff clinigol sy'n gweithio yn y sector gwirfoddol. Gwn fod yr hosbisau yn bryderus iawn ynghylch sut y bydd hyn yn effeithio ar eu cyllid. Rwy'n datgan buddiant fel Is-Lywydd Hosbis City yng Nghaerdydd. Mynegwyd y pryder hwn i mi, ac rwy'n credu y gallen nhw fod eisoes wedi ysgrifennu at Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet am y mater hwn. Ond, yn amlwg, mae'n achosi llawer o bryder i hosbisau ledled Cymru oherwydd bydd yn swm ychwanegol o arian i'w cyllid nhw, ac maent yn ansicr a fydd hyn yn dod yn awtomatig oddi wrth y byrddau iechyd sy'n eu hariannu. Felly, byddai'n ddefnyddiol pe gallem gael rhywfaint o eglurhad ar hynny.

The Cabinet Secretary has indicated to me that he is aware of the issue and is about to write to you about it.FootnoteLink

Mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet wedi nodi ei fod yn ymwybodol o'r mater ac mae wrthi'n ysgrifennu atoch yn ei gylch.FootnoteLink

Thank you very much. And just to add, I am fully in support of Simon Thomas's issue that he raised about the Windrush generation.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. A hoffwn ychwanegu hefyd fy mod yn hollol gefnogol o'r mater a gododd Simon Thomas am y genhedlaeth Windrush.

Can I call for two statements, please, from the leader of the house? The first is in support, really, of John Griffiths's call for a statement on road safety. The leader of the house will be aware that there's significant concern in my own constituency around speeding on the Evo triangle, which is a triangular route in Conwy and Denbighshire that has been the scene of many deaths and a number of accidents in recent years. Now, to be fair to the Welsh Government, funding has been made available for the local authorities to bring forward some road safety measures on that route, with the installation of average speed cameras, but I think my constituents are very keen to have an update on whether there's been any progress towards that end, and a statement on road safety would afford them an opportunity to have an update.

And, secondly, can I call for a statement on skin camouflage services in Wales? The leader of the house may not be aware but, of course, skin camouflage services are a very important provision, particularly for those with skin conditions or those who've suffered disfigurement following accidents or illnesses, in terms of supporting their self-confidence and independence. But the skin camouflage services that are currently provided in Wales—or that were provided in Wales—have just recently ceased. These were provided by an organisation called Changing Faces, and it has withdrawn its services from both Wales and Northern Ireland because it's been unable to come up with funding arrangements to continue them, because of the different ways that the NHS approaches these services here. That's given a cause of great concern for a number of people in my own constituency who've benefited from these services in the past, and there's currently no service available other than for them to pay privately in order to access skin camouflage services. So, I would be grateful if there could be a statement on this, and I'm sure that the Welsh Government would not want people to be in that position. Thank you.

A gaf i alw am ddau ddatganiad, os gwelwch yn dda, gan arweinydd y tŷ? Y cyntaf yw cefnogi'r alwad gan John Griffiths am ddatganiad ar ddiogelwch ffyrdd. Bydd arweinydd y tŷ yn ymwybodol bod pryder sylweddol yn fy etholaeth i ynghylch goryrru ar y triongl Evo, sef llwybr drionglog yng Nghonwy a Sir Ddinbych sydd wedi bod yn fan lle cafwyd llawer o farwolaethau a nifer o ddamweiniau yn y blynyddoedd diwethaf. Nawr, er tegwch i Lywodraeth Cymru, mae cyllid wedi ei sicrhau fel y gall yr awdurdodau lleol gyflwyno rhai mesurau diogelwch ffyrdd ar y llwybr hwnnw, gan osod camerâu cyflymder cyfartalog. Ond rwy'n credu bod fy etholwyr yn awyddus iawn i gael y diweddaraf am unrhyw gynnydd o ran hynny, a byddai datganiad ar ddiogelwch ffyrdd yn gyfle iddyn nhw gael diweddariad.

Ac, yn ail, a gaf i alw am ddatganiad ar wasanaethau cuddliw croen yng Nghymru? Efallai na fydd arweinydd y tŷ yn ymwybodol  o hyn ond, wrth gwrs, mae gwasanaethau cuddliw croen yn ddarpariaeth bwysig iawn, yn arbennig ar gyfer y rhai â chyflyrau'r croen neu'r rhai sydd wedi dioddef anffurfiad yn dilyn damwain neu salwch, er mwyn cynorthwyo gyda'u hunanhyder a'u hannibyniaeth. Ond mae'r gwasanaethau croen cuddliw a ddarperir yng Nghymru ar hyn o bryd—neu a ddarparwyd yng Nghymru— newydd ddod i ben yn ddiweddar. Darparwyd y rhain gan sefydliad o'r enw Changing Faces, ac mae wedi rhoi'r gorau i'w wasanaethau yng Nghymru a Gogledd Iwerddon gan na llwyddodd i sicrhau trefniadau cyllido i barhau â nhw, oherwydd y gwahanol ffyrdd y mae'r GIG yn ymdrin â'r gwasanaethau hyn yma. Mae wedi bod yn achos pryder mawr i nifer o bobl yn fy etholaeth i sydd wedi manteisio ar y gwasanaethau hyn yn y gorffennol, ac ar hyn o bryd does dim gwasanaeth ar gael iddynt ar wahân i dalu'n breifat er mwyn cael gwasanaethau cuddliw croen. Felly, byddwn i'n ddiolchgar pe gellid cael datganiad ar hyn, ac rwy'n siŵr na fyddai Llywodraeth Cymru yn dymuno i bobl fod yn y sefyllfa honno. Diolch.

On the first, as you heard me say, I know there's a piece of research that's due to report back—that's been done by the Department for Transport—this summer. I know the Welsh Government's looking at that, and a number of other pieces of research, with a view to seeing what can be done with the new powers. So, I certainly hear you make the same points as John Griffiths did earlier.

On the second point, I was not aware of that. The Cabinet Secretary is indicating to me that, if you supply him with details, he'd be very happy to look at it.

Ar y cyntaf, fel y clywsoch fi'n dweud, gwn fod darn o waith ymchwil y disgwylir adroddiad arno—mae hynny'n cael ei wneud gan yr Adran Trafnidiaeth—yr haf hwn. Gwn fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn edrych ar hynny, a nifer o ddarnau eraill o ymchwil, gyda'r bwriad o weld beth y gellir ei wneud gyda'r pwerau newydd. Felly, yn sicr rwy'n eich clywed chi yn gwneud yr un pwyntiau a wnaeth John Griffiths yn gynharach.

Ar yr ail bwynt, nid oeddwn yn ymwybodol o hynny. Mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn rhoi arwydd imi, os rhowch fanylion iddo, y byddai'n hapus iawn i edrych ar y mater.

Leader of the house, you will be aware of the disappointment in Swansea following the decision by health boards across Wales to approve the siting of a new major trauma centre for south Wales in Cardiff, at the expense of a very strong bid from Morriston Hospital in Swansea. Now, not all of Abertawe Bro Morgannwg health board members agreed to this proposal, however; the vote was not unanimous. One board member, Professor Ceri Phillips of Swansea University, has claimed that the whole process was, and I quote, 'fundamentally flawed', because the cost of creating the centre and network was not known at the time the decision was made. He also stated that the decision, and I quote again,

'smacks of politics trumping economics again'.

Now, given the strategic importance of this major trauma centre, and the concerns in south-west Wales on yet another decision to centralise a service in Cardiff at the expense of Swansea, will your Government be prepared to bring forward a debate on this matter so that we can scrutinise the issue in detail and address the pretext that this is a clinical decision, when actually, in fact, it's a political decision? 

Arweinydd y tŷ, byddwch yn ymwybodol o'r siom yn Abertawe yn dilyn y penderfyniad gan y byrddau iechyd ledled Cymru i gymeradwyo lleoliad canolfan trawma mawr newydd ar gyfer y de yng Nghaerdydd, ar draul cais cryf iawn gan Ysbyty Treforys yn Abertawe. Nawr, ni chytunodd pob un o aelodau Bwrdd Iechyd Abertawe Bro Morgannwg i'r cynnig hwn, fodd bynnag; nid oedd y bleidlais yn unfrydol. Mae un aelod o'r Bwrdd, yr Athro Ceri Phillips o Brifysgol Abertawe, wedi honni bod y broses gyfan, ac rwy'n dyfynnu, 'yn sylfaenol ddiffygiol', oherwydd nid oedd y gost o greu canolfan a rhwydwaith yn hysbys ar adeg gwneud y penderfyniad. Dywedodd hefyd fod y penderfyniad, ac rwy'n dyfynnu  unwaith eto,

'yn awgrymu bod gwleidyddiaeth yn curo economeg eto'.

Nawr, o gofio pwysigrwydd strategol y ganolfan trawma fawr hon, a phryderon yn y de-orllewin am benderfyniad arall i ganoli'r gwasanaeth yng Nghaerdydd ar draul Abertawe, a fydd eich Llywodraeth yn barod i gyflwyno dadl ar y mater hwn fel y gallwn ni graffu ar y mater yn fanwl a mynd i'r afael â'r esgus bod hwn yn benderfyniad clinigol pan, mewn gwirionedd, mae'n benderfyniad gwleidyddol?

14:40

Yes, the Cabinet Secretary is indicating to me that he's intending to make a statement at the end of the process, when the process has run its course. Can I say, Presiding Officer, I want to declare an interest in this because, obviously, my constituency is one of those most affected by this decision?  

Ydy, mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn rhoi arwydd imi ei fod yn bwriadu gwneud datganiad ar ddiwedd y broses, pan fydd y broses wedi rhedeg ei gwrs. A gaf i ddweud, Llywydd, yr hoffwn i ddatgan buddiant yn hyn o beth oherwydd, yn amlwg, mae fy etholaeth i yn un o'r rhai yr effeithir fwyaf arnyn nhw gan y penderfyniad hwn?

I will only ask for one statement. Can I ask for a statement on the social implications for the people of Wales and in respect of access to justice of the Tory Government's court closure programme? And can I just remind you of the particular courts that I'm concerned with that the Tories have closed: Abertillery, Rhondda, Caernarfon, Aberdare, Barry, Carmarthen, Port Talbot, Pwllheli, Aberaeron, Newport, Llandrindod Wells, Neath, Port Talbot, Pontypool, Flint, Bridgend, Pontypridd, Swansea, Holyhead, and I think there maybe one or two I have missed? Could I also ask for some consideration to be given to the fact that, for example, a valuable site such as the Pontypridd magistrates court seems to have been sold or dispensed with for the sake of £350,000? But it seems to me that access to justice is being increasingly denied. That has serious implications for the people of Wales and for many of our communities and we need to have a debate on this issue.   

Gofynnaf am un datganiad yn unig. A gaf i ofyn am ddatganiad ar oblygiadau cymdeithasol y rhaglen cau Llysoedd sydd gan Lywodraeth y Torïaid ar gyfer pobl Cymru ac o ran cael mynediad i'r system cyfiawnder? A gaf i eich atgoffa am y llysoedd penodol yr wyf yn sôn amdanynt a gafodd eu cau gan y Torïaid: Abertyleri, y Rhondda, Caernarfon, Aberdâr, y Barri, Caerfyrddin, Port Talbot, Pwllheli, Aberaeron, Casnewydd, Llandrindod, Castell-nedd Port Talbot, Pont-y-pŵl, y Fflint, Ogwr, Pontypridd, Abertawe, Caergybi, ac rwy'n credu o bosib bod un neu ddau yr wyf wedi eu methu? A gaf i hefyd ofyn am roi ystyriaeth i'r ffaith yr ymddengys, er enghraifft, bod safle gwerthfawr megis llys ynadon Pontypridd wedi ei werthu neu ei waredu am £350,000? Ond ymddengys i mi y gwrthodir mynediad i'r system cyfiawnder yn gynyddol. Mae goblygiadau difrifol i bobl Cymru ac i lawer o'n cymunedau ac mae angen inni gael dadl ar y mater hwn.

Yes, the Member raises a very important point. My understanding is that 26 court buildings in Wales have been sold since 2010 and their receipts total just over £5.5 million. The Government is extremely concerned that we keep access to justice locally in Wales and we've made those points to the UK Government on a number of occasions. I know that the Cabinet Secretary who's responsible for this—who is Alun Davies—is working very closely on this with the Ministry of Justice in developing a justice policy for Wales. We all know that it's essential in a democracy that people have recourse to the rule of law swiftly, locally and easily and are not prohibited from that by centralising decisions that take that ability out of their hands. We are very concerned about it, and I know the Cabinet Secretary is very actively pursuing a policy of attempting to understand what the overarching strategy is, because it's not entirely clear to us.  

Ydy, mae'r Aelod yn codi pwynt pwysig iawn. Fy nealltwriaeth i yw y gwerthwyd 26 o adeiladau llys yng Nghymru ers 2010 a chyfanswm eu derbyniadau yw ychydig dros £5.5 miliwn. Mae'r Llywodraeth yn bryderus iawn ac am gadw mynediad i'r system cyfiawnder yn lleol yng Nghymru ac rydym wedi gwneud y pwyntiau hynny i Lywodraeth y DU ar sawl achlysur. Gwn fod yr Ysgrifennydd Cabinet sy'n gyfrifol am hyn—sef Alun Davies—yn gweithio'n agos iawn ar hyn gyda'r Weinyddiaeth Gyfiawnder i ddatblygu polisi cyfiawnder i Gymru. Rydym i gyd yn gwybod ei bod yn hanfodol mewn democratiaeth bod pobl yn gallu troi at reol y gyfraith yn gyflym, yn lleol ac yn hawdd ac nad ydynt yn cael eu hatal gan benderfyniadau a wneir yn ganolog sy'n tynnu'r gallu hwnnw oddi wrthynt. Rydym ni'n bryderus iawn am y peth, a gwn fod Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn benderfynol iawn o geisio deall beth yw'r strategaeth gyffredinol, oherwydd nid yw'n gwbl eglur i ni.

I wonder if I could request a fairly urgent oral statement from the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Services please on the role of fire co-responders? Since the red categorisation has been narrowed as regards the number of conditions that are within it, if you like, the role of co-responders in attending amber calls has become far more critical in my view, particularly in attending those calls that I think most of us would consider very serious and probably should be included in the red category. The Cabinet Secretary will be aware of one particular occasion where, actually, co-responders weren't called and with the very saddest of consequences. 

To me, it's actually inconceivable that the ambulance trust is now considering reducing the role of co-responders to being only able to attend red categorisation calls, which limits the work that they're able to do, considering their expertise, to a very small number of cases. I'd be grateful if he could consider having a statement on that sooner rather than later, because I know the Assembly's concerned about the categorisation generally but co-responders very specifically. Thank you. 

Tybed a gaf i ofyn am ddatganiad llafar digon brys gan Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol, os gwelwch yn dda, ar swyddogaeth y cyd-ymatebwyr tân? Ers i'r categori coch gael ei leihau o ran nifer yr amodau sydd ynddo, os mynnwch, mae swyddogaeth y cyd-ymatebwyr wrth fynd i alwadau ambr wedi dod yn llawer mwy tyngedfennol, yn fy marn i, yn enwedig wrth fynd i'r galwadau hynny y byddai'r rhan fwyaf ohonom yn eu hystyried yn ddifrifol iawn ac y dylid, yn ôl pob tebyg, eu cynnwys yn y categori coch. Bydd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn ymwybodol o un achlysur penodol pan na chafodd cyd-ymatebwyr eu galw ac arweiniodd hynny at y canlyniadau mwyaf trist.

I mi, mae'n annirnadwy mewn gwirionedd fod yr ymddiriedolaeth ambiwlans bellach yn ystyried lleihau swyddogaeth y cyd-ymatebwyr i allu mynd i alwadau categori coch yn unig, sy'n cyfyngu ar y gwaith y maen nhw'n gallu ei wneud, o ystyried eu harbenigedd, i nifer fach iawn o achosion. Byddwn i'n ddiolchgar pe gallai ef ystyried cael datganiad ar hynny gorau po gyntaf oherwydd fy mod i'n gwybod bod y Cynulliad yn poeni am gategoreiddio yn gyffredinol ond yn benodol iawn am gyd-ymatebwyr. Diolch.

Yes, the Cabinet Secretary is indicating to me that he's going to ask the ambulance trust to write to all Members and explain what the situation is exactly. 

Ydy, mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn rhoi arwydd imi ei fod yn mynd i ofyn i'r ymddiriedolaeth ambiwlans ysgrifennu at bob Aelod ac egluro beth yw'r sefyllfa yn union.

Mi hoffwn i ofyn am ddau ddatganiad, os caf, a'r cyntaf gan Weinidog yr Amgylchedd ar yr ymateb i'r llifogydd yn Ynys Môn ym mis Tachwedd? Un o'r camau gweithredu pwysicaf i'w gymryd yn achos llifogydd Llangefni, yn sicr, oedd bod monitro yn digwydd rŵan er mwyn deall sut mae'r afon Cefni yn ymddwyn ac er mwyn gallu cynllunio camau gwrth-lifogydd. Rydw i'n deall bod gweithwyr Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, oedd fod i wneud y gwaith monitro yna, rŵan wedi cael eu tynnu yn ôl i weithio ar rannau eraill o waith yr asiantaeth. Nid wyf i'n credu bod hynny'n dderbyniol, oherwydd heb wneud y monitro rŵan, mae'r bobl leol yn mynd i barhau i fyw mewn ofn bod y gawod law nesaf yn mynd i greu'r un math o ddinistr eto. Felly, a gaf i ddatganiad gan y Gweinidog i egluro'n union beth sy'n digwydd ac i gael y math o sicrwydd mae pobl yn yr ardal yna'n chwilio amdano fo?

Yr ail ddatganiad yr hoffwn i ydy un gan y Gweinidog sy'n gyfrifol am y Gymraeg. Mae cynghorwyr yn Ynys Môn yn hynod siomedig ar ôl cael eu gwahodd i swyddfeydd Llywodraeth Cymru i sesiwn panel adolygu annibynnol i drafod dyfodol cynghorau tref a chymuned. Maen nhw’n siomedig gan fod y gwahoddiad yn gofyn iddyn nhw ddweud ymlaen llaw os ydyn nhw am gyfrannu yn Gymraeg, ac os nad oes 10 y cant yn dweud ymlaen llaw eu bod nhw am wneud hynny, byddan nhw’n tybied eu bod nhw’n barod i gymryd rhan yn Saesneg. Rydym yn sôn yn fan hyn am gynghorwyr sy’n gweithredu yn Gymraeg yn eu gwaith dydd i ddydd yn eu cynghorau yn cael eu gwahodd i ddigwyddiad gan Lywodraeth Cymru ar stâd Llywodraeth Cymru. Nid wyf i’n credu bod hyn yn dderbyniol ac mi hoffwn i ddatganiad i egluro beth yn union ydy safbwynt y Llywodraeth ynglŷn â hyn.

I would like to ask for two statements, if I may—the first from the Minister for Environment on the response to the flooding in Anglesey in November. One of the most important action points to be taken in the case of the Llangefni floods, certainly, was that monitoring should now happen in order to understand how the river Cefni behaves so that we can plan flood prevention measures for the future. I understand that NRW staff who are supposed to carry out that monitoring work have been withdrawn to work on other aspects of the agency’s work. I don’t believe that that’s acceptable, because without that monitoring now, local people will continue to live in fear that future periods of rain will cause similar damage again. Therefore, I would seek a statement from the Minister to explain exactly what’s happening and to seek the assurances that people in that area are looking for.

The second statement I would like is one from the Minister responsible for the Welsh language. Councillors in Anglesey are extremely disappointed, having been invited to the Welsh Government offices to an independent review panel session to discuss the future of town and community councils. They are disappointed because the invitation asked them to state in advance if they wanted to contribute through the medium of Welsh, and unless 10 per cent stated beforehand that they wished to do so, they would assume that they were willing to participate through the medium of English. We are talking here about councillors who work through the medium of Welsh in their day-to-day activities within their councils being invited to an event hosted by the Welsh Government on the Welsh Government’s estate. I don’t think this is acceptable, and I would like a statement to explain exactly what the Government’s views on this are.

14:45

Well, on that second point, I wasn't aware of that myself, so I think if the Member would be prepared to send details to—it's actually the Cabinet Secretary for Local Government and Public Services who would be responsible for that. But to both him and the Cabinet Secretary, I'll undertake to make sure that we find out what happened there, because that sounds very strange indeed.

In terms of the first one, I think, if you highlight the specific circumstances in which you understand staff have been withdrawn, I'm sure the Minister will look into the very specific circumstances. She's about to make a statement this afternoon on the environment more generally, which I'm sure will afford you the opportunity to ask the question directly.

Wel, ar yr ail bwynt hwnnw, doeddwn i ddim yn ymwybodol o hynny fy hun, felly rwy'n credu, pe byddai'r Aelod yn barod i anfon manylion at—mewn gwirionedd Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet dros Lywodraeth Leol a Gwasanaethau Cyhoeddus fyddai'n gyfrifol am hynny. Ond iddo ef ac i Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet, byddwn yn ymrwymo i wneud yn siŵr ein bod yn cael gwybod beth ddigwyddodd yno, oherwydd mae hynny'n swnio'n rhyfedd iawn.

O ran yr un cyntaf, rwy'n credu, os byddwch chi'n amlygu'r amgylchiadau penodol pam y cafodd staff eu tynnu yn ôl, rwy'n siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog yn rhoi ystyriaeth i'r amgylchiadau penodol hynny. Mae hi ar fin gwneud datganiad y prynhawn yma ar yr amgylchedd yn fwy cyffredinol, ac rwy'n siŵr y cewch gyfle i ofyn y cwestiwn yn uniongyrchol.

Leader of the house, during the Easter recess, it was my pleasure to welcome the Minister for children, Huw Irranca-Davies to the Oaklands play area in Cilfynydd to see how Rhondda Cynon Taf council have worked with local residents to make the play area inclusive for those with additional needs, and also to discuss what steps the Welsh Government could take to promote inclusive play following on from my legislative proposal earlier this year. Will there be a chance for the Welsh Government to update AMs on measures to improve inclusive play during this Assembly term?

Arweinydd y tŷ, yn ystod toriad y Pasg, cefais y pleser o groesawu'r Gweinidog dros blant, Huw Irranca-Davies i faes chwarae Oaklands yng Nghilfynydd i weld sut mae Cyngor Rhondda Cynon Taf wedi gweithio gyda thrigolion lleol i wneud y maes chwarae'n gynhwysol ar gyfer y rhai hynny sydd ag anghenion ychwanegol, a hefyd i drafod pa gamau y gallai Llywodraeth Cymru eu cymryd i hyrwyddo chwarae cynhwysol sy'n dilyn fy nghynnig deddfwriaethol yn gynharach eleni. A fydd cyfle i Lywodraeth Cymru roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i Aelodau'r Cynulliad ar fesurau i wella chwarae cynhwysol yn ystod tymor y Cynulliad hwn?

Yes, I know the Minister was delighted to visit the Oaklands play area in Cilfynydd during half term, and to have the opportunity to see the difference that investment in accessible play facilities can make to children and young people. There were a number of follow-up actions agreed on the back of the debate on your legislative proposal earlier in the year, and I know that the Minister for children will be happy, in due course, to update AMs on all of the measures being taken forward to improve inclusive play during this Assembly term.

Ie, rwy'n gwybod bod y Gweinidog yn falch iawn o ymweld â maes chwarae Oaklands yng Nghilfynydd yn ystod yr hanner tymor, a chael cyfle i weld y gwahaniaeth y gall buddsoddi mewn cyfleusterau chwarae hygyrch ei wneud i blant a phobl ifanc. Roedd nifer o gamau dilynol y cytunwyd arnyn nhw ar ôl y ddadl ar eich cynnig deddfwriaethol yn gynharach yn y flwyddyn, a gwn y bydd y Gweinidog dros blant yn hapus, maes o law, i roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i Aelodau'r Cynulliad ar bob un o'r camau a gyflwynir i wella chwarae cynhwysol yn ystod tymor y Cynulliad hwn.

Leader of the Chamber, I would like a Government statement on the First Minister offering his support for the bombing in Syria. It seems that international chemical weapons inspectors are going to investigate in Douma tomorrow to report on what has happened there, but personnel, possibly from Wales, have already been sent to bomb Syria before the investigation has taken place, and the First Minister of Wales supported it.

In Westminster, your Labour colleagues are talking about a war powers Act to democratically limit military action, possibly. So, what's the policy in Wales? Is it that the First Minister just says what he likes on behalf of the Government? I've spoken before about your very selective approach to what you will speak on in terms of foreign policy. You've had little to say, if anything, about the Kurds—nothing, in fact—and nothing to say on behalf of the Yemeni community in Wales. So, what I'd like, really, is some clarity from your Government. So, can you please make a statement on the First Minister's actions in supporting the military action in Syria as First Minister?

Arweinydd y Siambr, hoffwn i gael datganiad Llywodraeth ar y cynnig o gefnogaeth a wnaed gan Brif Weinidog Cymru i'r bomio yn Syria. Mae'n ymddangos bod arolygwyr arfau cemegol rhyngwladol yn mynd i ymchwilio yn Douma yfory i adrodd ar yr hyn sydd wedi digwydd yno. Ond mae personél, o bosib o Gymru, eisoes wedi'u hanfon i fomio Syria cyn i'r ymchwiliad gael ei gynnal, a chefnogodd Prif Weinidog Cymru hynny.

Yn San Steffan, mae eich cyd-Aelodau Llafur yn sôn am Ddeddf pwerau rhyfel i gyfyngu ar weithredu milwrol yn ddemocrataidd, o bosib. Felly, beth yw'r polisi yng Nghymru? Ai dweud yr hyn y mae ei eisiau ar ran y Llywodraeth y mae'r Prif Weinidog? Rwyf wedi siarad yn flaenorol am eich dull detholus iawn o ran yr hyn y byddwch chi'n siarad amdano ar bolisi tramor. Rydych chi wedi cael fawr ddim i'w ddweud, os unrhyw beth, am y Cwrdiaid—dim byd o gwbl, mewn gwirionedd—a dim byd i'w ddweud ar ran y gymuned Yemeni yng Nghymru. Felly, beth fyddwn i'n ei hoffi, yn wir, yw rhywfaint o eglurder gan eich Llywodraeth. Felly, a wnewch chi ddatganiad ar gamau Prif Weinidog Cymru yn cefnogi'r gweithredu milwrol yn Syria fel Prif Weinidog Cymru?

The Member will be very well aware that international foreign policy is not devolved to Wales. The First Minister answered questions about his phone call with the Prime Minister earlier on in First Minister's questions, and I don't have anything to add to that.

Bydd yr Aelod yn ymwybodol iawn nad yw polisi tramor rhyngwladol wedi'i ddatganoli i Gymru. Atebodd Prif Weinidog Cymru gwestiynau am ei alwad ffôn gyda Phrif Weinidog y DU yn gynharach yn y cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog, ac nid oes gennyf i unrhyw beth i'w ychwanegu at hynny.

I think, leader of the house, Wales has been regarded as a world leader in promoting equality and human rights. We now have the opportunity to progress further by commencing the 2010 Equality Act's socioeconomic duty, with the power devolved on 1 April. So, will you join me in congratulating Harriet Harman, former deputy leader of the Labour Party, who got this power on the statute book, alongside the gender pay gap provisions of the Act? The socioeconomic duty would require public bodies to make decisions on the way they tackle inequalities of outcomes caused by socioeconomic disadvantage. Will the Welsh Government now consider commencing this duty? 

Can I also ask, leader of the house, if we could have an update? We're awaiting the outcome of the environment Minister's consideration of the environmental impact assessment relating to the biomass incinerator. I'm aware that the company has commented on the request for an EIA. In the interests of transparency, I would like to ask for their response to be published and a decision date from the Minister to be given. Thank you.

Rwy'n credu, arweinydd y tŷ, bod Cymru wedi'i hystyried fel arweinydd y byd o ran hyrwyddo cydraddoldeb a hawliau dynol. Mae gennym gyfle bellach i wneud cynnydd eto trwy gychwyn dyletswydd economaidd-gymdeithasol Deddf Cydraddoldeb 2010, a fydd yn bŵer datganoledig ar 1 Ebrill. Felly, a wnewch chi ymuno â mi i longyfarch Harriet Harman, cyn-Ddirprwy Arweinydd y Blaid Lafur, sydd wedi sicrhau'r pŵer hwn ar y llyfr statud, ochr yn ochr â'r darpariaethau ar gyfer y bwlch cyflog rhwng y rhywiau yn y Ddeddf? Byddai'r ddyletswydd economaidd-gymdeithasol yn ei wneud yn ofynnol i gyrff cyhoeddus wneud penderfyniadau ar y ffordd y maen nhw'n mynd i'r afael ag anghydraddoldebau o ran canlyniadau a achosir gan anfantais economaidd-gymdeithasol. A fydd Llywodraeth Cymru nawr yn ystyried cychwyn y ddyletswydd hon?

A gaf i hefyd ofyn, arweinydd y tŷ, am ddiweddariad? Rydym ni'n disgwyl canlyniad ystyriaeth y Gweinidog dros yr amgylchedd o asesiad o'r effaith amgylcheddol sy'n ymwneud â'r llosgydd biomas. Rwy'n ymwybodol bod y cwmni wedi gwneud sylwadau ar y cais am asesiad o'r effaith amgylcheddol. Er budd tryloywder, hoffwn i ofyn am gyhoeddiad o'r ymateb ac am gael dyddiad penderfyniad gan y Gweinidog. Diolch.

14:50

Thank you for both of those. I'm obviously extremely happy to join you in acknowledging the contribution of Harriet Harman to the important legislation—we were all delighted when they managed to get it on the statute books—as well as in recognising the substantial part that socioeconomic inequality plays in exacerbating other forms of inequality. Indeed, the juxtaposition of those two sorts of inequality are very instrumental in some of the difficulties that people with protected characteristics experience across the UK.

We do have an opportunity now, as you identified, to look again at whether we should enact a socioeconomic duty in Wales. This is one of the issues we'll be considering in the context of the rapid review of gender equality that I've been talking about earlier in this session. We've also got the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, which is very relevant in this context, including the goal of a more equal Wales, and we want to carefully consider how the two play together and what additional duties or important responsibilities are necessary, if any, on Welsh public bodies and how those two things play together. We know that Scotland has recently taken the decision to enact their socioeconomic duty as the 'fairer Scotland duty', and we want to look more carefully at the backbone to their decision and the likely implications, just to inform our thinking of where we are in Wales. But it's very much an active part of the consideration at the moment of the rapid review that we're doing.

In terms of the Barry biomass plant, before we release a letter sent in by third parties, we are required to consult them, and I understand that this is now completed, so the letter can be released later today. The Welsh Government's currently considering the representations. We don't intend to set a deadline for a final decision on the environmental impact assessment, as a decision will require careful and full consideration of all of the issues to withstand legal challenges.

Diolch i chi am y ddau hynny. Rwy'n amlwg yn hapus iawn i ymuno â chi i gydnabod cyfraniad Harriet Harman i ddeddfwriaeth bwysig—roeddem ni'n falch iawn pan wnaethant lwyddo i fynd â hyn ar y llyfrau statud—yn ogystal â chydnabod y rhan sylweddol y mae anghydraddoldeb economaidd-gymdeithasol yn ei chwarae wrth wneud mathau eraill o anghydraddoldeb yn waeth. Yn wir, mae cyfosod y ddau fath hwn o anghydraddoldeb yn allweddol iawn i rai o'r anawsterau y mae pobl â nodweddion gwarchodedig yn cael profiad ohonyn nhw ledled y DU.

Mae gennym ni gyfle nawr, fel y nodwyd gennych chi, i edrych eto ar a ddylem ni ddeddfu ar ddyletswydd economaidd-gymdeithasol yng Nghymru. Mae hwn yn un o'r materion y byddwn ni'n eu hystyried yng nghyd-destun yr adolygiad cyflym o gydraddoldeb rhwng y rhywiau y soniais amdano yn gynharach yn y sesiwn hon. Hefyd, mae gennym ni Ddeddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015, sydd yn berthnasol iawn yn y cyd-destun hwn, gan gynnwys y nod o greu Cymru fwy cyfartal, ac rydym ni eisiau ystyried yn ofalus sut mae'r ddau yn cyd-chwarae a pha ddyletswyddau ychwanegol neu gyfrifoldebau pwysig sydd eu hangen, os o gwbl, ar gyrff cyhoeddus Cymru a sut mae'r ddau beth yn cyd-chwarae. Gwyddom fod yr Alban wedi gwneud y penderfyniad yn ddiweddar i ddeddfu ar ei dyletswydd economaidd-gymdeithasol fel 'dyletswydd yr Alban decach'. Rydym ni eisiau edrych yn fwy gofalus ar sylfaen eu penderfyniad a'r goblygiadau tebygol, er mwyn goleuo ein syniadau am y sefyllfa yng Nghymru. Ond mae hyn, i raddau helaeth, yn rhan weithredol o ystyriaeth bresennol yr adolygiad cyflym yr ydym ni'n ei wneud.

O ran gosodiad biomas y Barri, cyn i ni ryddhau llythyr a anfonir gan drydydd parti, mae'n ofynnol inni ymgynghori â nhw. Deallaf fod hwn wedi ei gwblhau erbyn hyn, felly caiff y llythyr ei ryddhau yn ddiweddarach heddiw. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ystyried y sylwadau ar hyn o bryd. Dydyn ni ddim yn bwriadu pennu terfyn amser ar gyfer penderfyniad terfynol ar yr asesiad o'r effaith amgylcheddol, gan y bydd penderfyniad yn gofyn am ystyriaeth ofalus a llawn o'r holl faterion er mwyn gwrthsefyll heriau cyfreithiol.

Stereo—I think we're picking up Radio Wales over there, aren't we, Simon? [Laughter.]

Two things, if I may, Presiding Officer. First of all, earlier, Darren Millar asked the leader of the house about the problem with the withdrawal of camouflage services for those suffering from skin conditions. I thought it was a good opportunity to advertise the cross-party group on skin, which is taking place next Tuesday, to which all are welcome, and which should be a good opportunity to raise that issue. I know, in the past, we've raised issues like that and then communicated with the Minister as well, who's always very helpful.

Secondly, I asked before the Easter recess if we could have a statement on the trunk road programme and where we were with proposed improvements right across Wales. I think you said then that that would be with us before the summer recess, from my memory, so I just want to make another plea for that statement not to fall into the abyss beyond the summer recess. Over the Easter recess, I was called to two issues—to one problem with flooding on the A4042 between Abergavenny and Pontypool. A major piece of infrastructure, which is going to become more important with the development of the critical care centre in Cwmbran—rightly important that ambulances and emergency vehicles are able to traverse that piece of road. Secondly, another issue I raised with you and the Cabinet Secretary in the past is that of the A40 between Abergavenny and Raglan—a degrading, old concrete road surface. Up until now—I know a lot of funding is going into the Heads of the Valleys road, so maybe the eye has been off the ball with these two pieces of road that I mentioned hitherto, but they are equally important pieces of road infrastructure, so I'd be grateful if you could keep the pressure up on your colleague to make sure that we do have that statement on improvements to the trunk road network in Wales before the summer.

Stereo — rwy'n credu ein bod yn codi Radio Wales draw fanna, ydyn ni, Simon? [Chwerthin.]

Dau beth, os gaf i, Llywydd. Yn gyntaf oll, yn gynharach, gofynnodd Darren Millar i arweinydd y tŷ am y broblem gyda dileu'r gwasanaethau cuddliw ar gyfer y rhai sy'n dioddef o gyflyrau croen. Roeddwn i'n credu bod hyn yn gyfle da i hysbysebu'r grŵp traws-bleidiol ar y croen, a fydd yn cyfarfod ddydd Mawrth nesaf. Mae croeso i bawb, a dylai fod yn gyfle da i godi'r mater hwnnw. Yn y gorffennol, gwn ein bod ni wedi codi materion fel hynny a chyfathrebu â'r Gweinidog hefyd, sydd bob amser yn ddefnyddiol iawn.

Yn ail, gofynnais cyn toriad y Pasg a fyddai modd cael datganiad ar y rhaglen cefnffyrdd a'r sefyllfa gyda'r gwelliannau arfaethedig ledled Cymru. Credaf ichi ddweud wedyn y byddai hynny gyda ni cyn toriad yr haf, o'm cof i, felly hoffwn i wneud apêl arall na fydd y datganiad hwnnw'n disgyn dros y dibyn y tu hwnt i doriad yr haf. Dros doriad y Pasg, cefais fy ngalw i ymdrin â dau fater —un broblem gyda llifogydd ar yr A4042 rhwng y Fenni a Phont-y-pŵl. Darn mawr o seilwaith, a fydd yn dod yn fwy pwysig gyda datblygiad y ganolfan gofal critigol yng Nghwmbrân—ac mae'n bwysig iawn bod ambiwlansys a cerbydau brys yn gallu croesi’r darn hwnnw o ffordd. Yn ail, mater arall yr wyf wedi ei godi gyda chi ac Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet yn y gorffennol, yw mater yr A40 rhwng Raglan a'r Fenni—hen wyneb ffordd goncrit sy'n dirwyo. Hyd yn hyn—rwy'n gwybod bod llawer o arian yn mynd i ffordd Blaenau'r Cymoedd, felly efallai bod y llygad wedi bod oddi ar y bêl gyda'r ddau ddarn hyn o ffordd y soniais amdanyn nhw hyd yn hyn, ond maen nhw'n ddarnau o seilwaith ffyrdd sydd yr un mor bwysig. Felly byddwn i'n ddiolchgar pe gallech roi pwysau ar eich cyd-Aelod i wneud yn siŵr bod gennym ni'r datganiad hwnnw ar welliannau i'r rhwydwaith cefnffyrdd yng Nghymru cyn yr haf.

Yes, on that second one—absolutely, we are expecting to have a statement before the end of the summer term, before we enter the summer recess, on the road trunk network in Wales.

I absolutely take your point on the skin, and I didn't know there was a cross-party group, so it's good to be reminded of that, and the Cabinet Secretary has already undertaken to write back to Darren Millar once he has the details.

Ie, ar yr ail un—yn sicr, rydym ni'n disgwyl cael datganiad cyn diwedd tymor yr haf, cyn inni ddechrau toriad yr haf, ar y rhwydwaith cefnffyrdd yng Nghymru.

Rwy'n deall yn llwyr eich pwynt o ran y croen, a doeddwn i ddim yn gwybod bod yna grŵp trawsbleidiol, felly mae'n beth da cael fy atgoffa o hynny. Mae Ysgrifennydd y Cabinet eisoes wedi cytuno i ysgrifennu yn ôl at Darren Millar ar ôl iddo gael y manylion.

And, finally, Jenny Rathbone.

Ac, yn olaf, Jenny Rathbone.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. I just wanted to add my support for Simon Thomas's call for a statement on the disgraceful scandal of the treatment of the Windrush generation, and I just wanted to add some additional points. It is a reminder of the endemic racism in our society. I don't recall reading of any people from New Zealand or Australia being caught up in the way the immigration rules have been changed, and we have to remind ourselves that the people who have been treated so disgracefully are people who were unable to regularise, formalise, their right to remain, because they didn't have the money to apply for a passport, never mind the money to go back and visit family in the place they originally were born.

There's a particular issue that I'm very concerned about, which is the right to family life. Some people decided to go back to the Caribbean or elsewhere when they retired, and they now find themselves unable to visit their children and grandchildren because of the draconian immigration laws. One of my constituents, who died recently, was unable—they were unable to organise his funeral for a whole month after his death, simply because of the difficulties of people coming from Trinidad. And this applies even more acutely when we are dealing with the Asian community who, in general, wish to bury their loved one within 48 hours. It's just ridiculous that people cannot attend the funerals of their close relatives because of the barriers that are put upon them by the immigration service. So, I wondered if you are able, in this statement, to include some indication of the numbers involved who live in Wales, and what the UK Government might now be prepared to do in the light of the exposure that this scandal has raised on this issue, and hopefully we can have a more humane immigration policy.

Diolch i chi, Llywydd. Rwy'n dymuno ychwanegu fy nghefnogaeth i alwad Simon Thomas am ddatganiad ar y sgandal gwarthus o driniaeth y genhedlaeth Windrush, ac roeddwn i'n dymuno gwneud rhai pwyntiau ychwanegol. Mae'n ein hatgoffa o'r hiliaeth endemig yn ein cymdeithas. Nid wyf yn cofio darllen am unrhyw bobl o Awstralia neu Seland Newydd yn cael eu dal oherwydd y modd y newidiwyd y rheolau mewnfudo, ac mae'n rhaid inni atgoffa ein hunain bod y bobl sydd wedi cael eu trin mor warthus yn bobl nad oedden nhw'n gallu rheoleiddio na ffurfioli eu hawl i aros, gan nad oedd ganddyn nhw'r arian i wneud cais am basbort, heb sôn am arian i fynd yn ôl ac ymweld â theulu yn y lle y cawsant eu geni'n wreiddiol.

Mae un mater penodol yn fy mhoeni'n fawr, a hwnnw yw'r hawl i fywyd teuluol. Penderfynodd rhai pobl fynd yn ôl i'r Caribî neu i fannau eraill wrth iddyn nhw ymddeol, ac erbyn hyn maen nhw'n canfod nad ydyn nhw'n gallu ymweld â'u plant a'u hwyrion oherwydd deddfau mewnfudo llym. Yn achos un o'm hetholwyr, a fu farw yn ddiweddar— nid oedden nhw'n gallu trefnu ei angladd am fis cyfan ar ôl ei farwolaeth, oherwydd yr anawsterau i bobl a oedd yn dod o Trinidad. Ac mae hyn hyd yn oed yn fwy perthnasol pan fyddwn ni'n sôn am y gymuned Asiaidd sydd, yn gyffredinol, yn dymuno claddu eu hanwyliaid o fewn 48 awr. Mae'n chwerthinllyd na all pobl fynd i angladd eu perthnasau agos oherwydd y rhwystrau a roddir arnynt gan y gwasanaeth mewnfudo. Felly, tybed a allwch chi, yn y datganiad hwn, gynnwys rhyw syniad o nifer y rhai yr effeithir arnyn nhw sy'n byw yng Nghymru, a beth allai Llywodraeth y DU fod yn barod i'w wneud bellach yng ngoleuni'r datguddiad a godwyd gan y sgandal hwn, a gobeithio y gallwn ni gael polisi mewnfudo sy'n fwy trugarog.

14:55

Well, as I said in response to Simon Thomas, we did write expressing our serious concerns about the treatment of people who came from Commonwealth countries. I do think it's worth observing, Llywydd, that it's not just the people who came over on the Empire Windrush, of course; it's the people who came from all Commonwealth countries as a result of a plea from Britain after the war to come and help rebuild the 'mother country', as it was very much then called. Unfortunately, it's not possible to know how many people there are, because no documentation was issued at the time, after the Immigration Act 1971, and a large number of people who didn't travel abroad, for whatever reason, saw no reason to regularise their situation, and why would they? It's only recently, as a result of the hostile environment, which has now been renamed 'the compliance environment' by the UK Government, that people are now being asked to produce paperwork in order to sign leases and to get access to normal, day-to-day, routine things. Unfortunately, we do not know how many of them exist and are affected in Wales.

The Home Secretary, as a result of a very large amount of pressure, including from the Welsh Government, has announced new measures, I'm pleased to say, which do include: a taskforce dedicated to helping those affected; plans to work with departments across the Government to gather evidence on behalf of immigrants—documentation for every year is usually expected, such as bank statements or pay slips, but any of you will know how difficult it is to do that, especially in an electronic age where banks don't keep them past two or three years—a pledge that all cases will be resolved in two weeks, which, I mean, I would that it were so; that all fees for new documentation are waived so that people are not out of pocket, and those normally cost around £229, I'm told; and that a new website is set up with confirmation and a direct contact point. There were a number of other statements made, but we are aware, as well, that some people have actually been deported. We continue to seek assurances from the UK Government that everybody who has been poorly treated as a result of this appalling situation will receive the redress they're entitled to. 

Wel, fel y dywedais wrth ymateb i Simon Thomas, fe wnaethom ni ysgrifennu yn mynegi ein pryderon difrifol ynglŷn â'r driniaeth o bobl a ddaeth o wledydd y Gymanwlad. Rwyf yn credu ei bod hi'n werth dweud, Llywydd, bod a wnelo hyn nid yn unig â'r bobl a ddaeth gyntaf o wledydd yr Ymerodraeth, wrth gwrs; ond â'r bobl a ddaeth o holl wledydd y Gymanwlad o ganlyniad i apêl gan Brydain ar ôl y rhyfel i helpu ailadeiladu'r 'famwlad', fel y gelwid hi bryd hynny i raddau helaeth. Yn anffodus, nid yw hi'n bosib gwybod faint o bobl sydd yna, oherwydd ni chyhoeddwyd unrhyw ddogfennau ar y pryd, ar ôl Deddf Mewnfudo 1971, ac nid oedd nifer fawr o bobl nad oeddent yn teithio dramor, am ba reswm bynnag, yn gweld unrhyw reswm i reoleiddio eu sefyllfa, a pam fydden nhw? Dim ond yn ddiweddar, yn sgil yr hinsawdd elyniaethus, sydd bellach wedi ei ailenwi'n 'hinsawdd gydymffurfio' gan Lywodraeth y DU, y gofynnir i bobl bellach ddangos gwaith papur er mwyn llofnodi prydlesi ac i allu manteisio ar bethau arferol, beunyddiol, rheolaidd. Yn anffodus, nid ydym ni'n gwybod faint ohonyn nhw sy'n bodoli ac sydd wedi eu heffeithio yng Nghymru.

Mae'r Ysgrifennydd Cartref, o ganlyniad i bwysau sylweddol iawn, gan gynnwys gan Lywodraeth Cymru, wedi cyhoeddi mesurau newydd, rwy'n falch o ddweud, sy'n cynnwys: tasglu pwrpasol i helpu'r rhai sydd wedi'u heffeithio; cynlluniau i weithio gydag adrannau ym mhob rhan o'r Llywodraeth i gasglu tystiolaeth ar ran mewnfudwyr—fel arfer disgwylir dogfennau ar gyfer pob blwyddyn, megis datganiadau banc neu slipiau cyflog, ond bydd pob un ohonoch chi'n gwybod pa mor anodd yw hi i wneud hynny, yn enwedig mewn oes electronig lle nad yw banciau yn eu cadw yn hwy na dwy neu dair blynedd—addewid y caiff pob achos ei ddatrys mewn pythefnos, sef, yr hyn rwy'n ei olygu yw, pe bai hynny ond yn bosib; bod yr holl ffioedd ar gyfer dogfennau newydd yn cael eu diddymu fel y nad yw pobl ar eu colled yn ariannol, ac mae'r rheini fel arfer yn costio tua £229, dywedir wrthyf; ac y caiff gwefan newydd ei sefydlu gyda chadarnhad a phwynt cyswllt uniongyrchol. Gwnaed nifer o ddatganiadau eraill, ond rydym ni'n ymwybodol, hefyd, bod rhai pobl mewn gwirionedd wedi cael eu halltudio. Rydym yn parhau i geisio sicrwydd gan Lywodraeth y DU y bydd pawb sydd wedi cael triniaeth wael o ganlyniad i'r sefyllfa warthus hon yn cael yr iawn y mae ganddynt yr hawl iddo. 

3. Datganiad gan y Gweinidog Plant a Gofal Cymdeithasol: Bil Cyllido Gofal Plant (Cymru)
3. Statement by the Minister for Children and Social Care: The Childcare Funding (Wales) Bill

Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw'r datganiad gan y Gweinidog Gofal Cymdeithasol a Phlant ar y Bil Cyllido Gofal Plant (Cymru), ac rydw i'n galw ar y Gweinidog i wneud ei ddatganiad. Huw Irranca-Davies.

The next item is the statement by the Minister for Children and Social Care on the Childcare Funding (Wales) Bill, and I call on the Minister to make a statement. Huw Irranca-Davies.

Diolch, Llywydd, am y cyfle i wneud y datganiad yma ynghylch y Bil Cyllido Gofal Plant (Cymru) a gafodd ei gyflwyno i’r Cynulliad Cenedlaethol ddoe. Bydd y Bil, er yn dechnegol ei natur, yn ei gwneud hi’n bosib i Lywodraeth Cymru sefydlu system genedlaethol i reoli ceisiadau ac i wneud y gwiriadau cymhwystra angenrheidiol ar gyfer y cynnig gofal plant yng Nghymru.

Thank you, Llywydd, for the opportunity to make a statement about the Childcare Funding (Wales) Bill, which was introduced to the National Assembly yesterday. The Bill, although technical in nature, will make it possible for the Welsh Government to put in place a national application and eligibility checking system to support the childcare offer in Wales.

Daeth Suzy Davies i’r Gadair.

Suzy Davies took the Chair.

The childcare offer was a key commitment in the Welsh Labour manifesto 'Together for Wales', and we are committed to providing 30 hours a week of Government-funded early education and childcare to working parents of three and four-year-olds in Wales for up to 48 weeks per year. The childcare element is aimed at working parents, which means that we need to establish a means by which parents can apply for the offer and be told whether or not they are eligible, and we are keen to ensure that this process is quick and easy. 

In September, we began delivering our childcare offer in seven early implementer local authority areas. This early testing phase is proving invaluable. We are learning from the delivery on the ground. It's helping us to fine-tune the offer before it's rolled out more widely. Early implementation has highlighted some of the issues and the potential challenges relating to the longer term administration of the offer. So, at the moment, local authorities undertake eligibility checks on a largely manual basis. We know that they find this burdensome, and it's resource-intensive, but I would like to thank them for their commitment and for their feedback to date.

But as we move ahead, it simply does not make sense to continue with such a burdensome approach, nor does it make sense for parents to have to provide their local authority with hard-copy evidence of their employment status and monthly earnings and so on. So, as we move towards the full roll-out of the childcare offer from 2020, we want to establish one national approach for processing applications and for making eligibility checks. This Bill will enable us to do just that.

The Bill provides Welsh Ministers with the power to provide funding for childcare for eligible working parents of three and four-year-old children and to make regulations about the arrangements for administering and operating such a fund. It also enables Welsh Ministers to access the information needed to confirm eligibility. It makes provision for Welsh Ministers to require parents to provide information that is relevant to their application, and to permit certain UK Government departments to provide information that is relevant to making that decision about a person’s eligibility. This is sensitive information, and it's only appropriate that the Bill also makes provision to apply a criminal offence in respect of the unlawful disclosure of such information.

The Bill makes it possible also for financial penalties to be imposed in certain circumstances. So, for example, if a person knowingly provides false or misleading information to support their claim for funding. However, applicants will also be able to ask for any decisions in respect of penalties or of eligibility to be reviewed and, ultimately, they will be able to appeal decisions to the first-tier tribunal.

We have explored other ways of setting up this process, and these are set out in the documents that support the Bill, which were published yesterday. Our preferred option is to take the power to make arrangements about how the funding for the offer is to be administered, and that's what the Bill does.

The current intention is to engage Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs to operate the system on behalf of Welsh Ministers, thereby integrating with the system already operating for the English offer. I believe this is the best option. I’m sure Members will agree that, given current budget constraints and the ongoing period of austerity imposed by the UK Government, it simply does not make sense to reinvent new solutions where ones already exist.

This Bill will give us one common approach across Wales. There will be no postcode lottery when applying for childcare in Wales. Everyone’s application will be dealt with in the same way, and subject to the same criteria and rules. We also consider this approach to be less risky from the perspective of fraud and data security.

The Bill requires the consent of the Chief Secretary to the Treasury and other appropriate UK Government Ministers. I'd like to thank the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, the Rt Hon Elizabeth Truss MP, for providing her consent to the relevant provisions in the Bill. I'd also like to thank the Secretary of State for Wales and his office for their support over recent months in developing this Bill and in seeking the consent of the Secretary of State for the Home Department and the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions.

The regulation-making powers, which the Bill confers on Welsh Ministers, provide for the operational details to be prescribed in subordinate legislation. The regulations will go into detail about who is eligible for funding under the scheme, and how they may go about applying for the funding. All the subordinate legislation, bar the commencement Order, will be subject to the affirmative procedure.

So, it is my pleasure to introduce this Bill for the attention of Assembly Members. I very much look forward to working with the Assembly, and with Assembly committees, over the next few months, as it is my belief that this Bill is an important milestone in delivering one of our manifesto’s key commitments.

Roedd y cynnig gofal plant yn ymrwymiad allweddol ym maniffesto Llafur Cymru 'Gyda'n gilydd dros Gymru', ac rydym ni wedi ymrwymo i ddarparu 30 awr yr wythnos o addysg gynnar a gofal plant wedi ei ariannu gan y Llywodraeth i rieni sy'n gweithio sydd â phlant tair a phedair oed yng Nghymru ar gyfer hyd at 48 wythnos y flwyddyn. Mae'r elfen gofal plant wedi ei bwriadu ar gyfer rhieni sy'n gweithio, sy'n golygu bod angen inni sefydlu ffordd y gall rhieni wneud cais am y cynnig a chael gwybod a ydynt yn gymwys ai peidio, ac rydym ni'n awyddus i sicrhau bod y broses hon yn gyflym ac yn hawdd.

Ym mis Medi, fe wnaethom ni ddechrau darparu ein cynnig gofal plant mewn saith ardal awdurdod lleol cychwynnol. Mae'r cyfnod arbrofol hwn yn hynod werthfawr. Rydym yn dysgu oddi wrth y ddarpariaeth ar lawr gwlad. Mae'n ein helpu i fireinio'r cynnig cyn y caiff ei gyflwyno'n ehangach. Mae gweithredu cynnar wedi tynnu sylw at rai o'r materion a'r heriau posib sy'n ymwneud â gweinyddu'r cynnig yn fwy hirdymor. Felly, ar hyn o bryd, mae awdurdodau lleol yn cynnal gwiriadau cymhwysedd unigol a phersonol i raddau helaeth. Rydym ni'n gwybod eu bod yn gweld hyn yn feichus, ac mae'n golygu llawer o adnoddau, ond hoffwn ddiolch iddynt am eu hymroddiad ac am eu hadborth hyd yma.

Ond wrth inni gamu i'r dyfodol, nid yw'n gwneud synnwyr i barhau gyda dull mor feichus, ac nid yw'n gwneud synnwyr bod yn rhaid i rieni ddarparu tystiolaeth copi caled o'u statws cyflogaeth ac enillion misol ac ati i'w hawdurdod lleol. Felly, wrth inni symud tuag at gyflwyno'n llawn y cynnig gofal plant yn 2020, rydym ni eisiau sefydlu un dull gweithredu cenedlaethol ar gyfer prosesu ceisiadau ac ar gyfer gwirio cymhwysedd. Bydd y Bil hwn yn ein galluogi i wneud hynny'n union.

Mae'r Bil yn rhoi grym i Weinidogion Cymru ddarparu cyllid gofal plant i rieni cymwys sy'n gweithio ac sydd â phlant tair a phedair oed ac i wneud rheoliadau ynghylch y trefniadau ar gyfer gweinyddu a gweithredu cronfa o'r fath. Mae hefyd yn galluogi Gweinidogion Cymru i gael gafael ar yr wybodaeth sydd ei hangen i gadarnhau cymhwysedd. Mae'n rhoi grym i Weinidogion Cymru ei gwneud hi'n ofynnol i rieni ddarparu gwybodaeth sy'n berthnasol i'w cais, ac i ganiatáu i rai adrannau o Lywodraeth y DU ddarparu gwybodaeth sy'n berthnasol i wneud y penderfyniad ynghylch cymhwysedd rhywun. Mae hon yn wybodaeth sensitif, ac mae'n briodol fod y Bil hefyd yn darparu ar gyfer ei chyfrif hi'n drosedd datgelu gwybodaeth o'r fath yn anghyfreithlon.

Mae'r Bil yn ei gwneud hi'n bosib hefyd cyflwyno cosbau ariannol mewn amgylchiadau penodol. Felly, er enghraifft, os yw person yn darparu gwybodaeth anwir neu gamarweiniol yn fwriadol i gefnogi eu cais am gyllid. Fodd bynnag, bydd ymgeiswyr hefyd yn gallu gofyn am adolygu unrhyw benderfyniadau o ran cosbau neu gymhwysedd ac, yn y pen draw, gallant apelio yn erbyn penderfyniadau i'r tribiwnlys haen gyntaf.

Rydym ni wedi ymchwilio i ffyrdd eraill o sefydlu'r broses hon, ac mae'r rhain wedi'u nodi yn y dogfennau sy'n cefnogi'r Bil, a gyhoeddwyd ddoe. Y dewis a ffefrir gennym ni yw cael y pŵer i wneud trefniadau ynghylch sut y dylid gweinyddu'r arian ar gyfer y cynnig, a dyna mae'r Bil yn ei wneud.

Y bwriad ar hyn o bryd yw trefnu i Gyllid a Thollau ei Mawrhydi weithredu'r system ar ran Gweinidogion Cymru, gan integreiddio gyda'r system sydd eisoes ar waith ar gyfer y cynnig sy'n berthnasol yn Lloegr. Credaf mai dyma'r dewis gorau. Rwy'n siŵr y bydd Aelodau yn cytuno, o gofio'r cyfyngiadau presennol ar y gyllideb, a'r cyfnod parhaus hwn o gyni a orfodir gan Lywodraeth y DU, nid yw hi'n gwneud synnwyr i ailddyfeisio atebion newydd lle mae rhai eisoes yn bodoli.

Bydd y Bil hwn yn sefydlu un ffordd o weithredu ledled Cymru. Ni fydd unrhyw loteri cod post wrth wneud cais am ofal plant yng Nghymru. Ymdrinnir â chais pawb yn yr un modd, a bydd yr un meini prawf a rheolau yn berthnasol. Rydym ni hefyd yn credu bod y dull hwn yn llai o risg o safbwynt twyll a diogelwch data.

Mae'r Bil yn gofyn am gydsyniad Prif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys a Gweinidogion eraill priodol Llywodraeth y DU. Hoffwn ddiolch i Brif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys, y Gwir Anrhydeddus Elizabeth Truss AS, am roi ei chydsyniad i'r darpariaethau perthnasol yn y Bil. Hoffwn hefyd ddiolch i Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru a'i swyddfa am eu cefnogaeth dros y misoedd diwethaf wrth ddatblygu'r Bil hwn ac wrth ofyn am gydsyniad Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yr Adran Gartref a'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Waith a Phensiynau.

Mae'r pwerau gwneud rheoliadau, y mae'r Bil yn eu rhoi i Weinidogion Cymru, yn caniatáu i'r manylion gweithredol gael eu rhagnodi mewn is-ddeddfwriaeth. Bydd y rheoliadau yn manylu ynghylch pwy sy'n gymwys i gael arian o dan y cynllun, a sut y gallant fynd ati i wneud cais am y cyllid. Bydd y weithdrefn gadarnhaol yn berthnasol i bob is-ddeddfwriaeth, heblaw am y Gorchymyn Cychwyn. 

Felly, mae'n bleser gennyf gyflwyno'r Bil hwn i sylw Aelodau'r Cynulliad. Rwy'n edrych ymlaen yn fawr iawn i weithio gyda'r Cynulliad, a Phwyllgorau'r Cynulliad, dros y misoedd nesaf, gan fy mod yn credu bod y Bil hwn yn garreg filltir bwysig o ran cyflawni un o ymrwymiadau allweddol ein maniffesto.

15:00

Diolch yn fawr. Darren Millar.

Thank you. Darren Millar.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. Can I thank you for your statement and for the briefing that you afforded me earlier on, with you and your senior officials? I think this is an important piece of legislation that needs to be taken through the Assembly in order that we can hang upon this framework the financial arrangements that will need to be in place for the new childcare offer. And you will be aware, of course, that the new childcare offer is also fulfilling one of our manifesto commitments, and manifesto commitments from some of the other political parties who are also represented in this Chamber, in that we all wanted to extend the eligibility for free childcare to those who are in the workplace, in order to maximise the opportunities for people to get back into work and also provide child development opportunities and early education opportunities for those children. I think it's absolutely right that you're seeking to fulfil that ambition.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. A gaf i ddiolch i chi am eich datganiad ac am y diweddariad a gefais gennych yn gynharach, gennych chi a'ch uwch swyddogion? Rwy'n credu bod hwn yn ddarn pwysig o ddeddfwriaeth y mae angen i'r Cynulliad ei wireddu fel y gallwn ddefnyddio'r fframwaith hwn yn gyfrwng ar gyfer y trefniadau ariannol y bydd angen iddynt fod ar waith ar gyfer y cynnig gofal plant newydd. A byddwch yn ymwybodol, wrth gwrs, bod y cynnig gofal plant newydd hefyd yn cyflawni un o'n hymrwymiadau maniffesto, ac ymrwymiadau maniffesto rhai o'r pleidiau gwleidyddol eraill sydd hefyd yn cael eu cynrychioli yn y Siambr hon, sef fod pob un ohonom ni'n awyddus i sicrhau fod pobl mewn gwaith yn gymwys i gael gofal plant rhad ac am ddim, er mwyn manteisio i'r eithaf ar y cyfleoedd i bobl ddychwelyd i'r gwaith a hefyd i ddarparu cyfleoedd ar gyfer datblygu plant a chyfleoedd addysg gynnar ar gyfer y plant hynny. Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n gwbl briodol eich bod yn ceisio gwireddu'r uchelgais honno.

Now, notwithstanding that, of course, there are some concerns that the eligibility criteria for access to free childcare is restrictive in a way that means that there's not a universal offer that's being made. The children's commissioner and others have voiced their concerns that those young people who are from poorer backgrounds tend to be around 10 months behind their peers in terms of development at age three, and many of those, of course, if their parents are not in work, will simply not have access to what is a high-quality childcare offer that you and I want our young people to have the opportunity to interface with. So, I do wonder, Minister, whether you will as a Government consider the eligibility criteria as we go forward with this Bill, as it moves forward into Committee Stage, so that there's an opportunity not just to discuss the development of the financial framework that sits behind the childcare offer, but also to look more widely at the eligibility criteria that was on the face of the Bill, if you like, in order to perhaps widen it. 

Other concerns have been raised about the involvement of family members who may well be registered and licensed child minders or nursery owners, and their ability to offer childcare that is paid for via the new childcare scheme. Again, I think that this Bill presents an opportunity to address the concerns that have been raised in relation to that. I can see that there's some reference to parents who might be child minders on the face of the Bill, and the exclusion of those specifically, but what about aunties, uncles, grandparents and any other members of the extended family, who may well be registered and licensed, delivering high-quality childcare and early education? They also, I think, ought to have the opportunity to participate in this scheme and to be funded to participate in the scheme.

Concerns have also been raised about capacity within the sector to deliver the childcare offer, and I wonder whether you can tell us where you're at as a Government in terms of pushing the capacity up in those pilot areas. You'll know that there have been some independent reports that have suggested that the capacity that is currently available in Wales is about two hours 40 minutes- worth if it was exploited in full across the whole of the country and this offer were completely taken up per week. That's clearly a long way from the ambition of all young people who are eligible getting the full 30 hours, so I wonder what work you're doing with the National Day Nurseries Association and others in order to ramp that capacity up, and what your experience is in those pilot areas in respect of that.

In addition, the Public Policy Institute for Wales raised some serious concerns about the costing of the free childcare offer, in their report some time ago. They reckoned it could cost up to £228 million to deliver it across the whole of Wales. I appreciate that not all of the detail in terms of the whole roll-out is within the explanatory memorandum in respect of this Bill, because it forms a small part of what you're doing, but clearly it is a concern, and I know that the Welsh Government has stuck to its guns in terms of this £100 million price tag. But perhaps you can tell us, given the continuing experience in the pilot areas again, whether you still feel that £100 million is going to be sufficient to be able to deliver against your ambition.

Just finally, if I can just say in respect of the involvement of HMRC to deliver this, I think it's eminently sensible. It's very clear from the explanatory memorandum and the financial attachments that any other option is blown out of the water in terms of the attraction, in terms of the cost-effectiveness of partnering with HMRC. You're quite right: they've already got an infrastructure that is in place over the border in England, and to expand that to incorporate a Welsh scheme seems to be absolutely eminently sensible. I'm very pleased that the UK Government have engaged positively, via the Wales Office and via the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, in order to give the appropriate consents and support to facilitate this Bill. So, I'm very pleased to see that and I look forward to hearing your response.

Nawr, er gwaethaf hynny, wrth gwrs, ceir rhai pryderon bod y meini prawf o ran manteisio ar ofal plant am ddim yn gyfyngol mewn modd sy'n golygu nad yw cynnig cynhwysfawr yn cael ei wneud. Mae'r comisiynydd plant ac eraill wedi mynegi eu pryderon bod y bobl ifanc hynny sy'n dod o gefndiroedd tlotach yn tueddu i fod tua 10 mis ar ôl eu cyfoedion o ran datblygiad pan fo nhw'n dair oed, ac ni chaiff llawer o'r rheini, wrth gwrs, os nad yw eu rhieni yn y gwaith, unrhyw gyfle i fanteisio ar yr y cynnig gofal plant o ansawdd uchel yr ydych chi a minnau eisiau rhoi cyfle i'n pobl ifanc fanteisio arno. Felly, tybed, Weinidog, a fydd y Llywodraeth yn ystyried y meini prawf cymhwysedd wrth inni symud ymlaen gyda'r Bil hwn, wrth iddo symud ymlaen i'r Cam Pwyllgor, fel y ceir cyfle nid yn unig i drafod datblygiad y fframwaith ariannol sy'n sail i'r cynnig gofal plant, ond hefyd i edrych yn fwy eang ar y meini prawf cymhwysedd a oedd ar wyneb y Bil, os mynnwch chi, er mwyn ei ehangu efallai.

Mynegwyd pryderon eraill ynglŷn â chynnwys aelodau o'r teulu sydd efallai yn wir yn warchodwyr plant neu yn berchnogion meithrinfa cofrestredig a thrwyddedig, a'u gallu i gynnig gofal plant a delir amdano drwy'r cynllun gofal plant newydd. Unwaith eto, credaf fod y Bil hwn yn gyfle i roi sylw i'r pryderon a grybwyllwyd yn hynny o beth. Gallaf weld bod rhywfaint o gyfeirio at rieni a allai fod yn warchodwyr plant ar wyneb y Bil, ac at eu heithrio yn benodol, ond beth am fodrybedd, ewythrod, teidiau a neiniau ac aelodau eraill o'r teulu estynedig, sydd o bosib wedi eu cofrestru a'u trwyddedu, sy'n darparu addysg gynnar a gofal plant o ansawdd uchel? Rwy'n credu y dylen nhw, hefyd, gael y cyfle i gymryd rhan yn y cynllun hwn ac i gael eu hariannu i gymryd rhan yn y cynllun.

Mynegwyd pryderon hefyd ynghylch gallu'r sector i ddarparu'r cynnig gofal plant, a thybed a allwch chi ddweud wrthym ni ble'r mae'r Llywodraeth arni o ran cynyddu'r gallu yn yr ardaloedd arbrofol hynny. Byddwch yn gwybod y bu rhai adroddiadau annibynnol sydd wedi awgrymu bod y capasiti sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd yng Nghymru gyfwerth ag oddeutu dwy awr 40 munud pe manteisid arno'n llawn ledled y wlad ac y cofleidiwyd y cynnig hwn yn ei gyfanrwydd yr wythnos hon. Mae hynny'n amlwg yn bell o'r uchelgais y gall pob person ifanc cymwys cael y 30 awr llawn, felly tybed pa waith ydych chi'n ei wneud gyda'r Gymdeithas Genedlaethol Meithrinfeydd Dydd ac eraill er mwyn cynyddu'r capasiti hwnnw, a beth yw eich profiad yn yr ardaloedd arbrofol yn hynny o beth.

Yn ogystal, mynegodd Sefydliad Polisi Cyhoeddus Cymru rai pryderon difrifol ynghylch cost y cynnig gofal plant am ddim, yn eu hadroddiad gryn amser yn ôl. Roedden nhw'n tybio y gallai gostio hyd at £228 miliwn i'w weithredu ledled Cymru. Rwy'n sylweddoli nad yw'r holl fanylion o ran cyflwyno'r cynllun yn ei gyfanrwydd yn y Memorandwm Esboniadol mewn cysylltiad â'r Bil hwn, oherwydd mae'n ffurfio rhan fach o'r hyn yr ydych yn ei wneud, ond mae'n amlwg yn destun pryder, ac rwy'n gwybod fod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dal ei thir o ran y pris hwn o £100 miliwn. Ond efallai y gallwch chi ddweud wrthym ni, o ystyried profiad parhaus yn yr ardaloedd arbrofol unwaith eto, a ydych chi'n dal yn teimlo y bydd £100 miliwn yn ddigonol i allu cyflawni'ch uchelgais.

A dim ond yn olaf, os caf i ddweud dim ond o ran cynnwys Cyllid a Thollau EM i gyflawni hyn, credaf fod hynny'n synhwyrol iawn. Mae'n amlwg iawn yn y Memorandwm Esboniadol a'r Atodiadau ariannol bod unrhyw ddewis arall yn ddiffygiol iawn o ran pa mor atyniadol ydyw, o ran cost-effeithiolrwydd cydweithio â CThEM. Rydych chi yn llygad eich lle: mae ganddyn nhw eisoes seilwaith sydd ar waith dros y ffin yn Lloegr, ac mae ehangu hynny i gynnwys cynllun Cymreig yn ymddangos yn synhwyrol iawn. Rwy'n falch iawn bod Llywodraeth y DU wedi ymgysylltu'n gadarnhaol, drwy gyfrwng Swyddfa Cymru a Phrif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys, er mwyn rhoi'r caniatâd a'r cymorth priodol i hwyluso'r Bil hwn. Felly, rwy'n falch iawn o weld hynny ac edrychaf ymlaen at glywed eich ymateb.

15:10

Darren, thank you very much indeed. Several points there, but can I just begin by welcoming your broad support for this? As you rightly say, versions of childcare, early education offers, appeared in most manifestos of some sort, with variations on a theme, differently cut and spliced. But it is good that we are now at this point where, with the support of this house around this Bill, we can move to a position where we can see a full roll-out by 2020 of a national Welsh childcare scheme that involves those elements as well—not simply of childcare, but also of that educated, pedagogic influence as well. So, thank you for the support.

To come to one of the main themes of your points there, this is not the universal offer. In fact, there are those who have lobbied for a far more universal offer, not least among those—and I've discussed this with her—is the children's commissioner, but there are others as well. But this isn't that offer; this is very much the offer that has come directly from the manifesto, specifically focused at working parents as described within the Bill and within the parameters that will flow within the regulations. So, I wouldn't attempt at any point during this, including as it progresses with the will of Assembly Members into committee, to pretend this is anything other than what it is. To try and develop something that is a more universal offer will be for another day, and there will be plenty of opportunities to explore that, I am sure. But this actually is quite a focused technical Bill that will allow us to deliver the offer as it's currently framed. However, it does have some flexibility within it, which is quite interesting as we progress into committee, not to do the universal offer, but to look at some of those constituent groups out there in the child minding, childcare sorority and fraternity who are interested in being a part of this. But I think one thing we have to be crystal clear on is that this is not meant in any way to be some form of alternative subsidy into families who are looking after their own children—this is for registered and licensed child minders and childcare facilities, registered and licensed. So, we are having many others say, 'Well, can we not also benefit?' The focus for this is not purely on simply the child minding; this is on the wider benefits for those children within it and how this integrates. And this is part of the pilot—how this integrates also with things like the foundation years offer and so on. So, we can explore this in committee.

You mentioned the issues of capacity and the costings. We're still confident, but part of the piloting, by the way, is in order to actually help us refine where we think we're going with the costings, based on elements of take-up, et cetera, et cetera. So, we are refining that, but we still have full confidence that the costings we initially put forward are within the scope of what we can deliver by 2020 for the full roll-out. And similarly, in terms of capacity, it's quite fascinating that within the different types of childcare, child minding capacity, we are discovering that it's quite different geographically. There are—particularly looking to my right here—within parts of the south Wales Valleys many who are licensed child minders who are looking after their own grandchildren plus two or three or four others. Now that's quite interesting. But part of the piloting of this and the way we are phasing the roll-out is in order to make sure that we are also doing that work alongside it of building the capacity. And we are doing a lot of work with the sectors, the different parts of the sector, to build the capacity, to identify the gaps where there might be gaps in provision, so that by the time we get to 2019-20, we are ready to roll this provision out entirely.

HMRC—thank you for the welcome for the fact that we've chosen that option. We did consider other options. We did look at whether we should provide this, as we currently are, through local authorities. I think I've made clear why, both from cost and the burden of that, it's not the right way to do it, and also data protection, sharing of information, et cetera, et cetera. We did also consider a stand-alone entity to do this, a made-in-Wales new entity. Why would we do it when it's more cost-effective and there's one already there that is doing this? They have had some minor glitches, by the way, in the England model, but one good thing is we're confident, by the time we come to roll out, we'll have overcome those glitches. It could be that in future it could be the Welsh Revenue Authority—the Bill as structured allows those opportunities to be looked at in the future if we need to—but, as currently set, we're keen to progress with the HMRC model and I thank the various Secretaries of State who are helping us facilitate this.

Darren, diolch yn fawr iawn. Mae sawl pwynt yn y fan yna, ond a gaf i ddechrau drwy groesawu'ch cefnogaeth eang ar gyfer hyn? Fel y dywedwch yn gwbl briodol, ymddangosodd fersiynau o ofal plant, cynigion addysg gynnar, yn y rhan fwyaf o'r maniffestos o ryw fath, gydag amrywiadau ar y thema, wedi eu cyflwyno yn wahanol. Ond mae'n dda ein bod bellach mewn sefyllfa ble, gyda chymorth y tŷ hwn i'r Bil hwn, y gallwn ni symud i sefyllfa lle gallwn ni weld cyflwyno Cynllun Gofal Plant Cenedlaethol i Gymru yn llawn erbyn 2020, sy'n cynnwys yr elfennau hynny yn ogystal—nid dim ond gofal plant, ond hefyd y dylanwad hwnnw o ran addysg ac addysgeg hefyd. Felly, diolch am y gefnogaeth.

I droi at un o brif themâu y pwyntiau a wnaethoch chi, nid dyma'r cynnig cynhwysol. Yn wir, mae rhai wedi lobïo am gynnig llawer mwy cynhwysol, yn enwedig ymhlith y rhai—ac rwyf wedi trafod hyn gyda hi—y Comisiynydd Plant, ond ceir eraill hefyd. Ond nid dyma'r cynnig hwnnw; dyma, i raddau helaeth iawn, y cynnig sydd wedi dod yn uniongyrchol o'r maniffesto, sy'n canolbwyntio'n benodol ar rieni sy'n gweithio fel y disgrifir yn y Bil ac o fewn y ffiniau a fydd yn rhan o'r rheoliadau. Felly, ni fyddwn yn ymdrechu ar unrhyw adeg yn ystod o broses hon, gan gynnwys wrth iddo gyrraedd cam, gydag ewyllys Aelodau'r Cynulliad, ble gellir ei gyflwyno i'r Pwyllgor, i esgus fod hwn yn unrhyw beth heblaw'r hyn ydyw. Mae ceisio datblygu cynnig mwy cynhwysol yn rhywbeth ar gyfer y dyfodol, a bydd digon o gyfleoedd i ymchwilio i hynny, rwy'n siŵr. Ond mewn gwirionedd mae hwn yn fesur eithaf technegol a phenodol a fydd yn caniatáu i ni gyflwyno'r cynnig fel y mae wedi ei lunio ar hyn o bryd. Fodd bynnag, mae rhywfaint o hyblygrwydd o fewn hynny, sy'n eithaf diddorol wrth inni symud ymlaen i'r Pwyllgor, nid i wneud y cynnig cyffredinol, ond i edrych ar rai o'r grwpiau cyfansoddol hynny yn y byd gofal plant a gwarchod plant sydd â diddordeb bod yn rhan o hyn. Ond rwy'n credu mai un peth y mae'n rhaid inni fod yn glir yn ei gylch yw nad yw hyn mewn unrhyw ffordd i fod yn rhyw fath o gymhorthdal amgen i deuluoedd sy'n gofalu am eu plant eu hunain—mae hyn ar gyfer gwarchodwyr plant a chyfleusterau gofal plant cofrestredig a thrwyddedig, cofrestredig a thrwyddedig. Felly, mae llawer o rai eraill yn dweud, 'Wel, allwn ni ddim elwa hefyd?' Nid yw'r pwyslais ar hyn dim ond ar warchod plant; mae ar y buddion ehangach ar gyfer y plant sy'n rhan o hynny a sut mae hyn yn integreiddio. Ac mae hyn yn rhan o'r cynllun arbrofol—sut mae hyn yn integreiddio hefyd gyda phethau fel cynnig y blynyddoedd sylfaen ac yn y blaen. Felly, fe allwn ni ystyried hyn yn y Pwyllgor.

Fe wnaethoch chi sôn am y materion o ran capasiti a'r costau. Rydym yn dal yn ffyddiog, ond rhan o'r cynllun arbrofol, gyda llaw, yw er mwyn mewn gwirionedd ein helpu i fireinio'r sefyllfa yr ydym ni'n credu y byddwn ynddi o ran y costau, yn seiliedig ar elfennau o ddefnyddio, ac ati, ac ati. Felly, rydym ni yn mireinio hynny, ond rydym ni'n dal yn gwbl ffyddiog bod y costau cychwynnol y gwnaethom ni eu cyflwyno o fewn cwmpas yr hyn y gallwn ei gyflawni erbyn 2020 o ran cyflwyno'r cynllun yn llawn. Ac yn yr un modd, o ran capasiti, mae'n eithaf rhyfeddol ein bod o fewn y gwahanol fathau o ofal plant, y capasiti gwarchod plant, yn darganfod fod hynny'n eithaf gwahanol yn ddaearyddol. Mae yna—yn arbennig wrth edrych ar fy ochr dde yma—yn rhannau o Gymoedd y de, lawer o warchodwyr plant trwyddedig sy'n gofalu am eu hwyrion a'u hwyresau eu hunain ynghyd â dau neu dri neu bedwar o blant eraill. Mae hynny'n eithaf diddorol. Ond rhan o'r arbrawf hwn a'r ffordd yr ydym ni'n graddol gyflwyno'r cynllun yw er mwyn gwneud yn siŵr ein bod hefyd yn gwneud y gwaith hwnnw ochr yn ochr â hynny o feithrin gallu. Ac rydym ni yn gwneud llawer o waith gyda'r sectorau, gwahanol rannau'r sector, i feithrin gallu, i adnabod y bylchau lle gallai fod bylchau yn y ddarpariaeth, fel y byddwn ni erbyn 2019-20, yn barod i gyflwyno'r ddarpariaeth hon yn gyfan gwbl.

Cyllid a Thollau EM—diolch ichi am y croeso i'r ffaith ein bod wedi dewis yr opsiwn hwnnw. Fe wnaethom ni ystyried dewisiadau eraill. Fe wnaethom ni ystyried a ddylem ni ddarparu hyn, fel yr ydym ni ar hyn o bryd, drwy awdurdodau lleol. Rwy'n credu fy mod i wedi gwneud yn glir pam, o safbwynt cost a baich hynny, nad dyna'r ffordd briodol i wneud hyn, a hefyd diogelu data, rhannu gwybodaeth, ac ati, ac ati. Fe wnaethom ni hefyd ystyried cael endid annibynnol i wneud hyn, cael endid Cymreig newydd. Pam y byddem yn gwneud hyn pan mae'n fwy cost-effeithiol ac mae un eisoes yn bod sy'n gwneud hyn? Maent wedi cael rhai anawsterau mân, gyda llaw, yn y model yn Lloegr, ond un peth da yw ein bod yn ffyddiog, erbyn y bydd hi'n bryd inni gyflwyno'r cynnig, byddwn wedi goresgyn yr anawsterau hynny. Hwyrach yn y dyfodol y gallai Awdurdod Refeniw Cymru wneud hynny—mae'r Bil fel y mae wedi ei strwythuro yn caniatáu ystyried y cyfleoedd hynny yn y dyfodol os bydd angen inni—ond, fel y mae hi ar hyn o bryd, rydym yn awyddus iawn i symud ymlaen gyda model Cyllid a Thollau EM a diolchaf i'r Ysgrifenyddion Gwladol amrywiol sy'n ein helpu i hwyluso hyn.

15:15

A gaf i ddiolch i'r Gweinidog am ei ddatganiad? Mae'n iawn, mae yn Fil technegol, ond rydw i'n edrych ymlaen at fynd i'r afael â'r Bil wrth i'r Pwyllgor Plant, Pobl Ifanc ac Addysg graffu ar y Bil dros yr wythnosau a'r misoedd nesaf yma. 

Nawr, rydw i eisiau dechrau drwy daro nodyn o gonsérn, efallai, oherwydd byddwch chi'n gwybod bod Plaid Cymru yn cefnogi'r egwyddor o ehangu'r ddarpariaeth gofal plant yng Nghymru. Mae Plaid Cymru eisiau ei ehangu i bob plentyn tair i bedair oed yng Nghymru ac nid ei gyfyngu i blant o deuluoedd sy'n gweithio yn unig. Mi ddaeth hi'n glir o'r dystiolaeth a roddoch chi ychydig fisoedd yn ôl i'r pwyllgor fod y Llywodraeth yn dod at hwn o bersbectif y rhieni a'r elfen economaidd, efallai, yn fwy na'r elfen plant, tra, efallai, ein bod ni, fel Plaid—rŷm ni'n teimlo mai'r plant yw ffocws canolog y polisi yma, a gwella cyfleoedd bywyd neu addysgiadol y plant yna yn benodol. Felly, rydym ni'n cyd-weld â'r comisiynydd plant a'r adroddiadau sydd wedi cael eu cyhoeddi gan Achub y Plant ac eraill. Rŷm ni'n rhannu eu consérn nhw fod allgau plant o gartrefi di-waith o'r cynllun yma yn mynd i greu risg o ehangu'r bwlch addysg yna rhwng y rhai mwyaf difreintiedig a'u cyfoedion efallai ychydig yn llai difreintiedig, yn lle cau'r bwlch yna. Rydym ni am wneud cyfleoedd bywyd plant yn fwy cyfartal. Rydw i'n siŵr y byddwch chi'n cyfeirio at rai o'r rhaglenni eraill sy'n bodoli i gefnogi plant difreintiedig, fel Dechrau'n Deg ac yn y blaen, ond rŷm ni hefyd yn gwybod fod y rhan fwyaf o blant difreintiedig yn byw y tu allan i'r ardaloedd hynny. Felly, mae yna fwlch yn dal yn mynd i fod yn y ddarpariaeth, a hwnnw'n fwlch pwysig, rŷm ni'n teimlo, sy'n gorfod bod yn flaenoriaeth i ni fynd i'r afael â hyn.

May I thank the Minister for his statement? He’s right, it is a technical Bill, but I look forward to getting to grips with the Bill as the Children, Young People and Education Committee scrutinises it over the next few weeks and months.

Now, I want to start with a note of concern, perhaps, because you will know that Plaid Cymru supports the principle of expanding the provision of childcare in Wales. Plaid Cymru wants to extend it to all children of three to four years of age, not restrict it to children from working families only. It became clear from the evidence that you provided to the committee a few months ago that the Government is approaching this from the parental perspective and the economic perspective, perhaps, more than the perspective of children, whilst we, as a party, believe that children should be the central focus of this policy, and improving the life chances or the educational chances of those children specifically. Therefore, we agree with the children’s commissioner and the reports that have been published by Save the Children and others. We share their concern that excluding children from non-working households from this programme is going to risk expanding that gap between the most disadvantaged and perhaps their less disadvantaged peers, rather than narrowing that gap. We want to equalise the life chances of children. I’m sure you will refer to some of the other programmes available to support disadvantaged children, such as Flying Start, but we also know that many of those children live outwith those areas. So, there is still going to be a gap in provision, and that’s going to be an important gap that we feel should be a priority in tackling this issue.

So, the Welsh Government's focus is primarily, I believe, on the working parent, but I have to say a lot of the evidence suggests that maybe the impact of this kind of programme is limited in their respect, because I'm sure you'll be aware the Public Policy Institute for Wales's report, commissioned by the First Minister two years ago to look at the childcare policy options for Wales, concluded that, and I quote:

'The impact on work participation and work hours for mothers in families with a child of target age is extremely small.'

They conclude that it's unlikely

'to achieve either objective to any notable, possibly even discernible, degree.'

So, I'm just looking for reassurance that you are convinced that £100 million-plus investment from the Government will generate that necessary return in terms of the impact on working families, because the PPIW report suggests that maybe that isn't necessarily the case to the extent that we'd be hoping it would be.

In the paper that you've presented to the Children, Young People and Education Committee—and no doubt we'll go over some of this territory again tomorrow morning when you're joining us in committee—you referred to an OECD report from last year, which talks of benefits for women in the labour market, but of course the focus of that report was on children aged between nought and three years old, not three and four years old, as this policy does, of course. That report references provision in Québec, where an analysis of the policy there has found that it clearly favours upper income families. So, I think you can hear what I'm saying, and I'd be interested just to hear your response to that.

The second point I'd like to make is that Plaid Cymru support for this policy, as was reflected in the compact agreement and as has been already touched upon previously, was predicated on the belief, at least, or the hope, that this was the start of a journey that would take us to a point where there is universal provision. Now, you were very reluctant to commit to that or to suggest that you had that kind of ambition in committee a few months ago. I was just wondering whether you'd had an opportunity to consider where we would potentially go next, because certainly we've seen it as a first step towards the introduction of a universal service. If the Government doesn't intend to show that same ambition then we'd certainly be very, very disappointed to say the least. And it isn't just us that needs clarity on that; I think the sector would benefit from knowing that that's where we're heading ultimately as well.

Now, yes, it's a technical Bill and there is little detail on the face of the Bill, I have to say, and some very important detail as well is being left to regulation in terms of what would a qualifying child be, circumstances in which a person is or isn't to be regarded as another person's partner, circumstances in which a person is or isn't to be treated as carrying out paid work, and I'm just wondering: has this been tabled a bit too early? Do we not know the answers to some of these questions? Because we know that Arad Research is carrying out an evaluation. Should we not wait for that to be published in the autumn? And whilst I welcome the fact that any regulations will be subject to the affirmative procedure, of course we all know, with an affirmative procedure, it's a take it or leave it process; we cannot amend. So, I have some concerns that, whilst appreciating it's a technical Bill, maybe the level of—. I would have expected maybe a bit more detail, so I'm just wondering why now and why not maybe in a few months' time, when you'll be better positioned to present some more detail. 

The explanatory memorandum states that, because of the technical nature of the Bill, and its limited appeal to the wider public, you didn't feel it appropriate to undertake an open consultation, but it would be good to hear what elements of consultation have happened, not just in terms of parents but particularly in terms of children as well. I would welcome your comments on that. 

And the £100,000 upper limit for eligibility—what's the rationale for that? I haven't got an issue with that; it just sounds a little bit like a figure that's been plucked out of the air. I'm sure it isn't. Maybe you could explain to us why it's been pitched at that level. 

Finally, your statement talks of eligibility checks and the associated bureaucracy that comes with that, making it, I quote, 'a burdensome approach'. Well, of course, a universal approach would do away with a lot of that but, as I say, we look forward to scrutinising the Bill and, clearly, we'll be coming back to some of these issues over the next weeks and months. 

Felly, mae pwyslais Llywodraeth Cymru yn bennaf, rwy'n credu, ar y rhiant sy'n gweithio, ond rhaid imi ddweud bod llawer o'r dystiolaeth yn awgrymu bod effaith y math hwn o raglen efallai yn gyfyngedig o'u rhan nhw, oherwydd rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn ymwybodol y daeth adroddiad Sefydliad Polisi Cyhoeddus i Gymru, a gomisiynwyd gan y Prif Weinidog ddwy flynedd yn ôl i edrych ar y dewisiadau polisi gofal plant ar gyfer Cymru, i'r casgliad:

'Mae'r effaith ar allu gweithio ac oriau gwaith i famau mewn teuluoedd sydd â phlentyn o oedran targed yn eithriadol o fach.'

Maent yn dod i'r casgliad ei bod yn annhebygol

'o gyflawni'r naill amcan neu'r llall i unrhyw raddau nodedig, o bosibl i'r graddau y byddai rhywun hyd yn oed yn sylwi arnynt.'

Felly, dim ond edrych am sicrwydd wyf i eich bod yn argyhoeddedig y bydd buddsoddiad o £100 miliwn a mwy gan y Llywodraeth yn esgor ar y canlyniadau angenrheidiol hynny o ran yr effaith ar deuluoedd, yn gweithio oherwydd awgryma adroddiad y Sefydliad Polisi Cyhoeddus i Gymru nad dyna efallai o reidrwydd yr achos i'r graddau y byddem yn gobeithio.

Yn y papur yr ydych chi wedi'i gyflwyno i'r Pwyllgor Addysg, Plant a Phobl ifanc—ac yn sicr byddwn yn trafod agweddau ar hyn eto bore yfory pan rydych chi'n ymuno â ni yn y Pwyllgor—gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio at adroddiad a gyhoeddwyd gan Y Sefydliad ar gyfer Cydweithrediad a Datblygiad Economaidd y llynedd, sy'n sôn am fanteision i fenywod yn y farchnad lafur, ond wrth gwrs roedd yr adroddiad hwnnw'n canolbwyntio ar blant rhwng dim a thair blwydd oed, nid tair a phedair oed, fel y gwna'r polisi hwn, wrth gwrs. Mae'r adroddiad hwnnw yn cyfeirio at ddarpariaeth yn Québec, lle mae dadansoddiad o'r polisi yn y fan honno wedi canfod ei fod yn amlwg yn ffafrio teuluoedd sydd â'r incwm mwyaf. Felly, credaf y gallwch ddeall yr hyn yr wyf i'n ei ddweud, a byddai gennyf ddiddordeb clywed eich ymateb i hynny.

Yr ail bwynt yr hoffwn ei wneud yw bod cefnogaeth Plaid Cymru i'r polisi hwn, fel yr adlewyrchwyd yn y cytundeb compact ac fel y crybwyllwyd eisoes, yn seiliedig ar y gred, o leiaf, neu'r gobaith, fod hyn yn ddechrau taith y byddai'n ein harwain at sefyllfa lle ceir darpariaeth gynhwysol. Nawr, roeddech chi'n amharod iawn i ymrwymo i hynny nac i awgrymu bod gennych chi'r math hwnnw o uchelgais yn y Pwyllgor ychydig fisoedd yn ôl. Dim ond meddwl oeddwn i, tybed ydych wedi cael cyfle i ystyried ble fyddem ni o bosib yn mynd nesaf, oherwydd yn sicr rydym ni wedi gweld hynny fel cam cyntaf tuag at gyflwyno gwasanaeth cynhwysol. Os nad yw'r Llywodraeth yn bwriadu dangos yr un uchelgais honno yna byddem yn sicr yn siomedig iawn, iawn i ddweud y lleiaf. Ac nid dim ond ni sydd angen eglurder ynglŷn â hynny; rwy'n credu y byddai'r sector yn elwa gan wybod mai dyna'r sefyllfa yr ydym ni'n mynd tuag ati yn y pen draw yn ogystal.

Nawr, ydy, mae'n Fil technegol ac ychydig o fanylion sydd ar wyneb y Bil, mae'n rhaid imi ddweud, ac mae rhai manylion pwysig iawn hefyd yn cael eu gadael i'w rheoleiddio o ran beth fyddai'n cymhwyso plentyn, amgylchiadau y mae person i'w ystyried ai peidio yn gymar person, amgylchiadau y mae person i'w drin fel petai yn gwneud gwaith cyflogedig ai peidio, a dim ond meddwl wyf i: tybed a gyflwynwyd hyn braidd yn rhy gynnar? Onid ydym ni'n gwybod yr atebion i rai o'r cwestiynau hyn? Oherwydd gwyddom fod Ymchwil Arad yn cynnal gwerthusiad. Oni ddylem ni aros i hynny gael ei gyhoeddi yn yr hydref? Ac er fy mod i yn croesawu'r ffaith y bydd unrhyw reoliadau yn ddarostyngedig i'r weithdrefn gadarnhaol, wrth gwrs, gŵyr pob un ohonom ni, gyda gweithdrefn gadarnhaol, bod yn rhaid derbyn neu wrthod y broses; ni allwn ni ei diwygio. Felly, mae gennyf rai pryderon, er fy mod yn sylweddoli ei fod yn fesur technegol, efallai bod y lefel o—. Byddwn wedi disgwyl efallai ychydig mwy o fanylder, felly dim ond meddwl wyf i tybed pam nawr a pham nad efallai ymhen ychydig fisoedd, pan fyddwch chi mewn sefyllfa well i gyflwyno mwy o fanylder.

Mae'r Memorandwm Esboniadol yn nodi, oherwydd natur dechnegol y Bil, a'i apêl gyfyngedig i'r cyhoedd ehangach, nad oeddech yn teimlo ei bod hi'n briodol cynnal ymgynghoriad agored, ond byddai'n dda clywed pa elfennau o ymgynghori a fu, nid yn unig o ran rhieni ond yn enwedig o ran plant hefyd. Byddwn yn croesawu eich sylwadau ynglŷn â hynny.

A'r terfyn uchaf o £100,000 ar gyfer cymhwysedd—beth yw'r sail resymegol dros hynny? Nid oes gennyf broblem â hynny; mae'n swnio braidd fel ffigur mympwyol. Rwy'n siŵr nad yw. Efallai y gallech chi egluro i ni pam ei fod wedi'i bennu ar y lefel honno.

Yn olaf, mae eich datganiad yn sôn am wiriadau cymhwysedd a'r fiwrocratiaeth gysylltiedig a ddaw yn sgîl hynny, sy'n ei wneud, ac rwy'n dyfynnu, yn 'ddull beichus'. Wel, wrth gwrs, byddai dull cynhwysol yn dileu'r angen am lawer o hynny ond, fel y dywedaf, rydym ni'n edrych ymlaen at graffu ar y Bil ac, yn amlwg, byddwn yn dychwelyd at rai o'r materion hyn dros yr wythnosau a'r misoedd nesaf.

15:20

Llyr, thank you very much. Can I address the more fundamental question you put first of all, whilst welcoming again your broad support, and the question you raised of, 'Where next on the journey?' That's always the question we should be asking as policymakers and policy influencers. But, again, I simply do not want to overstep the mark or over-promise in terms of this particular Bill. It's a manifesto commitment, it's a very well-targeted commitment, we're absolutely convinced that it will have not only a material advantage, both economically and in terms of freeing up opportunities particularly for the most disadvantaged families, for the lowest income families, but it also has the impact—the Bill as it currently is if this Assembly passes it—on that wider foundational sector. We've talked so much about this within this Assembly, and we've talked about various foundational sectors. Well, what is more extensive across every street and every community within the country except for childcare, registered licensed childcare in all its variety? So, if we get this right and we step up the capacity, it's not only the impact on those parents and families, and some of the lowest income families in the communities we represent, but it's also the wider economic impact, I think, that's actually through stepping up the capacity issues. 

But you do ask, 'Where do we go next on the journey?' It's the right question to ask. I'm not going to give you a direct answer in the process of this Bill, I'm afraid, but I think it is the right debate that we now need to be in. But we do operate within constraints as well. The most obvious one is where we currently are with the funding regime we are in. I think there are persuasive cases being made from both within this Assembly, but also externally, for a more universal offer. But we will have to crunch through the policy implications of that. We will have to crunch through the financial implications of that as well but, for now, what we have in front of us is a very clearly defined targeted offer that is focusing on working parents. And it will have, as a step on that journey, a significant impact on many of our constituents.

There will be, by the way, I'm sure, plenty of opportunities outside of the scope of this Bill to test the wider discussions, not least in committee and here on the floor of Plenary at other opportunities as well. But this is very precise in terms of what this quite technical Bill is seeking to do. 

You asked, 'Why a framework Bill?', and this is, indeed, a framework Bill that is taking the powers—. Now, I've taken large framework Bills through Parliament before, where I've had to explain to committee members as I've taken it through, 'Don't you worry now. I will send you, within a fortnight, by the time we get to our next committee session—'. And Julie will be aware of this, being in Parliament—'In a fortnight, Julie, don't worry, I'll have written the guidance for you, I'll have written the regs in draft so you can see them'. We're not in the same situation here. We're actually piloting in seven early implementer authorities what we're planning to do. We're learning as we go. So, the guidance is out there. The eligibility criteria are out there. The HMRC—even though it's had some minor glitches, it's working in England. So, all of the aspects we're talking about we can touch and feel. It's very different from saying, 'Trust me. Further down the line I'll tell you what kind of things we'll do, what sort of information we'll be looking for from parents, who'll be eligible'. It's already described, so it's a slightly different approach to taking a framework Bill through. I'm not promising, 'Trust me; we'll get to it'. I'm saying, 'Look at what we're doing'.

We are evolving within those seven early implementer areas as well, and that's part of the reason for the flexibility. We need this framework in place. We need to get on with the discussions at both a ministerial and also a Whitehall and departmental level with HMRC and others to start really putting this in place for the 2019-20 roll out. But, meanwhile, we're also learning from those early implementers and part of the flexibility here is that Welsh Ministers—even though we're asking HMRC to do part of the operation for us, it's for Welsh Ministers to come back and say to the Assembly, 'We've learnt something new about some of the criteria, some of the eligibility, who we'd like to be involved as childcare providers. We're coming back with an affirmative motion to say, "We'd like to adjust this. Do you agree?" and so on'. 

So, it is slightly different. But let me also contrast here the—. We haven't, for example, followed the current English example of placing functions on HMRC to manage the application and eligibility checking process for their scheme. It's something we considered, but the model we've opted for—and this is what makes it different in this respect—it gives Welsh Ministers the functions in respect of administering the offer. Consequently, it gives the Welsh Government flexibility not only to chose its delivery agent but also to come back to this house and say, 'We think we can improve it. What do you think?'

So, it does give us some flexibility. It also gives us the flexibility, as I mentioned before, to come back and say, 'Well, there might be a way to, in future terms, look at the Welsh Revenue Authority as a possible deliverer' and so on. It gives that flexibility and we can come back to the house without looking for a legislative slot of primary legislation to do it.

So, I hope that explains. I know it's always a difficult challenge to say how much you put on the face of the Bill and how much should be framework powers, but we think we've got it right in this one because we're already piloting it, the HMRC system is up and running; we know what this looks like.  

Llyr, diolch yn fawr iawn. A gaf i ateb y cwestiwn mwy sylfaenol y gwnaethoch chi ei ofyn chi'n gyntaf oll, er fy mod yn croesawu unwaith eto eich cefnogaeth eang, a'r cwestiwn a ofynwyd gennych, 'ble nesaf ar y daith?' Dyna'r cwestiwn y dylem ni wastad fod yn ei ofyn fel pobl sy'n llunio polisïau a dylanwadu ar bolisïau. Ond, unwaith eto, nid wyf i eisiau mynd yn rhy bell neu addo gormod o ran y Bil penodol hwn. Mae'n ymrwymiad maniffesto, mae'n ymrwymiad wedi'i dargedu'n dda iawn, rydyn ni'n gwbl argyhoeddedig y bydd nid yn unig o fantais faterol, yn economaidd ac o ran creu cyfleoedd ar gyfer y teuluoedd mwyaf difreintiedig, yn enwedig ar gyfer y teuluoedd sydd â'r incwm isaf, ond bydd hefyd yn cael effaith—y Bil fel y mae ar hyn o bryd os bydd y Cynulliad hwn yn ei basio—ar y sector sylfaenol ehangach honno. Rydym ni wedi siarad llawer am hyn yn y Cynulliad hwn, ac rydym ni wedi siarad am wahanol sectorau sylfaenol. Wel, beth sy'n fwy cyffredin ar bob stryd ac ym mhob cymuned yn y wlad ond gofal plant, gofal plant cofrestredig a thrwyddedig yn ei holl amrywiaeth? Felly, os ydym ni'n gwneud hyn yn gywir ac yn cynyddu gallu, bydd yn cael effaith nid yn unig ar y rhieni a'r teuluoedd hynny, a rhai o'r teuluoedd gyda'r incwm isaf yn y cymunedau yr ydym yn eu cynrychioli, ond bydd hefyd yn cael effaith economaidd ehangach, rwy'n credu, sef mewn gwirionedd drwy gynyddu gallu.

Ond rydych chi yn gofyn, 'Ble ydym ni'n mynd nesaf ar y daith?' Dyna'r cwestiwn priodol i ofyn. Nid wyf am roi ateb uniongyrchol ichi ym mhroses y Bil hwn, mae arnaf ofn, ond credaf ei bod hi'n ddadl briodol y mae angen inni ei chael. Ond rydym ni yn gweithredu o fewn cyfyngiadau hefyd. Yr un mwyaf amlwg yw ein sefyllfa ar hyn o bryd yn y gyfundrefn ariannol sydd ohoni. Rwy'n credu bod dadleuon argyhoeddiadol yn y Cynulliad hwn, ond hefyd yn allanol, ar gyfer cynnig mwy cynhwysol. Ond bydd yn rhaid inni graffu ar oblygiadau polisi hynny. Bydd yn rhaid inni graffu ar y goblygiadau ariannol yn ogystal ond, ar hyn o bryd, yr hyn sydd gennym ni ger ein bron yw cynnig manwl a phenodol iawn sy'n canolbwyntio ar rieni sy'n gweithio. A bydd yn cael, fel cam ar y daith honno, effaith sylweddol ar lawer o'n hetholwyr.

Bydd, gyda llaw, rwy'n siŵr, digon o gyfleoedd y tu allan i gwmpas y Bil hwn i roi prawf ar y trafodaethau ehangach, nid yn unig yn y cyfarfod Pwyllgor ond yma yn y Cyfarfod Llawn ar brydiau eraill hefyd. Ond mae hyn yn fanwl iawn o ran yr hyn y mae'r Bil eithaf technegol hwn yn ceisio'i wneud.

Fe wnaethoch chi ofyn, 'pam Bil fframwaith?', ac mae hyn, yn wir, yn Fil fframwaith sy'n defnyddio'r pwerau—. Nawr, rwyf wedi tywys mesurau fframwaith mawr drwy'r Senedd o'r blaen, pan fu'n rhaid imi egluro i aelodau'r Pwyllgor wrth imi ei gyflwyno, 'peidiwch â phoeni. Byddaf yn anfon atoch chi, o fewn pythefnos, erbyn inni gyrraedd ein sesiwn Pwyllgor nesaf—'. A bydd Julie yn ymwybodol o hyn, gan ei bod yn y Senedd—'Mewn pythefnos, Julie, peidiwch â phoeni, byddaf wedi ysgrifennu canllawiau i chi, byddaf wedi ysgrifennu'r rheoliadau drafft fel y gallwch chi eu gweld'. Nid ydym ni yn yr un sefyllfa yma. Rydym ni mewn gwirionedd yn arbrofi mewn saith awdurdod gweithredol cynnar o ran yr hyn yr ydym yn cynllunio i'w wneud. Rydym ni'n dysgu wrth fynd. Felly, mae'r canllawiau yn bodoli. Mae'r meini prawf cymhwysedd yn bodoli. Mae Cyllid a Thollau EM—hyd yn oed os cafodd rhai mân drafferthion, yn gweithio yn Lloegr. Felly, mae pob un o'r agweddau yr ydym ni'n sôn amdanynt yn rhai diriaethol. Mae'n wahanol iawn i ddweud, 'rhowch eich ffydd ynof. Ymhellach yn y dyfodol fe wnaf i ddweud wrthych chi pa fath o bethau y byddwn yn eu gwneud, pa fath o wybodaeth y byddwn yn gofyn i rieni amdani, pwy fydd yn gymwys'. Mae hynny eisoes wedi ei ddisgrifio, felly mae'n ddull ychydig yn wahanol i gyflwyno Bil fframwaith. Nid wyf yn addo, 'ymddiriedwch ynof;  fe ddown ni at hyn'. Dweud yr wyf i, 'edrychwch ar yr hyn yr ydym ni'n ei wneud'.

Rydym ni'n esblygu yn y saith ardal cychwynnol gweithredol hynny hefyd, ac mae hynny'n rhan o'r rheswm am yr hyblygrwydd. Mae angen y fframwaith hwn ar waith arnom ni. Mae angen inni fwrw ymlaen â'r trafodaethau ar lefel Gweinidogol a hefyd yn Whitehall ac yn adrannol gyda Chyllid a Thollau EM ac eraill i ddechrau rhoi hyn ar waith mewn gwirionedd yn barod i'w gyflwyno yn 2019-20. Ond, yn y cyfamser, rydym ni hefyd yn dysgu gan yr ardaloedd gweithredol cychwynnol a rhan o'r hyblygrwydd yma yw mai Gweinidogion Cymru—er ein bod yn gofyn i gyllid a Thollau EM wneud rhan o'r gwaith i ni, lle Gweinidogion Cymru yw dod yn ôl a dweud wrth y Cynulliad, 'Rydym ni wedi dysgu rhywbeth newydd am rai o'r meini prawf, rhai o'r meini cymhwysedd, rhai o'r bobl yr hoffem eu cynnwys fel darparwyr gofal plant. Rydym ni'n dod yn ôl â chynnig cadarnhaol i ddweud, "Hoffem ni addasu hyn. A ydych chi'n cytuno?" ac ati'.

Felly, mae ychydig yn wahanol. Ond caniatewch i mi hefyd cyferbynnu'r—. Nid ydym ni wedi, er enghraifft, dilyn yr enghraifft sydd ar waith yn Lloegr ar hyn o bryd o roi swyddogaethau ar Gyllid a Thollau EM i reoli'r cais a'r broses o wirio cymhwysedd ar gyfer eu cynllun. Mae'n rhywbeth y gwnaethom ni ei ystyried, ond y model yr ydym ni wedi dewis—a dyma'r hyn sy'n ei wneud yn wahanol yn hyn o beth—mae'n rhoi swyddogaethau i Weinidogion Cymru mewn perthynas â gweinyddu'r cynnig. O ganlyniad, mae'n rhoi hyblygrwydd i Lywodraeth Cymru nid yn unig i ddewis ei asiant cyflenwi ond hefyd i ddod yn ôl at y Senedd hon a dweud, 'Rydym ni'n credu y gallwn ni ei wella. Beth yw eich barn chi?'

Felly, mae yn rhoi rhywfaint o hyblygrwydd inni. Mae hefyd yn rhoi inni'r hyblygrwydd, fel y soniais yn gynharach, i ddod yn ôl a dweud, 'Wel, efallai bod ffordd, yn y dyfodol, i edrych ar Awdurdod Cyllid Cymru fel darparwr posibl' ac ati. Mae'n rhoi'r hyblygrwydd hwnnw, a gallwn ddod yn ôl i'r Senedd heb edrych am slot deddfwriaethol o ddeddfwriaeth sylfaenol i wneud hynny.

Gobeithiaf, felly, fod hynny'n esbonio'r sefyllfa. Rwy'n gwybod ei bod hi bob amser yn her dweud faint rydych yn ei roi ar wyneb y Bil a faint ddylai fod yn bwerau fframwaith, ond rydym yn meddwl ein bod wedi cael pethau'n iawn gyda hyn oherwydd rydym ni eisoes yn ei dreialu, mae system Cyllid a Thollau EM yn weithredol; gwyddom sut olwg sydd ar hyn.

15:25

We're almost halfway through this debate and I've got a number of speakers who would like to contribute. I'd be very grateful if both questions and answers could be kept as succinct as possible. Michelle Brown. 

Rydym ni bron hanner ffordd drwy'r ddadl hon ac mae gen i nifer o siaradwyr sydd eisiau cyfrannu. Byddwn yn ddiolchgar iawn pe gellid cadw'r cwestiynau a'r atebion mor gryno â phosib. Michelle Brown.

Thank you, and thank you for your statement, Minister. I'd also like to thank the Minister for the courtesy that he's shown in meeting with me in advance of this statement. His communication of the broad principles in favour of the childcare funding Bill were very clear and comprehensive and I understand the reasoning behind using HMRC and it does appear to me to be quite sensible. HMRC are already in possession of the relevant data so it does seems a logical choice. I'd also like to compliment the Minister on his implementation of the early testing phase of the childcare offer. His approach on gathering essential data and fine tuning the offer shows that he's approached the programme with strategic thought. A discussion of the administration of the offer by HMRC and outline of these finer details were also very helpful. However, it's on these finer details and the administration arrangements that I and my party have questions and concerns.

I note that there was an opposition day debate in the House of Commons on 26 October 2016, brought by the Minister's Labour Party colleague Rebecca Long-Bailey MP, which raised a number of concerns about HMRC's work on tax credits contracted out to a company called Concentrix. It noted that the company had not met performance standards fully set out in its contract with HMRC. It also emphasised the human factor, including the suffering of women and single mothers who erroneously had tax credits withdrawn by the company, acting on behalf of HMRC. The debate achieved the broad consensus of representatives from all parties in the House of Commons, the consensus being that the contractor's performance was not up to standard and it had caused real human suffering. No-one in this place would want to see these problems replicated in the administration of childcare funding in Wales, so to that end I want to conclude by asking the Minister two things. Firstly, will there be an opportunity for both the Assembly as a whole and the appropriate committees to scrutinise the procurement costs and the procurement terms of the programme from HMRC? And, secondly, will there be an opportunity for the Assembly as a whole to assent or not assent to the HMRC using an external contractor to administer the programme? Thank you.  

Diolch i chi, a diolch ichi am eich datganiad, Gweinidog. Hoffwn hefyd ddiolch i'r Gweinidog am y cwrteisi a ddangosodd yn cyfarfod â mi cyn y datganiad hwn. Llwyddodd i gyfleu yr egwyddorion cyffredinol o blaid y Bil ariannu gofal plant yn glir ac yn gynhwysfawr iawn ac rwy'n deall y rhesymeg o ran defnyddio Cyllid a Thollau EM ac ymddengys i mi yn eithaf synhwyrol. Mae gan Gyllid a Thollau EM eisoes y data perthnasol felly mae hi yn ymddangos yn ddewis rhesymegol. Hoffwn hefyd ganmol y Gweinidog am roi cyfnod arbrofol cynnar y cynnig gofal plant ar waith. Mae sut yr aeth ati i gasglu data hanfodol a mireinio'r cynnig yn dangos ei fod wedi dynesu at y rhaglen â meddwl strategol. Roedd trafodaeth ynglŷn â sut y byddai Cyllid a Thollau EM yn gweinyddu'r cynllun ac amlinelliad o'r manylion hyn hefyd yn ddefnyddiol iawn. Fodd bynnag, mae gennyf fi a'm plaid gwestiynau a phryderon ynglŷn â'r glo mân a'r trefniadau gweinyddu hyn.

Nodaf y bu dadl dydd yr wrthblaid yn Nhŷ'r Cyffredin ar 26 Hydref 2016, a gyflwynwyd gan gyd-Aelod y Gweinidog yn y Blaid Lafur, sef yr Aelod Seneddol Rebecca Long-Bailey, lle mynegwyd pryderon lu ynghylch gwaith Cyllid a Thollau EM ar gredydau treth a gafodd ei gontractio i gwmni o'r enw Concentrix. Nododd nad oedd y cwmni wedi cyflawni'r safonau perfformiad a nodwyd yn llawn yn ei gontract gyda Chyllid a Thollau EM. Pwysleisiodd hefyd y ffactor dynol, gan gynnwys dioddefaint merched a mamau sengl y diddymwyd eu credydau treth yn ddi-sail gan y cwmni, oedd yn gweithredu ar ran Cyllid a Thollau EM. Enillodd y ddadl gonsensws eang gan gynrychiolwyr o bob plaid yn Nhŷ'r Cyffredin, y consensws oedd nad oedd perfformiad y contractwr yn unol â'r safonau disgwyliedig a'i fod wedi achosi dioddefaint dynol gwirioneddol. Ni fyddai unrhyw un yn y lle hwn eisiau gweld y problemau hyn yn cael eu hailadrodd wrth weinyddu ariannu gofal plant yng Nghymru, felly rwyf am gloi drwy ofyn dau beth i'r Gweinidog i'r perwyl hwnnw. Yn gyntaf, a fydd yn gyfle i'r Cynulliad yn ei gyfanrwydd a'r pwyllgorau priodol graffu ar gostau caffael a thelerau caffael y rhaglen gan Gyllid a Thollau EM? Ac, yn ail, a fydd yn gyfle i'r Cynulliad yn ei gyfanrwydd gydsynio neu beidio â chydsynio i Gyllid a Thollau EM ddefnyddio contractwr allanol i weinyddu'r rhaglen? Diolch i chi.

15:30

Thank you, Michelle, and, again, thank you for the broad welcome there. On the HMRC issues, we are aware—everybody's aware because they've been made quite public—of some of the early implementation problems there have been, both in terms of the tax credits, but also their offer, their parallel offer, in England. However, they are overcoming those, and we've been in discussion with them while we've been discussing at a high level the principle of utilising HMRC as our provider. And we have confidence that, actually, the glitches that they've had will not only be overcome, but that they'll have the machine working smoothly, particularly by the time that we are looking for roll-out, which is 2019-20, and we'll be able to actually watch what is going on in our engagement with them, which is intensive at an official level, to make sure that that is happening.

I will indeed make sure that there is opportunity to come back and report on how discussions with HMRC are going, how the contract is shaping up, because what this Bill will enable us to do is to engage at more than high level, but actually in the detail of the contractual discussions with HMRC. And I will make sure that there are opportunities both for committees but also for Assembly Members generally to find out what is going on with those and to input into them as well. 

In terms of external contractors, I'm not convinced that we are in a position, as Welsh Government, as far as I understand, to insist that they make no use of any external contractors. So, for example, if part of the offer are things such as a digital platform, are we going to object if a digital platform is designed by an external contractor and so on? I think, Michelle, you're referring to more fundamental aspects of the delivery of it, but digital gateway to it is part of it as well and things can go wrong with that. I'll take that away and consider it and look at it, but I suspect that most Government agencies use some form of external contracting. What we need to make sure is that the glitches that they've experienced early on are not repeated, and that we have confidence, not only in HMRC taking on the overall contract from Welsh Government, for which we will be paying, but also that any organisations they subcontract to also have our confidence in delivering this very effectively. But thank you for those points. 

Diolch i chi, Michelle, ac, unwaith eto, diolch ichi am y croeso eang hwnnw. O ran y materion yn ymwneud â Chyllid a Thollau EM, rydym yn ymwybodol—mae pawb yn ymwybodol oherwydd buont yn bethau eithaf cyhoeddus—o rai o'r problemau gweithredu cynnar a fu, o ran y credydau treth, ond hefyd eu cynnig, eu cynnig cyfochrog, yn Lloegr. Fodd bynnag, maent yn goresgyn yr agweddau hynny, ac rydym wedi bod yn trafod gyda nhw wrth inni drafod ar yr haenau uchaf yr egwyddor o ddefnyddio Cyllid a Thollau EM fel ein darparwr. Ac rydym yn ffyddiog, mewn gwirionedd, bod yr anawsterau a gawsant, nid yn unig yn cael eu goresgyn, ond y bydd y broses yn gweithio'n ddidrafferth ganddynt, yn enwedig erbyn pryd yr ydym yn gobeithio cyflwyno'r cynnig, sef 2019-20, a byddwn yn gallu gwylio mewn gwirionedd beth fydd yn digwydd yn ein hymwneud â nhw, sy'n ddwys ar lefel swyddogol, i wneud yn siŵr bod hynny'n digwydd.

Fe wnaf i sicrhau yn wir y ceir cyfle i ddod yn ôl a chyflwyno adroddiad ynglŷn â sut mae trafodaethau gyda Chyllid a Thollau EM yn datblygu, sut mae'r contract yn datblygu, oherwydd yr hyn y bydd y Bil hwn yn ein galluogi i wneud yw bod yn rhan nid yn unig o'r elfennau pwysig, ond mewn gwirionedd, ymwneud â manylion y trafodaethau cytundebol gyda Chyllid a Thollau EM. A byddaf yn sicrhau y ceir cyfleoedd ar gyfer pwyllgorau, ond hefyd ar gyfer Aelodau'r Cynulliad yn gyffredinol i ddarganfod beth sy'n digwydd yn hynny o beth ac i allu cyfrannu atynt hefyd.

O ran contractwyr allanol, nid wyf yn argyhoeddedig ein bod ni, Lywodraeth Cymru, mewn sefyllfa, os wyf yn deall yn gywir, i fynnu nad ydynt yn defnyddio unrhyw gontractwyr allanol o gwbl. Felly, er enghraifft, os yw rhan o'r cynnig yn ymwneud â rhywbeth fel llwyfan digidol, ydym ni'n mynd i wrthwynebu os caiff llwyfan digidol ei ddylunio gan gontractwr allanol ac ati? Rwy'n credu, Michelle, eich bod yn cyfeirio at agweddau mwy sylfaenol o'i gyflawni, ond mae cael porth digidol ar ei gyfer yn rhan ohono hefyd a gall pethau fynd o'i le gyda hynny. Fe wnaf i bendroni ynghylch hynny a'i ystyried, ond rwy'n tybio bod y rhan fwyaf o asiantaethau'r Llywodraeth yn defnyddio rhyw fath o gontractio allanol. Yr hyn y mae angen inni ei sicrhau yw na chaiff yr anawsterau y maen nhw wedi eu profi'n gynnar yn y broses eu hailadrodd, a bod gennym ni hyder, nid yn unig yng Nghyllid a Thollau EM yn cymryd y contract yn ei gyfanrwydd gan Lywodraeth Cymru, y byddwn yn talu amdano, ond hefyd ein bod yn ffyddiog y bydd unrhyw sefydliadau y maent yn is-gontractio iddynt yn cyflawni hyn yn effeithiol iawn. Ond diolch i chi am y pwyntiau hynny.

I welcome the Minister's statement today. I think we're really looking forward to this being implemented. Cardiff is certainly waiting for it to come to them and I'm frequently asked about when we are going to have it. 

Rwy'n croesawu datganiad y Gweinidog heddiw. Rwy'n credu ein bod yn edrych ymlaen yn fawr at weithredu hyn. Mae Caerdydd yn sicr yn aros i'r cynnig ddod atyn nhw, a gofynnir imi'n aml pryd fydd hynny. 

We'll get there. We will get there. 

Hir pob aros. Hir pob aros. 

I know we will. So, it's good that we're doing this, which, as the Minister said, is a specifically targeted offer to working parents. And I'd just like to say how pleased I am that it is covering the school holidays, because I think, as any parent here will know, for a working parent, the school holidays are a nightmare. And so having this to actually cover the school holidays I think is very good, and I think it makes it a generous offer.

I just wanted to make some points about the administration. I think it's absolutely sensible to use HMRC, and I certainly support that going ahead, but I am concerned about how flexible HMRC can be. Thinking of parents who change jobs frequently, just about manage, and sometimes have to have more than one job in order to manage the households, and thinking about that sort of family, I would like the Minister to tell us how we would be able to cope with rapidly changing circumstances. And the other issue, of course, is parents who are in self-employment, where the income could be different every week, virtually. So, I wondered if this had been covered in thinking about how HMRC would actually administer the scheme. 

Rwy'n gwybod hynny. Felly, mae'n dda ein bod yn gwneud hyn, sydd, fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog, yn gynnig sydd wedi ei dargedu'n benodol i rieni sy'n gweithio. A hoffwn ddweud pa mor falch yr wyf i ei fod yn cwmpasu'r gwyliau ysgol, oherwydd credaf, fel y gŵyr unrhyw riant yma, i riant sy'n gweithio, mae'r gwyliau ysgol yn hunllef. Ac felly mae'r ffaith bod hyn yn cwmpasu'r gwyliau ysgol yn dda iawn mewn gwirionedd, ac rwy'n meddwl ei fod yn gynnig hael.

Dim ond eisiau gwneud ambell sylw oeddwn i am y weinyddiaeth. Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n gwbl synhwyrol defnyddio Cyllid a Thollau EM, ac rwy'n sicr yn cefnogi hynny wrth inni fynd rhagom, ond rwyf yn bryderus ynglŷn â pha mor hyblyg y gall Cyllid a Thollau EM fod. Wrth feddwl am rieni sy'n newid swyddi yn aml, sydd prin yn ymdopi, ac weithiau yn gorfod cael mwy nag un swydd er mwyn rheoli'r aelwydydd, ac wrth feddwl am y math hwnnw o deulu, hoffwn i'r Gweinidog ddweud wrthym ni sut y byddem ni'n gallu ymdopi ag amgylchiadau sy'n newid yn gyflym. A'r mater arall, wrth gwrs, yw rhieni hunan-gyflogedig, ble gallai'r incwm fod yn wahanol bob wythnos bron. Felly, meddwl oeddwn i, tybed a yw hyn wedi ei gynnwys wrth ystyried sut y byddai Cyllid a Thollau EM mewn gwirionedd yn gweinyddu'r cynllun.

Julie, thank you, and 'yes' to the last question in terms of self-employment when it comes to the detailed design of this, and, of course, the England programme as well. The self-employment aspect has been taken on board. In terms of flexibility within the system, I'm pleased to tell you, Julie, that one of the advantages of using the HMRC system, both for English and Welsh language speakers, is the simplicity of the application, because part of using the HMRC system in concert with information sharing between Government departments, means that, in effect, we're not asking them to bring us their current or monthly pay sheets, find all the complex paraphernalia you need to make the application, and decide whether you're eligible—it'll be done for them. It's working effectively already. But, secondly, there's a helpline that runs alongside that, so people who have difficulty with that—there's a helpline to assist them as well. And the helpline as well will make sure, and the commissioning will also—. HMRC actually have quite a good record in terms of bilingual gateways as well, but we'll make sure that within this specifically as well for an answer in English—.

But the results are of course built into this appeals procedure as well, so that, because there will be situations where individuals don't quite fit within the criteria and the eligibility criteria, they also will be able to go through an appeals procedure on the basis of their application being turned down. So, there will be support there, but, again, the great thing about this is we have the—the fact that the England-based HMRC system is now up and running, we can learn from that. We can learn about some of these issues of flexibility, and get it absolutely right when we take ours forward. And just to confirm, because I know people do raise it with me about Cardiff, the reason we're in the seven areas that we currently are in is we're trying different things in different areas. It will come to Cardiff, and when it comes to Cardiff, it will be the the bee's knees—it will be the right thing.

Julie, diolch i chi, ac 'ydy' i'r cwestiwn olaf o ran hunan-gyflogaeth ynglŷn â dyluniad manwl hyn, ac, wrth gwrs, rhaglen Lloegr hefyd. Rhoddwyd sylw i'r agwedd hunan-gyflogaeth. O ran hyblygrwydd o fewn y system, rwy'n falch o ddweud wrthych chi, Julie, mai un o fanteision defnyddio system Cyllid a Thollau EM, ar gyfer siaradwyr Cymraeg a Saesneg fel ei gilydd, yw pa mor syml yw'r cais, oherwydd mae rhan o ddefnyddio system Cyllid a Thollau EM ar y cyd â rhannu gwybodaeth rhwng adrannau'r Llywodraeth, yn golygu, mewn gwirionedd, nad ydym ni'n gofyn iddyn nhw ddod â'u taflenni cyflog presennol neu fisol inni gael eu gweld, dod o hyd i'r holl betheuach cymhleth y mae eu hangen arnoch chi i wneud y cais, a phenderfynu a ydych chi'n gymwys—bydd wedi ei wneud ar eu cyfer. Mae'n gweithio'n effeithiol eisoes. Ond, yn ail, ceir llinell gymorth sy'n bodoli ochr yn ochr â hynny, felly os yw pobl yn cael anhawster â hynny—ceir llinell gymorth i'w helpu hefyd. A bydd y llinell gymorth yn sicrhau, a bydd y comisiynu hefyd—. Mae gan Cyllid a Thollau EM record dda mewn gwirionedd o ran pyrth dwyieithog hefyd, ond byddwn yn sicrhau o fewn hyn yn benodol yn ogystal ag ar gyfer ateb yn Saesneg—.

Ond mae'r canlyniadau wedi eu cynnwys wrth gwrs yn y drefn apeliadau hon hefyd, fel eu bod, oherwydd y bydd sefyllfaoedd lle nad yw unigolion yn cyd-fynd yn hollol â'r meini prawf a'r meini prawf cymhwysedd, bydd gweithdrefn apelio ar gael iddynt hefyd os gwrthodir eu cais. Felly, bydd cymorth ar gael, ond, unwaith eto, y peth gwych am hyn yw bod gennym ni'r—y ffaith bod system Cyllid a Thollau EM yn Lloegr yn awr wedi'i sefydlu ac yn gweithredu, gallwn ddysgu oddi wrth hynny. Gallwn ddysgu am rai o'r materion hyn o ran hyblygrwydd, a chael y broses yn hollol gywir wrth ddatblygu un ein hunain. Ac i gadarnhau, oherwydd rwy'n gwybod fod pobl yn crybwyll Caerdydd imi, y rheswm yr ydym ni yn y saith ardal yr ydym ni ynddynt ar hyn o bryd yw ein bod yn ceisio gwneud pethau gwahanol mewn gwahanol ardaloedd. Bydd yn dod i Gaerdydd, a phan ddaw i Gaerdydd, bydd yn benigamp—bydd y peth iawn.

15:35

I'm glad to hear this will be the bee's knees by the time it comes to Cardiff. And I'd like to thank the Minister particularly for his clarity that this childcare element is aimed at working parents, and there are trade-offs, and there are some who won't benefit, and he's taken that approach, and we will see how it works, in line with his party's manifesto. I'd also say that, because it's 48 weeks a year, some of the other studies—be they on Quebec, or elsewhere—may not be so relevant for what the impact will be on the extent to which parents will work. And I hope he does succeed in seeing significantly higher numbers, and, if so, that should feed through to the resources available to Welsh Government, once the Welsh rates of income tax are devolved next year.

Could I, though, question the approach being taken to take powers to Welsh Ministers in order to use HMRC as an agent? There seems to be consensus across the Chamber—or at least so far—in terms of using HMRC, and HMRC has tried-and-tested processes for how it keeps information secure. And they include very clear protocols on the access, or otherwise, of UK Ministers to information on individual taxpayers. Yet, the Minister says that he wants legislation that enables Welsh Ministers to access the information needed to confirm eligibility. Why? HMRC works in this area by seeing whether an applicant is eligible, and if so, issuing a code to that applicant to allow them to access the childcare for which they're eligible. If HMRC is going to be the Welsh Government's agent, as he says, why does he need to have Welsh Ministers able to access taxpayers' information in this way?

Could he also clarify some of the linkages he's making between the English—or what he describes as the English, but I believe may in certain contexts be a UK system—and what is proposed in Wales? He refers to minor glitches in the England model. I actually think it's been major glitches in a UK-wide operation of tax-free childcare, which parents are eligible for in Wales, on exactly the same basis that they are in England, and it's that one that's had the big problem. The interaction has come because there are three types of free childcare in England: for two-year-olds on the basis of eligibility of certain benefits, including tax credits, where the income is below £16,190 a year; there's then the universal offer, which is for the 15 hours; and then there's the 30 hours for three and four-year-olds, which has been the major problem, and the major problem has been because of the linkage with the UK-wide system HMRC operates for the tax-free childcare. In order to get that 30 hours rather than the 15 hours they were getting before, eligible parents from England have had to set up a childcare account, which would enable them to access the UK-wide benefit, and has been the gateway for receiving those extra hours for the three-year-olds. And it's that area that there's been this very major problem with. Will the Minister confirm that what Welsh Government is proposing to do is to make the whole of the Welsh system dependent on that gateway? 

Can he also clarify why it is necessary to set up an account for UK-wide tax-free childcare to access a free childcare offer for the 48 hours? That's the model HMRC has chosen to date, but it's the one that's been leading to the problems. He is hopefully correct that these problems will iron out, but I would draw to his attention that the whole system is being made dependent on that and alert him to some of the risks contingent on it.

Rwy'n falch o glywed y bydd hyn yn benigamp erbyn y daw i Gaerdydd. Ac fe hoffwn i ddiolch i'r Gweinidog yn arbennig am ei eglurder yn dweud bod yr elfen gofal plant hon wedi'i anelu at rieni sy'n gweithio, ac mae sawl cyfaddawd, ac mae rhai na fyddant yn elwa, ac mae wedi mynd ati yn y modd hwnnw, a byddwn yn gweld sut y mae'n gweithio, yn unol â maniffesto ei blaid. Fe hoffwn i ddweud hefyd, oherwydd ei fod yn cwmpasu 48 wythnos y flwyddyn, ni fydd rhai o'r astudiaethau eraill—boed ynglŷn â Quebec, neu fannau eraill—efallai mor berthnasol o ran beth fydd yr effaith ar y graddau y bydd rhieni'n gweithio. Ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd yn llwyddo i weld niferoedd sylweddol uwch, ac, os felly, dylai hynny effeithio ar yr adnoddau sydd ar gael i Lywodraeth Cymru, pan ddatganolir y cyfraddau treth incwm i Gymru y flwyddyn nesaf.

A gaf i, fodd bynnag, gwestiynu'r dull o roi pwerau i Weinidogion Cymru er mwyn defnyddio Cyllid a Thollau EM yn asiant? Ymddengys fod consensws yn y Siambr—neu o leiaf hyd yma—o ran defnyddio Cyllid a Thollau EM, ac mae gan Gyllid a Thollau EM brosesau sicr o ran sut mae'n cadw gwybodaeth yn ddiogel. Ac maent yn cynnwys protocolau clir iawn ynglŷn â rhyddid, neu fel arall, Gweinidogion y DU i weld gwybodaeth am drethdalwyr unigol. Eto, dywed y Gweinidog ei fod eisiau deddfwriaeth sy'n galluogi Gweinidogion Cymru i weld yr wybodaeth sydd ei hangen i gadarnhau cymhwysedd. Pam? Mae Cyllid a Thollau EM yn gweithio yn y maes hwn drwy weld a yw'r ymgeisydd yn gymwys, ac os felly, maent yn rhoi cyfeirnod i'r ymgeisydd hwnnw i'w alluogi i gael y gofal plant maent yn gymwys i'w gael. Os mai Cyllid a Thollau EM fydd asiant Llywodraeth Cymru, fel y dywed, pam fod angen iddo sicrhau y gall Gweinidogion Cymru weld gwybodaeth trethdalwyr yn y modd hwn?

Hefyd a wnaiff hefyd egluro rhai o'r cysylltiadau y mae'n eu gwneud rhwng y system yn Lloegr—neu yr hyn y mae'n ei alw yn  system Lloegr, ond y credaf efallai mewn rhai cyd-destunau ei fod yn system ar gyfer y DU—a'r hyn a gynigir yng Nghymru? Mae'n cyfeirio at fân drafferthion ym model Lloegr. Rwy'n credu mewn gwirionedd y bu anawsterau mawr ledled y DU wrth weinyddu gofal plant di-dreth, y mae rhieni yn gymwys ar ei gyfer yng Nghymru, ar yr un sail yn union ag y maent yn Lloegr, a dyna'r agwedd lle bu problem fawr. Digwyddodd hyn oherwydd bod tri math o ofal plant am ddim yn Lloegr: ar gyfer plant dyflwydd oed ar sail cymhwysedd budd-daliadau penodol, gan gynnwys credydau treth, os yw'r incwm yn is na £16,190 flwyddyn; yna, ceir y cynnig cyffredinol, sydd ar gyfer y 15 awr; ac yna mae 30 awr ar gyfer plant tair a pedair blwydd oed, sydd y broblem fawr, ac sydd wedi bod yn broblem fawr oherwydd y cyswllt gyda'r system y mae Cyllid a Thollau yn ei gweithredu ledled y DU ar gyfer gofal plant di-dreth. Er mwyn cael y 30 awr hwnnw yn hytrach na'r 15 awr a gaent cyn hynny, mae rhieni cymwys o Loegr wedi gorfod sefydlu cyfrif gofal plant, a fyddai'n eu galluogi i fanteisio ar y budd-dal sydd ar gael ledled y DU, a dyma fu'r porth ar gyfer cael yr oriau ychwanegol hynny ar gyfer y plant teirblwydd oed. A dyna'r maes ble cafwyd y broblem fawr iawn hon. A wnaiff y Gweinidog gadarnhau mai'r hyn y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn bwriadu ei wneud yw gwneud system Cymru gyfan yn ddibynnol ar y porth hwnnw?

A all hefyd egluro pam mae'n angenrheidiol creu cyfrif ar gyfer gofal plant di-dreth ar gyfer y DU gyfan i gael cynnig gofal plant am ddim am y 48 awr? Dyna'r model y mae Cyllid a Thollau EM wedi ei ddewis hyd yma, ond dyna'r un sydd wedi bod yn arwain at y problemau. Gobeithio ei fod yn gywir y caiff y problemau hyn eu datrys, ond carwn dynnu ei sylw at y ffaith y bydd y system gyfan yn dibynnu ar hwnnw a thynnu ei sylw at rai o'r peryglon sydd ynghlwm wrth hynny.

15:40

Mark, thank you very much. Probably one of my failings is due to my upbringing: I'm overly polite about what I describe as minor glitches or teething problems, but we are confident—and we have been in discussions with HMRC, both in terms of their tax offer, but also in terms of the childcare offer—that these problems are being ironed out, and will indeed be totally ironed out by the time we come to our use of their mechanisms for delivering our childcare offer. We are aware of these issues with the childcare service in recent months, both in relation to tax-free childcare and the England offer. Now, HMRC are addressing these. We're confident that these troubles will have been resolved by the time we come to use this system. We will also, by the way, have this advantage in that we can learn the lessons of these initial problems from HMRC in how we design and how we commission, and there is an important part here in how we commission our offer through HMRC, and also the issues that they've had with the HMRC and the Department for Education as well, to avoid the problems that they've had. So, we will put in place appropriate governance arrangements to oversee the development and the implementation of this approach and the digital solutions inherent in this.  

In terms of the legislative basis, this Bill provides the legislative basis for Welsh Ministers to make the arrangements for the administration of the childcare offer. Whilst we're proposing we engage with HMRC in the short to medium term, in that design and the commissioning, it could well be, and I'm pleased that we have put the flexibility within the Bill to provide the Welsh Government with the flexibility to change the delivery agent in the future, if we so wish. It's as a delivery agent acting on behalf of Welsh Ministers—as a delivery agent acting on behalf Welsh Ministers—that HMRC will be subject to the scheme that we commission with them, and also the Welsh language service standards that we will make sure are within there, and we will work closely with them to ensure compliance. We are marking the glad situation that with the early problems that they've had, both in the tax aspects and the free childcare offers in England, they've experienced them early and they are now overcoming them, and when we roll ours out we're confident that we won't experience the same problems. 

I realise that I've been remiss in not responding to a specific point in the question as well to do with formal consultation. 

Mark, diolch yn fawr iawn. Mae'n debyg bod un o fy methiannau oherwydd fy magwraeth: rwy'n rhy gwrtais ynghylch yr hyn yr wyf yn ei ddisgrifio fel mân anawsterau neu broblemau cychwynnol, ond rydym yn ffyddiog—a buom yn cynnal trafodaethau â Cyllid a Thollau EM, o ran eu cynnig treth, ond hefyd o ran y cynnig gofal plant—bod y problemau hyn yn cael eu datrys, ac yn wir, y byddant wedi eu datrys yn llwyr erbyn y daw hi'n bryd inni ddefnyddio eu dulliau o gyflawni ein cynnig gofal plant. Rydym yn ymwybodol o'r materion hyn gyda'r gwasanaeth gofal plant yn ystod y misoedd diwethaf, o ran gofal plant di-dreth a'r cynnig yn Lloegr. Nawr, mae Cyllid a Thollau EM yn mynd i'r afael â'r rhain. Rydym yn ffyddiog y bydd yr helyntion hyn wedi eu datrys pan ddaw hi'n bryd inni ddefnyddio'r system hon. Bydd gennym ni hefyd, gyda llaw, y fantais hon sef y gallwn ni ddysgu gwersi o'r problemau cychwynnol hyn gan Cyllid a Thollau EM o ran sut yr ydym ni'n dylunio a sut yr ydym ni'n comisiynu, ac mae yma agwedd bwysig yn y fan yma sef sut yr ydym ni'n comisiynu ein cynnig drwy Cyllid a Thollau EM, a'r materion y maent wedi eu cael hefyd gyda Cyllid a Thollau EM a'r Adran Addysg hefyd, i osgoi'r problemau y maen nhw wedi eu cael. Felly, byddwn yn rhoi trefniadau llywodraethu priodol ar waith i oruchwylio'r broses o ddatblygu a gweithredu'r dull hwn a'r agweddau digidol sy'n rhan greiddiol ohono.

O ran y sail ddeddfwriaethol, mae'r Bil hwn yn darparu'r sail ddeddfwriaethol i Weinidogion Cymru wneud y trefniadau ar gyfer gweinyddu'r cynnig gofal plant. Er ein bod yn cynnig ymwneud â Cyllid a Thollau EM yn y tymor byr i'r tymor canolig, o ran y dylunio a'r comisiynu, mae'n bosib iawn, ac rwy'n falch ein bod wedi rhoi hyblygrwydd yn y Bil i roi hyblygrwydd i Lywodraeth Cymru newid yr asiant darparu yn y dyfodol, os ydym yn dymuno gwneud hynny. Fel asiant yn gweithredu ar ran Gweinidogion Cymru—fel asiant sy'n gweithredu ar ran Gweinidogion Cymru—bydd Cyllid a Thollau EM yn cydymffurfio â'r cynllun y byddwn yn ei gomisiynu gyda nhw, a hefyd y safonau gwasanaeth iaith Gymraeg y byddwn yn sicrhau sydd wedi eu cynnwys , a byddwn yn gweithio'n agos gyda nhw i sicrhau cydymffurfiaeth. Rydym yn nodi'r sefyllfa falch, gyda'r problemau cynnar a gawson nhw, yn yr agweddau ar dreth a'r cynnig gofal plant am ddim yn Lloegr, maen nhw wedi eu profi'n gynnar a bellach maent yn eu goresgyn, ac wrth inni gyflwyno ein cynnig ni rydym yn ffyddiog na fyddwn yn profi'r un problemau.

Rwy'n sylweddoli y bûm yn esgeulus wrth beidio ag ymateb i bwynt penodol yn y cwestiwn yn ogystal â gydag ymgynghori'n ffurfiol.

There is one more speaker, but if you want to do that now.  

Mae un siaradwr ar ôl, ond os hoffech chi wneud hynny'n awr.

Thanks. Llyr, my apologies. You asked why there's been no formal consultation. This is slightly unusual from a lot of Bills that come forward, in that we're out there in the field doing the stuff at the moment. So, one: it's a technical Bill, so we didn't feel, on balance, that a consultation on the draft was necessary. Instead, we've discussed the Bill, the approach taken with it, with key stakeholders, including local authorities but also childcare providers, through the early implementer groups, live as we've been doing it. I think every week I've been having updates on how those discussions are going and what they're learning with members of the stakeholder reference groups and also with UK Government departments, and that's still ongoing and will be ongoing all the way to full roll-out. Of course, the offer itself is subject to this programme of early implementation. It's allowing us to test-drive it and to evaluate it's delivery. So, as part of that process we're also engaging with a range of parents—extensive numbers of parents, into the hundreds and thousands—childcare providers and other stakeholders on the delivery and operation of the offer. So, in this particular circumstance with this Bill, we didn't feel it was necessary for a consultation again on it. We're out there in the field doing it and hearing it in live time. Thank you. 

Diolch. Llyr, ymddiheuriadau. Gwnaethoch chi ofyn pam na fu unrhyw ymgynghori ffurfiol. Mae hyn ychydig yn anarferol o'i gymharu â llawer o Filiau sy'n cael eu cyflwyno, sef ein bod ni wrthi'n gwneud y gwaith caib a rhaw ar hyn o bryd. Felly, un: mae'n Fil technegol, felly doeddem ni ddim yn teimlo, ar y cyfan, bod angen ymgynghori ar y drafft. Yn hytrach, rydym wedi trafod y Bil, y dull a ddefnyddir, gyda rhanddeiliaid allweddol, gan gynnwys awdurdodau lleol ond hefyd darparwyr gofal plant, drwy'r grwpiau gweithredu cynnar, yn uniongyrchol wrth inni fod yn gwneud hynny. Rwy'n credu bob wythnos rwyf wedi bod yn cael diweddariadau ynglŷn â sut mae'r trafodaethau hynny yn mynd rhagddynt a beth maen nhw'n ei ddysgu gydag aelodau o grwpiau cyfeirio rhanddeiliaid a hefyd adrannau Llywodraeth y DU, ac mae hynny'n dal i fynd rhagddo a bydd yn parhau i fynd rhagddo nes y caiff ei gyflwyno'n llawn. Wrth gwrs, mae'r cynnig ei hun yn ddibynol ar y rhaglen hon o weithredu cynnar. Mae'n caniatáu i ni roi prawf arno ac i werthuso sut y caiff ei weithredu. Felly, fel rhan o'r broses honno rydym ni hefyd yn ymgysylltu ag amrywiaeth o rieni—nifer fawr o rieni, cannoedd ar filoedd—darparwyr gofal plant a rhanddeiliaid eraill ynglŷn â gweithredu a darparu'r cynnig hwn. Felly, yn yr amgylchiad penodol hwn gyda'r Bil hwn, doeddwn i ddim yn teimlo ei fod yn angenrheidiol i ymgynghori eto yn ei gylch. Rydym ni'n gweithio arno ac yn gwrando ar y sylwadau yn uniongyrchol. Diolch.

Ac yn olaf, Jenny Rathbone.

And finally, Jenny Rathbone.

Diolch. One of the lessons of this whole situation is we mustn't reinvent the wheel. Just looking at the strategy that you're adopting for delivering this manifesto pledge, which is targeting working parents of three and four-year-olds, we clearly need to prioritise those families who want to work but can't afford to work at the moment, and who will become eligible as soon as they can get the sums to add up—you know, they've got the place and they can accept the work placement. That's the way we need to do it.

I wanted to look at how we are going to possibly tie this in with universal credit, because many of my families are on variable hours, including zero-hours contracts. One of the theoretical benefits of universal credit is that it will have real-time information about what somebody has earned in the last week and therefore how that will impact on the amount of money they're eligible for. So, I can see the benefits of working with the tax and revenue service, but I can also see the benefit of working with Jobcentre Plus, so I think it would be useful to clarify why you aren't thinking along those lines.

I absolutely understand that we can't at the moment afford to do what we all want to do, which is to provide a universal service for all three- and four-year-olds. But it seems that, in the meantime, there's an awful lot we can do using the existing resources. For example, local authorities every five years have to provide a childcare sufficiency assessment, but only every five years. So, in the interim, Cardiff, for example, doesn't know how many households have parents who are working, doesn't know the number of three- and four-year-olds and doesn't know how many three- and four-year-olds are accessing a childcare place. That, for me, illustrates the need for the public services boards to take ownership of this, because by health and education services and social services working together we can pool the information that everybody holds to some extent, and that would enable us to be much more up-to-the-minute on what care is available where.

So, I have a particular focus I want to concentrate on when Cardiff does become an early years implementor, which is how we're going to expand wraparound care based on the number of children who already have nursery places in primary schools, but obviously the room where they're getting that early years place can't be used for the wraparound care because there's another cohort coming in in the afternoon.

Why is not possible for social services to use early years childcare placements for children who they have concerns about? Because we know from the EPI evidence that this is the best way of, if you like, beating the disadvantage that some children get from birth. One of the other issues for me is that we only have one integrated children's centre in the whole of Cardiff, which is obviously in Ely, and which is a centre of excellence for achieving excellent outcomes for all children, whatever their circumstances.

So, those need to be our objectives and it seems to me that, whilst I appreciate that the Government only has the money at the moment for those who have working parents, we also need to use other streams of programmes—Flying Start, Families First, et cetera—to bring around the integrated childcare that we know all children need.

So, one of the key questions for me is: are we going to apply the same criteria to voluntary and private sector providers as we will be doing to public sector providers, as long as they obviously meet the early years education offer, which is the two to two and a half hours early years provision? It seems to me that because primary schools are not in a position to deliver the 30 hours, we have to have other organisations that can deliver the hours but also must be able to deliver the quality. So, I'd be keen to hear what you have to say on that.

Diolch. Un o'r gwersi o'r holl sefyllfa hon yw na ddylem ni ailddyfeisio'r olwyn. Dim ond wrth edrych ar y strategaeth yr ydych chi'n ei mabwysiadu ar gyfer cyflawni'r addewid maniffesto hwn, sy'n targedu rhieni sy'n gweithio a chanddyn nhw blant tair a pedair blwydd oed, mae hi'n amlwg bod yn rhaid inni flaenoriaethu'r teuluoedd hynny sy'n dymuno gweithio ond na allant fforddio gweithio ar hyn o bryd, ac a fyddant yn gymwys cyn gynted ag y gallant gyrraedd y niferoedd perthnasol—wyddoch chi, mae ganddyn nhw'r lle ac fe allan nhw dderbyn y lleoliad gwaith. Dyna'r ffordd y mae angen inni wneud hynny.

Roeddwn eisiau edrych ar sut y gallwn ni o bosib gysylltu hyn â chredyd cynhwysol, gan fod llawer o'm teuluoedd i yn gweithio oriau amrywiol, gan gynnwys contractau dim oriau. Un o fanteision damcaniaethol credyd cynhwysol yw y bydd yn cael gwybodaeth amser real ynglŷn â faint y mae rhywun wedi ei ennill yn yr wythnos ddiwethaf ac felly sut y bydd hynny'n effeithio ar faint o arian maen nhw'n gymwys i'w dderbyn. Felly, gallaf weld y manteision o weithio gyda'r gwasanaeth treth a chyllid, ond gallaf hefyd weld y manteision o weithio gyda'r Ganolfan Byd Gwaith, felly rwy'n credu y byddai'n ddefnyddiol egluro pam nad ydych yn meddwl ynghylch hynny.

Rwy'n llwyr ddeall na allwn ni ar hyn o bryd fforddio i wneud yr hyn y mae ar bob un ohonom ni eisiau ei wneud, sef darparu gwasanaeth cyffredinol ar gyfer pob plentyn tair a phedair oed. Ond ymddengys, yn y cyfamser, bod llawer iawn y gallwn ei wneud gan ddefnyddio'r adnoddau presennol. Er enghraifft, pob pum mlynedd mae'n rhaid i awdurdodau lleol ddarparu asesiad digonolrwydd gofal plant, ond dim ond pob pum mlynedd. Felly, yn y cyfamser, nid yw Caerdydd, er enghraifft, yn gwybod faint o aelwydydd sydd â rhieni sy'n gweithio, nid yw'n gwybod faint o blant tair a phedair oed sydd ganddi nac yn gwybod faint o blant tair a phedair oed sy'n mynychu lleoliad gofal plant. Mae hynny, i mi, yn dangos yr angen i fyrddau gwasanaethau cyhoeddus gymryd perchnogaeth o hyn, oherwydd os yw'r gwasanaethau iechyd ac addysg a'r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol yn gweithio gyda'i gilydd gallwn gyfuno'r wybodaeth sydd ym meddiant pawb, i ryw raddau, a byddai hynny yn ein galluogi i gael darlun llawer mwy eglur o ba ofal sydd ar gael ymhle.

Felly, mae gennyf bwyslais penodol yr hoffwn ganolbwyntio arno pan fo Caerdydd yn dechrau gweithredu'r cynnig blynyddoedd cynnar, sef sut yr ydym ni'n mynd i ehangu gofal cofleidiol yn seiliedig ar nifer y plant sydd eisoes yn cael lleoedd meithrin mewn ysgolion cynradd, ond mae'n amlwg na ellir defnyddio'r ystafell lle maen nhw'n cael y gofal blynyddoedd cynnar hwnnw ar gyfer y gofal cofleidiol oherwydd bod carfan arall yn cyrraedd yn y prynhawn.

Pam nad yw hi'n bosib i'r gwasanaethau cymdeithasol ddefnyddio lleoliadau gofal plant blynyddoedd cynnar ar gyfer plant y maen nhw'n pryderu yn eu cylch? Oherwydd gwyddom o dystiolaeth y Sefydliad Polisi Addysg mai dyma'r ffordd orau, os hoffech chi, o guro'r anfantais y caiff rhai plant o'u genedigaeth. Un o'r materion eraill i mi yw mai dim ond un canolfan plant integredig sydd gennym ni yng Nghaerdydd gyfan, sy'n amlwg yn Nhrelái, ac sy'n ganolfan ragoriaeth ar gyfer sicrhau canlyniadau ardderchog ar gyfer pob plentyn, beth bynnag eu hamgylchiadau.

Felly, dyna ddylai ein hamcanion fod, ac mae'n ymddangos i mi, er fy mod yn sylweddoli fod gan y Llywodraeth dim ond arian ar hyn o bryd ar gyfer y rheini sydd â rhieni sy'n gweithio, mae angen hefyd inni ddefnyddio ffrydiau eraill o raglenni—Dechrau'n Deg, Teuluoedd yn Gyntaf, ac ati—i gyflawni'r gofal plant integredig y gŵyr pob un ohonom ni sydd ei angen ar bob plentyn.

Felly, un o'r cwestiynau allweddol i mi yw: a ydym ni'n mynd i defnyddio'r un meini prawf ar gyfer darparwyr y sector preifat a gwirfoddol ag y byddwn yn ei wneud ar gyfer darparwyr y sector cyhoeddus, cyhyd ag y bo nhw yn amlwg yn bodloni'r cynnig addysg blynyddoedd cynnar, sef rhwng dwy a dwy awr a hanner o ddarpariaeth blynyddoedd cynnar? Mae'n ymddangos i mi oherwydd nad yw ysgolion cynradd mewn sefyllfa i ddarparu'r 30 awr, fod yn rhaid inni gael sefydliadau eraill sy'n gallu darparu'r oriau ond rhaid iddynt allu sicrhau ansawdd hefyd. Felly, byddwn yn awyddus i glywed beth sydd gennych chi i'w ddweud yn hynny o beth.

15:45

Thank you, Jenny. A couple of things in response: first of all, in terms of getting this offer to the people who most need it because, curiously, even though it's focused on working parents, there's almost a universality to it as well, in that we're saying that all working parents should, but we know that there are some working parents who